Questions about stock head units

themrfreeze · Post by **themrfreeze** » Thu Mar 25, 2004 3:11 am

Hi all.A couple of question about the stock GM head units that I'm hoping somebody could answer.My spiffy brand new Vibe came with the single-CD head unit, and I'm already itching to upgrade (had a 6-disc changer in my last car). Does anybody know if:1) The single-CD head unit can just be pulled out and replaced with the standard Delco 6-disc in-dash changer that many of their vehicles are using without having to do any wiring modifications?2) If the head units lose power, is there a security code that has to be entered into the radio for it to work again? I see that my HU had a blinking "security" light, but as I have no security system, I don't know if that light is just bogus or actually does something. I wasn't made aware of any radio security codes when I took delivery of the vehicle.3) Are the Delco 6-disc changers any good to begin with? I've installed a number of aftermarket systems in my previous cars, but in all honesty just don't want to deal with installing a big aftermarket system. I'd much prefer to have some sort of in-dash changer and be done with it, but I can't seem to find any aftermarket in-dash changers.Thanks much!

ragingfish · Post by **ragingfish** » Thu Mar 25, 2004 3:14 am

Quote, originally posted by themrfreeze Â»Hi all.A couple of question about the stock GM head units that I'm hoping somebody could answer.My spiffy brand new Vibe came with the single-CD head unit, and I'm already itching to upgrade (had a 6-disc changer in my last car). Does anybody know if:1) The single-CD head unit can just be pulled out and replaced with the standard Delco 6-disc in-dash changer that many of their vehicles are using without having to do any wiring modifications?Yes, plug and play! Two wire harnesses and the antenna are all that get connected. I'd recommend sticking with a 6 disc from a Vibe or Matrix. I hear that other model cars use a different electronics system than ours which may result in radios from Sunfires and the like not working. Jahntassa can confirm for sure I imagine though...Quote Â»2) If the head units lose power, is there a security code that has to be entered into the radio for it to work again? I see that my HU had a blinking "security" light, but as I have no security system, I don't know if that light is just bogus or actually does something. I wasn't made aware of any radio security codes when I took delivery of the vehicle.Non-functional, purely decorative. No fear, no code.Quote Â»3) Are the Delco 6-disc changers any good to begin with? I've installed a number of aftermarket systems in my previous cars, but in all honesty just don't want to deal with installing a big aftermarket system. I'd much prefer to have some sort of in-dash changer and be done with it, but I can't seem to find any aftermarket in-dash changers.I know for a fact VibeChick and AtWork both have 6 disc changers...might wanna IM one of them and ask them their opinion...last I checked, VibeChick is lovin hers...

Jahntassa · Post by **Jahntassa** » Thu Mar 25, 2004 7:30 am

Yeah, definitely try to find a Vibe/Matrix. Most other GM vehicles are using the GM Databus system which will NOT work with the Vibe.

themrfreeze · Post by **themrfreeze** » Thu Mar 25, 2004 9:40 am

Interesting. I've seen a few 6-disc changers available on eBay that appear to have the same exact connectors on them as the single-CD unit that comes with the Matrix. Kinda hard to believe that if GM had different electrical systems that required different radio designs, they'd use the same exact connectors on all of the radios.I don't suppose anybody knows the GM/Delco part number for the 6-disc changer for the Vibe???Thanks much!Chris

scherry2 · Post by **scherry2** » Thu Mar 25, 2004 10:00 am

88972142 w/CD changer88972141 w/o CD changer

Jahntassa · Post by **Jahntassa** » Thu Mar 25, 2004 10:04 am

All the newer GMs use the same connector, but the pins aren't the same. The Matrix uses the same connector as well..part of the deal, I guess.Still, the newer true GM vehicles mostly use the GM Databus to communicate the door being open, switching the radio on, and soforth..Pretty much the only difference between the Vibe GM connector and the GM connector is that the Vibe has switched power, and the other ones have a seperate pair of pins for the Databus...the rest of it, constant power, ground, and speaker wires, are usually the same.

