Camshafts...?

[Evanshall]

i will admidt im new to the whole actually working on cars thing, i have done next to nothing myself, but back when i used to hang out with some Muscle car guys(actually 60s-70s cars) i remember the one super trick up your sleeve, and kinda last mod to install (besides forced induction if you really wanted to go that far) was a awesome camshaft, although there tricky as hell to tune, and can be worthless unless you already have other modifications installed, are camshafts still all they used to bei remeber some crazy statistic on Ford Small block(like old ones, 351 windsor i think) were with all the modifications and a stock camshaft it only got about 60% the power it got when they put in the new high liftin camshaft,now i am NEW to this stuff, so all i wanna know is if camshafts can still be a awesome modification, although i dought theres really any insane cams out for the 2ZZlike there were for the 351 i was speaking of, still can they be the do or die mod?

[joatmon]

I don't know how that would work in these cars. Since so much of the engine parameters are controlled by the computer, I bet you would need to tune the program to take advantage of a new cam. Not like the old days where you adjusted the timing by rotating the distributor.

[savedbyzero]

No cams for the 2ZZ, yet. With the introduction of the Lotus Elise in the States, there could be some options popping up, but you can bet on paying a pretty penny for them.I believe Comp Cams was supposedly developing cams for the 2ZZ, but that has been said for like 3 yrs. now...the dual profile of the cam makes it a very tricky thing to do.

[Evanshall]

prety penny or not, if they do the actual job then there well worth it, ty for info as follows

[futseal04]

Probably wouldn't need new cams for the 2ZZ unless you wanted one specifically tuned for forced induction. New engines are tuned for emissions and reliablility, so short duration and lift are the norm. When you keep the valve open longer and sooner/later, then you increase power. That is what L in VVTi-L does. Before you "hit lift", the cam lobes that are short duration are in play, helping low speed air flow and thus torque. After that point (6000RPM) the cam slides long ways for a second set of cam lobes that have a higher lift (more in and out) and duration (open longer).So you really have the best of both worlds here. Keep in mind that replacing a traditional muscle car cam is relatively easy (traditional being the OHV set up). There is one cam to install and time. With our motors, there are 2 cams to install and time. So me personally, unless i decide to professionally drag race my Vibe, I am going to stick with the stock cams........Hope this helps!

[Evanshall]

you have no idea how cool that description is, to think the cam can actually do that, now i feel more like modding this guy then ever

[futseal04]

Glad you liked it!

[pa-vibe]

goto: http://www.everythingcelica.co....html to see a little animation clip of how it works, pretty cool

[pa-vibe]

sorry that is not the site meant to attach, i will attach the site with animation once I find it

[champcaracing]

the cam does not move its the locking pin in the rocker arms that moveinto the locked position with oil pressure. this locks the arm and the "big lobe" takes over.

[futseal04]

Quote, originally posted by champcaracing »the cam does not move its the locking pin in the rocker arms that moveinto the locked position with oil pressure. this locks the arm and the "big lobe" takes over.Honda's move the cam......i assumed the VVTi-L operated the same way

[Evanshall]

Quote, originally posted by champcaracing »the cam does not move its the locking pin in the rocker arms that moveinto the locked position with oil pressure. this locks the arm and the "big lobe" takes over.dosnt mean its still not badass i noticed they have high performance camshafts for Celicas, i think there basic GT models with VVT but still, thats closer then no camshaftsi know alot of the larger stuff woudnt fit(exhaust, intake, headers), but wouldnt a Celica camshaft fit?

[Smokin' Rubber]

here are cam shafts for a celica altho I don't know if its for the 1zz or 2zzhttp://www.hopupracing.com/hkscatoce.html

[goodvibe]

Neither. Older celicas with different motors. There isn't much a new cam would help in a 2zz daily driver. You could change the low cam for higher peak power to transition smoothly to the high cam at 6400 rpm where it start to pull harder and get a strong motor for racing above 5k but the high cam is already a racing profile and you'll give away tow torque with any power improvement in the low cam. Finding a easy way to raise the rev limiter to 8600 rpm or so would do us more good.

[Evanshall]

the fact we can get up to 8400 RPMs is good enouph in my opinoin but yah anyways, i still think that there are thins they could do to make a better racing type camshaft, but im not worried right now, theres alot of good parts and the cam is a great cam already in the 2ZZ,i just dont think its top top end, but if it was i probably couldnt afford it anyways, its just i remember the insanly good things cams used to be able to do!

[goodvibe]

Hotter cams usually means more revs to make power if the engine can take it. It's a small motor and the power has to come from somewhere. There's no majic cam that makes power for free and our cars would make more power at 8600 rpm than at the 6400 rpm you might hit on a quick shift. With better breathing, the HP barely drops after the 7600 hp peak. If you want to go fast, you need to keep it on song and this would be the best way to do it. The most advanced motors (F1) don't have cams, are totally variable, and use pneumatics to run the valves. They use whatever cam timing they want by changing the valve actuation program but still need to rev to about 20k to stay competative. Keeping a small n/a motor effecient at high revs is how you make power. That's a 2zz. It's been tested to 9k so 8600 would be no problem. When those old muscle cars got modified with cams they at least got stronger valve springs so that the motor could handle the higher revs required to make more power. The 2zz high cam is already hotter (more overlap) than any streetable muscle car cam. It doesn't 'get on the cam' untill after 6400 rpm. Staying above this point and in the power band is what you would like to do if possible. Hotter cam would narrow the powerband, raising the rev limit would widen it. A 302 V8 motor would have to make 500 HP to match the 2zz in a hp vs displacement contest.

[Evanshall]

thank you my good sir

[MadBill]

Good info goodvibe, except that F1 engines do use camshafts. The pneumatic system just replaces the valve springs.

[goodvibe]

Really, I just assumed them to be superfluous. It might have something to do with their regulations. Thanks for the correction.

[savedbyzero]

They actaully have Flux Capacitors. They're just hidden really well.

[Smokin' Rubber]

Hehe anyone got any suggestions as to what time we should go?