Clock spring ( clockspring ) intermittant airbag light

[rogue1313]

So I started getting the red, dashboard airbag light coming on a few days ago and put up a couple other related posts......but I thought I'd make a more specific post regarding my suspicions that the light is clock spring (clockspring) related.


Here's the deal.....If my steering wheel is slightly turned to the 10 o'clock or 2 o'clock position when I start the car, the red airbag dash light comes on then goes out within a few seconds, as it should. As long as I don't turn the wheel & let it sit, the light will stay off. I've let it sit and idle for up to 10 minutes, and no light.

As soon as I turn the steering wheel to center, straight ahead, 12 o'clock (however you want to say it)......within a second or two, the dashboard driver's airbag light comes on & stays on.

If I cut the engine, turn the wheel back to 10 or 2 o'clock and then restart the car.....the light comes on & goes out as it should. I've done this 'test' several times....left the wheel slightly turned for again, up to 10 minutes.....no light. But each time I turn the wheel back to center, the driver's airbag dash light comes on.

I haven't had a chance to test the clock spring yet......but from some preliminary research, it would seem that there is something going on there.....perhaps a dead spot or break in the wiring (whatever) at the 12 o'clock position. Again, once I noticed/realized that this seemed to be the cause......I've verified it several times over.....the light will come on every time when I perform this procedure.

Has anyone experienced something like this? Does this sound like a clock spring related issue? I've looked at some videos online.....is replacing the clockspring as easy as it looks?

Any feedback would be greatly appreciated......Thanks.

[Chiadog]

I haven't had a chance to test the clock spring yet......but from some preliminary research, it would seem that there is something going on there.....perhaps a dead spot or break in the wiring (whatever) at the 12 o'clock position.

Your reasoning sounds good to me, although I haven't had any experience with a clock spring. Could be a loose connection at spring/steering wheel junction, I'm assuming at 12 position there is no "load" on this connection - meaning the spring is slack at 12 o'clock and becomes tensioned upon steering wheel movement.
Just a guess.

[cq358]

oh,.. you need this guy

[rogue1313]

Yeah, that's what I'm thinking...The clock spring is the electronic link between the steering wheel & the rest of the car. Like I posted earlier, if the steering wheel is slightly turned, the light doesn't stay on......If I let it sit withouth moving the steering wheel, the light is off......But if I turn the steering wheel just slightly so it's at the straight ahead, 12 o'clock position, the airbag light comes on.......I'm pretty sure there's a dead spot or a break in the clock spring wiring.....Unless anyone else has any ideas.


I'm hoping to do some static testing on the clock spring this weekend

[cq358]

when you rotate steering wheel to the "sensitive angle", does the horn work?

[rogue1313]

Just tried it again.....same results as far as the light goes....stays off if the wheel is slightly turned, but then comes on when I turn it to 12 o'clock......AND the horn DOES work, even at the 12 o'clock position. I know I read some other posts that said that the airbag light on AND the horn would not work....so???

But I'm tellin ya, it seems to do it everytime I run my 'test'....The light will stay off when the wheel is at 10 or 2 o'clock......but when you move it to dead ahead, 12 o'clock, the light comes on.......Does it like clockwork (excuse the pun).

From what I've researched about the clock spring, I feel like it has to be the problem......UNLESS maybe there's a break in the wire from the clock spring to the airbag connector? Or a dead spot in the coupling that's only associated with the airbag.

What else could it be? There is something about that movement - steering wheel position that it just doesn't like. If it was something else, then the light would come on no matter where the steering wheel is positioned.

I'm pretty good with working on cars.....been doing what I can to my cars for the last 22+ years.......At the same time, I don't have an intimate knowledge of the clock spring - airbag system.....BUT I do know that the position of the steering wheel is affecting it.

And I mean, if the airbag system were to detect a fault, then that would be stored in the computer & it would remain a fault until it was cleared.....Which means that I shouldn't be able to cut the engine, turn the wheel slightly, and not have the light come on. Right....lets say it was the clock spring & I replaced it.....even though that fixed the problem, if the code wasn't cleared, the dash light would still remain on, even if the initial fault was fixed.

It's very strange.....

[rogue1313]

Yeah, just let it run with the wheel turned again, and not light.....turn the wheel, boom, light comes on. I even tried it by not sitting in the car and just turning the wheel thorugh the window (maybe the seat sensors?)....but didn' make a difference, same result. There has got to be some kind of electrical continuity problem between the steering wheel & the rest of the car.....I can't think of anything else

[cq358]

you might need to do a final check and see if the pig tail wires, orange and yellow for visible damage or does the safety clip are fully plug in? or weird twist.. other than that you need to go to junk yard to get a 07 camry/08+highlander, 09+rav4, 07+tundra clock spring
I have a 09 clock spring that i try to get rid of.