themrfreeze · Post by **themrfreeze** » Thu Mar 25, 2004 11:18 am

Thanks for the info.....this is getting interesting.So if I understand what you're saying, the harness in the Vibe is the same as that in Databus-equipped cars when it comes to the locations of the constant power, ground, and speaker wires. However, the Vibe has a regular switched power line, while other cars use Databus signals on some of the pins. My thought here is that if the pins used for constant power aren't the same as those used by Databus, then it's entirely possible that the radio was designed to be used in ALL GM cars. If it senses Databus, it works with it. If no signals on the Databus pins, it defaults to working with switched power. Hmmm, I need to see scrounge up some wiring diagrams.

ragingfish · Post by **ragingfish** » Thu Mar 25, 2004 12:15 pm

I highly doubt that these radios are that advanced or intricate.Keep in mind, other radios have Theftlock, whereas ours does not. The flashing light is a decoy.I sense these are specially designed radios for this particular implementation.Just a SITD though.

Jahntassa · Post by **Jahntassa** » Thu Mar 25, 2004 2:03 pm

Exactly, their idea is to produce a radio that'll work with certain things. Cheaper to produce a radio without the databus for the Matrix/Vibe than to give the databus system to a Toyota designed car..I don't think there're any radios that'll automatically switch between the two. Their idea being that a specific radio will only be for specific cars...

themrfreeze · Post by **themrfreeze** » Thu Mar 25, 2004 10:04 pm

Sigh....maybe I'll just go the aftermarket route and save myself the trouble. Should probably be pretty easy, given the "standardness" of the Vibe's radio system.Thanks for all the info guys!Chris

Jahntassa · Post by **Jahntassa** » Thu Mar 25, 2004 11:09 pm

I think there're a few aftermarket in-dash CD Changers...you might have to look at some of the more "offbeat" brands like Eclipse or Nakamichi. Don't remember if Blaupunkt had one or not... Another idea is to get an MP3 cd reciever, so you can burn a whole bunch of MP3s to a disc, and use it that way. Pioneer, Alpine, Panasonic, almost every manufacturer makes one. Sony and Pioneer even have units with harddrives built in, so you can just load your MP3 collection right onto the headunit..

themrfreeze · Post by **themrfreeze** » Fri Mar 26, 2004 10:05 am

Looks like Nakamichi is the only company still making an in-dash CD changer....for a cool $450-$500 (and I'm sure the sound quality is worth the asking price). Dunno if I'd want to drive $2 speakers with a $500 head unit. However, after spending the cash on the Vibe, I don't think the wife would appreciate another $500 for a new head unit (and the inevitable extra couple hundred for new speakers.)Still, I was hoping for a factory changer, simply because I can probably get it cheaper and it wouldn't be a target for theives like an aftermarket system (be it the Nakamichi, or an MP3 CD player, or a hard-drive based unit). Maybe I'll just have to keep an eye out for a good deal on an OEM changer.

ZubenElGenubi · Post by **ZubenElGenubi** » Tue Apr 27, 2004 3:25 am

Expanding on themrfreeze's questions...Okay, you can swap a 6-CD changer for the single-CD unit. What if you have XM installed? Will the new head unit recognize the XM and will the Radio ID remain unaffected?-Glenn

johnsoax · Post by **johnsoax** » Tue Apr 27, 2004 6:45 am

You would have to use a newer 6-disc changer. A 2003 would not work in this case. I assume that the "Radio ID" is in the XM modual in the back, not in the head unit.

Jahntassa · Post by **Jahntassa** » Tue Apr 27, 2004 11:30 am

The Radio ID is in the XM module itself, yes, but the Module is tied into the VIN for the car. Part of the blasted DataBus or something. You'd need to get a dealership to reset the XM unit if that were the case. And not all dealers have the knowledge, or desire to do it.

johnsoax · Post by **johnsoax** » Thu Apr 29, 2004 2:08 am

Quote, originally posted by Jahntassa Â»The Radio ID is in the XM module itself, yes, but the Module is tied into the VIN for the car. Part of the blasted DataBus or something. Maybe that is why my little pieced together thing won't work???

