cruise control problem action

campb292 · Post by **campb292** » Sat Sep 22, 2007 11:40 pm

INTROI have been in correspondance with GM / Pontiac for several months working on a resolution to the Vibe cruise control multi-downshift issue. A general history of this problem can be found at the threads I will copy to the bottom of this post. A brief summary is as follows:THE PROBLEMWhen the 2006 Vibe (base automatic trans + other model years) is travelling in cruise with overdrive on, and reaches a hill, in many situations the car will downshift once followed by a second downshift to gain power to climb the hill. This second downshift bumps the RPM up to nearly redline - destroying fuel economy and your ears, along with a bit of your Vibe pride. This could be considered normal vehicle operation as many dealers would suggest; however, if in the same situation with cruise disengaged, it is possible to climb the same hill without a downshift at all, or at the very most just a single downshift. There is no need for the second downshift in cruise. What this poses is a need to reconfigure the way cruise reacts to certain driving conditions. In talking with GM / Pontiac, I have gotten them to acknowlege that it is actually a problem. However, they will not allocate techs to devise a correction to the PCM/ECM as too few Vibe owners have complained of the problem. This suggests that others have complained as I did, but not many. TAKE ACTIONWhat I want is for other Vibe owners, who are concerned and interested in this problem, to compose a letter that addresses your experiences with this problem. I want your to either postal mail or email the letter to me so I can send them all together to my contact at GM. I have attached a sample letter I used in talks with Pontiac / GM last summer. campb292@yahoo.comR Campbell4051 Otuna DrDorr, MI 49323

Attached files pontiacletter.doc (36 KB)

campb292 · Post by **campb292** » Sat Sep 22, 2007 11:41 pm

The treads I promised but forgot to post http://forums.genvibe.com/zerothread?id ... d?id=17757

campb292 · Post by **campb292** » Sat Sep 22, 2007 11:42 pm

INTROI have been in correspondance with GM / Pontiac for several months working on a resolution to the Vibe cruise control multi-downshift issue. A general history of this problem can be found at the threads I will copy to the bottom of this post. A brief summary is as follows:THE PROBLEMWhen the 2006 Vibe (base automatic trans + other model years) is travelling in cruise with overdrive on, and reaches a hill, in many situations the car will downshift once followed by a second downshift to gain power to climb the hill. This second downshift bumps the RPM up to nearly redline - destroying fuel economy and your ears, along with a bit of your Vibe pride. This could be considered normal vehicle operation as many dealers would suggest; however, if in the same situation with cruise disengaged, it is possible to climb the same hill without a downshift at all, or at the very most just a single downshift. There is no need for the second downshift in cruise. What this poses is a need to reconfigure the way cruise reacts to certain driving conditions. In talking with GM / Pontiac, I have gotten them to acknowlege that it is actually a problem. However, they will not allocate techs to devise a correction to the PCM/ECM as too few Vibe owners have complained of the problem. This suggests that others have complained as I did, but not many. TAKE ACTIONWhat I want is for other Vibe owners, who are concerned and interested in this problem, to compose a letter that addresses your experiences with this problem. I want your to either postal mail or email the letter to me so I can send them all together to my contact at GM. I have attached a sample letter I used in talks with Pontiac / GM last summer. campb292@yahoo.comR Campbell4051 Otuna DrDorr, MI 49323http://forums.genvibe.com/zerothread?id=25489http://forums.genvibe.com/zerothread?id=18274http://forums.genvibe.com/zerothread?id=18494http://forums.genvibe.com/zerothread?id=17757

366264=12364-pontiacletter.doc

Petrucci914 · Post by **Petrucci914** » Sun Sep 23, 2007 12:00 am

Welcome to the forum. Unfortunately, I don't find this as a problem. It is to be expected. If it's a small hill I understand the single downshift but if it s a steep hill I can imagine it almost redlining. The ECM has no idea of the steepness of the hill and just tries to guess the amount of power needed to keep the speed. These are small 4-cylinder engines and do not do that well on hills unless you're sporting a hefty performance upgrade. If I have the cruise on and I'm approaching the hill I just get it some gass so it won't downshift. I've done this with all automatic cars I've drivin...........it's not a pontiac/toyota issue........it's an automatic/ecm issue. So I would just get used to it.

keithvibe · Post by **keithvibe** » Sun Sep 23, 2007 12:09 am

i agree with you and was shocked at the same time the first time the cruse did this to me. I did do a few things to help the matter. One I added a CAI... that helped a lot. I noticed prier to installing the CAI on certain hills the car would act like you have decribed. After installing it, it no longer did the second down shift "most of the time" The second thing I did, which I am suprised GM didn't suggest.. LOL is to simply turn off the cruise control when you see a steep hill coming and manually control the speed.

ragingfish · Post by **ragingfish** » Sun Sep 23, 2007 1:36 am

it is not necessary to post the same thread in multiple forums.

gr8vibe · Post by **gr8vibe** » Sun Sep 23, 2007 1:51 am

SRLSY! ive seen this same thing like 4 other times.and besides, I was told NEVER to use cruise control on hills, it makes your engine work harder than just manually depressing the pedal yourself. sounds like someone has a case of the lazies!

djb383 · Post by **djb383** » Sun Sep 23, 2007 3:00 am

Quote, originally posted by rch2005 »...........I was told NEVER to use cruise control on hills, it makes your engine work harder than just manually depressing the pedal yourself......................and how can using cruise control possibly make the engine work harder?