[rogue1313]

Gonna try to take a look at it this weekend (might have to wait until next weekend though...had arthroscopic knee surgery on Wed, so I'm a little less mobile than usual at the moment).......But thanks for the picture & suggestions...I'll post what I find as soon as I can

[rogue1313]

****UPDATE****

Well, GenVibe member cq358 & I worked out a a deal (he's a good guy).....I bought his old clock spring (clockspring) & just finished swapping it out with my suspect one.....And it appears that my less than scientific diagnosis was correct.

With the 'new' clock spring in, the dashboard airbag light is out. Further testing of my 'old' clockspring seems to reveal that there is a dead spot right where I thought it was...and then some. Put the muli-meter probes in the orange airbag connector, and spun the clock spring & it cut in an out around the 12 o'clock position, just like I thought.

Did the same test with the multi-meter on the black horn connector & it was good all the way around........So apparently it is possible for just one of the wires to go bad.


I guess the lesson learned that I can pass on to anyone esle who is having an airbag light problem, is to do a rudimentary test.....try starting the car with the steering wheel in various positions & see if the light goes out or stays on. If it goes out & then comes back on when you move the wheel, then I'd say it's time for a 'new' (or slightly used) clock spring.

BTW, the removal & installation was fairly simple......nothing to be terribly afraid of......If you do it yourself, you might want to pick up a steering wheel puller for $15....it'll save you a ton of hassle.

So, being somewhat superstitious....I'm 99% sure it's all good, but I'll still keep my fingers crossed & knock on some wood for the next hundred miles or so....just to be sure it's all fixed

Special thanks to GenVibe member....cq358.....With a good price on his 'old' clock spring & less than an hour of DIY work, I probably saved myself $400+

Alright then, here's to hopefully another 75k miles on the 'new clockspring'

[cq358]

rouge, I am glad everything went out very well,I know you had been waiting anxiously for it to be arrived and now the repair is a success.

Genvibe is a very good forum for all the Vibe owners out there sharing information to each other.

One more bonus, by remove and reinstall my steering wheel last year, I believe by torquing and re-seat the steering wheel actually cured the steering shaft popping noise.

[TheMaskedMan]

I have the same problem and did the same tests as rogue1313 in my 09 Vibe. The price for a new GM clockspring is ridiculous, so are there any compatible Toyota part numbers? I have a 1.8 Auto with cruise control. I read above that the 09+ RAV4 clockspring is similar, so would this work:

http://www.ebay.ca/itm/84306-22010-Bran ... ea&vxp=mtr" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Thanks

[TheMaskedMan]

bump

[rogue1313]

Wish I could help with the part numbers cross indexing, but sorry....I just don't know. My Vibe doesn't have any controls on the steering wheel or cruise control, so all I had were the two connectors...one for the horn & one for the airbag......I think if you have any steering wheel controls, you need a different clockspring. Anyway, I wish you luck on the search.


On another note.....Did you do the same thing I did with the position of the steering wheel & starting the car & moving it to see if the light came back on? Just curious if my down and dirty test helped someone with the same issue.

I stumbled across it myself.....Before I figured it out, I was calling around and shops wanted $90 just to do a diagnosis (you need a special OBD 2 reader for airbags......I just have a standard one).....I was this close to coughing up the money when I just happened to notice that the light was staying off some times & coming on other times......Then one time when it stayed off for several minutes, I turned the wheel & whatta ya know....it comes back on.

That got the old hamster on the wheel & I started the process of starting the car with the steering wheel in different positions......and after I could replicate it many (many) times, I thought it HAD to be the clock spring......I couldn't see any other reason for it. I still wasn't 100% sure until I swapped it out (and even then I kept my fingers crossed for several days).....but it's been working fine ever since.

I mean with the used part & doing it myself, I really did save myself $400+ on the deal.......I have to admit, I'm still pretty darn proud of that nice piece of trouble shooting....the old brain still has a few good cells firing off in there

[TheMaskedMan]

I can confirm Toyota part #84306-0E010 works on my 2009 Pontiac Vibe without steering wheel controls. The clockspring was slightly different than the one that came with it as it had an extra connector. I assume this could be for a steering wheel control plug.

I narrowed it down to my clockspring in a similar fashion. My SRS light would disappear when turning the car on with the steering wheel hard to the left. I also checked the diagnostic flash code and it confirmed the clockspring. Instructions for doing that can be found here: http://www.toyotanation.com/forum/61-2n ... ost3464823

My car was throwing code 51 - Here is a video of my car showing the diagnostic flash code: http://youtu.be/W_kG88uN05A