Transmission flush/service/replacement question

[LavaIlliniVibe]

Hi All, Thank you in advance for reading this and any advice you can give... please forgive me for not being an auto mechanic or expert, just a Vibe owner and lover! That's why I am asking you all! Here's the story... I took my 2004 Vibe (automatic transmission, 115,000 miles) in for an oil change at a GM dealership and they said the transmission fluid was "dirty"--they showed me a swab of it. It was brown... they said they they had a machine that would "flush" the transmission fluid out, plus all of the gunk and everything in there. They quoted me a price of $162. I got a second opinion at an independent auto mechanic... they said... if I am not experiencing any problems, they simply drain the fluid, and put in new fluid and a filter. They said that if I am not experiencing any problems (I am not) then if it is "flushed" it could actually cause problems from the gunk getting loosened and all and clogging or something like that. They quoted me a price of $119.The money is NOT the issue-- I would do anything for my Vibe! I just want to do the right thing!What do you think/recommend/advise? Thank you so much for your time and response. I have been a diligent owner, done all recommended maintenance of my Vibe, want to drive it forever, love it dearly, and have all of my maintenance record documented and recorded. I look forward to your advice and expertise!

[djkeev]

This topic has been covered a LOT. You might take a minute and search for some of them.Go give that guy at the 2nd shop a BIG hug!! Let him work on your car for he is honest and spoke the truth to you.There is a "FLUSH" system where they run cleaners, sometimes backwards, to supposedly wash out all of the contaminants. Sadly this often loosens cake on particles and leaves them behind to do damage. History shows that both engine and transmission flushes do indeed create problems that were not there beforehand.There is also a fluid EXCHANGE machine. This is like a complete blood transfusion where new transmission fluid is pumped into the unit and the old fluid is removed. This continues until the removed fluid is new clean fluid. Most often they tap into the cooler lines to swap out the oil. This machine is effective and does no harm IF and a very big IF the trans oil used is indeed compatible with Toyota Type IV fluids. Not a popular fluid so many of these machines run generic one size fits all transmission oil. Don't use these generic oils, your car needs what Toyota recommends and designed the unit to use.ORYou can do as this honest shop said, drain and fill. If you drop the pan you'll get out about 4.3 qts leaving a number of qts behind. Statistically you need to change the oil 3 times to remove most of the old oil.The filter is simply a metal screen, no filter to speak of, keeps out chunks, not dirt.Personally, I drain and fill my trans about every 3rd engine oil change. The 100,000 mile interval recommended is WAY too long and the oil gets gross!Good luck, let us know what you do.Dave

[jake75]

I understand how engine oil gets "used up" as it is exposed to the products of combustion etc. But how does transmission fluid get dirty? I understand that over a long period of time it could break down., but how does transmission fluid (oil) get so dirty it needs to be replaced such as every third oil change? I have not owned a car longer than about 35,000 miles in a long time but being retired I may want to keep my 2009 Vibe for awhile so I am curious. [Though at 13,000 miles in 45 months I may never need to be concerned about changing the transmission fluid.]

[djkeev]

Quote, originally posted by jake75 »I understand how engine oil gets "used up" as it is exposed to the products of combustion etc. But how does transmission fluid get dirty? I understand that over a long period of time it could break down., but how does transmission fluid (oil) get so dirty it needs to be replaced such as every third oil change? I have not owned a car longer than about 35,000 miles in a long time but being retired I may want to keep my 2009 Vibe for awhile so I am curious. [Though at 13,000 miles in 45 months I may never need to be concerned about changing the transmission fluid.] A transmission is a very harsh place to be! Many spinning components at extremely high RPM's. A lot of Friction going on continuously, clutch packs, torque converter, etc. All of this friction creates a tremendous amount of heat, heat is a major enemy of oil, any oil. While transmission oil is formulated to withstand this tough life, it does indeed break down and it also gets burned. Clutches wear and deposit the residue into the oil. These transmissions have no filter so all of that wear residue just keeps circulating as you drive. If you drive hard, the wear and heat is more severe.If I were an oil and got to choose where I lubricated, I would choose a simple internal combustion engine over an automatic transmission any day! I much cooler and gentler life!When you pull the transmission drain plug you are only draining about 3.8 qts of oil or so, a small percentage of the whole. By removing this bit of used oil and adding new, you are replenishing the various additives designed into the oil and removing a portion of the worn out oil.Statistically (using pool industry filter statistics on circulation and filtration), after 3 changes, the vast majority has been replaced. Without the special machine to replace all of the oil in one operation, or being willing to spend the $$ to pay someone who has the machine, this is the best alternative available to the self servicing owner.B changing the oil so frequently I hope to head off any transmission problems, yes I am spending a few dollars every 3rd oil change on fluids but it is a small cost for the peace of mind it gives me. Also three oil changes for me is 20 - 25,000 miles of driving. Really not as frequent as one would think. I've used nothing by quality synthetic motor oil since the car was new so I generally go 7,000 miles more or less between oil changes. I've done it at 5,000 and ... ooops..... I've slid to about 10,000 on occasion. This is all a lot of personal choice based upon factual information that is readily available, experience in the automotive field and doing what makes me comfortable.BTW, even if you don't drive a lot. Oils should be changed on a time basis instead of a mileage basis. Condensation build up in the lubricants is a very serious matter that can cause lubrication issues and thus wear. Oil doesn't last forever just sitting in a car. It is even said that oil simply stored for a long time period should not be used as well.Hope that helps explain why I do what I do with my oils.Dave

[lovemyraffe]

I find a flush to be unnecessary. A drain & fill is sufficient for 99% of all drivers on the road.

[LavaIlliniVibe]

Dear djkeev, Thank you so much for your time and expertise. I truly appreciate your thorough explanation and rationale. I apologize for not investigating the forum more for an answer. I plan to make an appointment with the independent mechanic this week for a draining of the transmission fluid, and I will try to remember to post how it all goes. I have never ever kept a car as long as my Vibe, and I want to do whatever I can to keep him running well. Thank you to everyone who read or reads this question, and if anyone else has any other advise for my little Vibe's transmission fluid, feel free to chime in.Thank you again very much! This Forum is wonderful!!!! Keep on Vibin'!!!

[journeyforce]

As has been said a flush is bad at that mileage. A fluid exchange is a doable proposition and if done correctly is safe. But a drain and refill is good enough.But make sure the shop doing that is using the correct fluid. If you can buy the fluid at the dealer before hand and bring it in to them that would be good because you know it is the correct fluidGood luck

[Beer Belly]

You're pretty lucky to have that done for so cheap.The dealership here would cost $275 to have that done.The cheapest place i've found (and had it done last weekend) was $247. I checked about 5 or 6 different places.Count yourself lucky, it's less than half of what I had to pay.

[LavaIlliniVibe]

I had my Vibe's transmission drained and refilled. It took about an hour and everything seems to be fine. Thank you again for all of your expertise and assistance in this matter, I truly appreciate your help!!!!! Keep on Vibin'!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[jkm311]

What did you end up paying, if I might ask? Did you take it to a Toyota dealer?

[LavaIlliniVibe]

Hello, I paid $119 and I took it to an independent mechanic shop. I made sure they had the correct Toyota transmission fluid. My little Vibe is running well--he was before he had it done, as well. His transmission fluid was just dirty! Not now!Keep on Vibin'!!!!!!!!!!!