djb383 · Post by **djb383** » Sun Sep 23, 2007 3:20 am

The first down shift is not really a down shift, it's the lock-up torque converter unlocking. The next down shift is from 4th to 3rd which brings the rpms up to 4000-4500, at 70 mph. That's far from redline but still gets your attention when it occurs. I also think a simple reprogram could be done to make it somewhat less abrupt.

campb292 · Post by **campb292** » Sun Sep 23, 2007 5:08 am

"So I would just get used to it" is a very American response to a problem... probably part of why 70's and 80's technology still prevails in most of the big three lines and sends many other makes sailing past. I am trying to get a fix to a problem instead of the normal American "oh well shucks" sort of response. If it can be done without cruise, it can be done with cruise - if the programming is proper. Thanks to the 4 of you who sent me email letters today!

Petrucci914 · Post by **Petrucci914** » Sun Sep 23, 2007 5:13 am

Don't get me started with American problems, I now there are many but there are bigger things to deal with out there. A 4 cylinder plus a hill does not equate to a happy experience. Sure, they could probably do a reprogram to make it a little less drastic, or you can extend your right foot a few inches and press down on a pedal. Is a recall, which would cost the companies probably millions of dollars, not to mention the R&D, worth it? It's not going to happen. Know your vehicle and it'll respond in a satisfactory way.

dianebrat · Post by **dianebrat** » Sun Sep 23, 2007 5:55 am

Quote, originally posted by campb292 Â»"So I would just get used to it" is a very American response to a problem... [rant]As is "let someone else do the work for me" and "who can I sue?" and "who can I blame?"I see it being about personal responsibility, yes, the cruise control does not always behave as you would, and at times in a bit disconcerting manner, but if you know it does it once, you can then take personal responsibility and not use the cruise control in a situation like this.I can also say that the behavior of the cruise control changes on the load within the car, and that also speaks to my personal responsibility to compensate for that and maybe not use the cruise control in those situations.[/rant]Diane

gr8vibe · Post by **gr8vibe** » Sun Sep 23, 2007 6:53 am

you missunderstood and read it wrong, using CC going UP A HILL i heard makes it work harder. i personally do not do this because I dont know if thats true or not.please read fully before asking! kthxbye

djb383 · Post by **djb383** » Sun Sep 23, 2007 7:41 am

It's just not true.........total myth.

prathman · Post by **prathman** » Sun Sep 23, 2007 8:17 am

Quote, originally posted by djb383 »...and how can using cruise control possibly make the engine work harder? Well, the behavior described in the original post where the CC downshifts twice, once rather abruptly, and gets the engine up near redline doesn't sound particularly easy on either the engine or the transmission. Driving without CC, many drivers will choose not to force a downshift by flooring the gas pedal, but will instead let the car slow down a bit, especially if near the crest of the hill. Unlike the driver, the CC can't anticipate what's coming up so it will do whatever's needed to maintain the set speed even if the crest of the hill is only a few seconds away and it would make more sense to stay in the same gear and let the speed drop by a mph or two if necessary.

jake75 · Post by **jake75** » Sun Sep 23, 2007 8:53 am

In traveling the West Virginia Turnpike between Charleston and Virginia in the Vibe I have noticed this problem and decided not to use the cruise control in the really hilly areas. All that downshifting makes me nervous. My V-6 T&C does not seem to have the same problem - at least not nearly to the same extent.

ragingfish · Post by **ragingfish** » Sun Sep 23, 2007 1:38 pm

Quote, originally posted by campb292 Â»"So I would just get used to it" is a very American response to a problem... probably part of why 70's and 80's technology still prevails in most of the big three lines and sends many other makes sailing past. I am trying to get a fix to a problem instead of the normal American "oh well shucks" sort of response. If it can be done without cruise, it can be done with cruise - if the programming is proper. Thanks to the 4 of you who sent me email letters today! First of all, GM has some of the leading technology among all major brands.Second, the CC issue here is TOYOTA equipment. So don't sit there and say it's an american make issue when you're driving a damn toyota.AND STOP POSTING THIS DAMN THING IN SO MANY DIFFERENT FORUMS.

Petrucci914 · Post by **Petrucci914** » Sun Sep 23, 2007 10:50 pm

He was actually referring to my comment as being a typical American answer. He wasn't talking about the Vibe being American and playing them for it. He knows it's a Toyota project. But I'm not sure I agree with you that GM is in the lead as far as technology, but I digress.

ragingfish · Post by **ragingfish** » Mon Sep 24, 2007 11:03 am

Quote, originally posted by Petrucci914 Â»But I'm not sure I agree with you that GM is in the lead as far as technology, but I digress.Read again. I didn't say the lead in technology. I said they have some of the leading tech among major brands.

ControlFreak · Post by **ControlFreak** » Sat Apr 05, 2008 11:54 am

Hi,I know this is an older post , but what is a CAI?Thanks

lovemyraffe · Post by **lovemyraffe** » Sat Apr 05, 2008 12:11 pm

Cold Air Intake

ControlFreak · Post by **ControlFreak** » Thu Apr 10, 2008 12:16 pm

Thanks for the reply.Is there a thread that deals with how to go about adding it as described earlier in this thread?