Stang2Vibe · Post by **Stang2Vibe** » Thu Apr 29, 2004 3:16 pm

Quote, originally posted by ragingfish Â»I know for a fact VibeChick and AtWork both have 6 disc changers...might wanna IM one of them and ask them their opinion...last I checked, VibeChick is lovin hers...I have one in mine and I really like it. My only complaint is that I feel that it is a bit slow to load and change discs, but I really don't have anything to compare it to.

kostby · Post by **kostby** » Thu Apr 29, 2004 4:16 pm

I have an '03 with the factory Delco 6-disc changer and the Moon & Tunes package, so it has the 'white noise' problem. (Do a Search to find threads in the audio forum) The noise is coming in the amp, not the changer, from what I've read, so I don't know if they changed anything in the changer related to white noise for '04 or not.The changer is, as mentioned, somewhat slow and noisy to load and change discs, but it plays CD's and CD-Rs well and lets you create a songlist of up to 20 selections that span up to 6 discs. The '03 Vibe owner's manual has the 6-disc operation described beginning on page 3-15.I've purposely not attached printed labels on the CD-R's I burn, using a Sharpie instead. I'm figuring that printed labels might come loose inside the changer during the heat of summer, although I haven't read of any mishaps yet.6-disc changers are available on ebaymotors.com on a regular basis. Watch there for a week or two, and you'll probably find one. The last one I saw went for just over US$100.BTW, I don't know if you're into audio cassettes anymore, but Toyota offers a CD/Cassette/AM/FM option in the Matrix.

Jahntassa · Post by **Jahntassa** » Thu Apr 29, 2004 10:12 pm

Quote, originally posted by kostby Â»I've purposely not attached printed labels on the CD-R's I burn, using a Sharpie instead. I'm figuring that printed labels might come loose inside the changer during the heat of summer, although I haven't read of any mishaps yet.Good idea. One of the guys at work let his girlfriend drive his new Acura with a 6-disc. She put in one of her burned CDs with a label on it, and it completely jammed the mechanism. Some manufacturers ship the car with a label on the CD slot saying "Do NOT use CD-R labels in this unit", simply because of it.

ragingfish · Post by **ragingfish** » Thu Apr 29, 2004 11:06 pm

Or get this:http://www.staples.com/Catalog...16093It thermally prints the cd information right onto the disc surface...won't rub or smear off, and looks neater than handwriting.I know a guy who has it, the final product is kickass!

Jahntassa · Post by **Jahntassa** » Fri Apr 30, 2004 12:24 am

You know two guys that have it. I love my Casio! You need to make sure you find discs that are totally blank, none of the raised stuff they put on them nowadays..And buy extra ink cartridges, they last about 20-30 discs. It's not really ink, more of a ribbon that's heat-transferred.

LT4transam · Post by **LT4transam** » Thu May 13, 2004 7:34 am

You can just swap the head units out . The pin outs in the wiring connectors are exactly the same for the UC1 (single disc) and UC6(6-disc) head units . You can get the 6-disc radio fairly cheap , I just got one on ebay for $96 from a 03 matrix . A good way to distinguish to make for sure your getting a vibe/matrix head unit is , the vibe/matrix head units are the ONLY gm radio's where the face plate AND buttons ebony dark gray . The GM databus radios , which "appear" to be same , either have light grey typical pontiac buttons oooooooor are ALL true black like in the new Grand prix's and GM trucks . Ive had both vibe radios and GM data bus radios tore completely apart . All the circuitry is identical between them , the only difference is the modules on the circuit board which turn the radio on . Vibe accepts 12volt switched and the data bus radios take a signal from the PCM . The Vibe radio even has outputs for steering wheel radio controls ( Pin A6 and A7 ) even though vibes dont even offer them . Im using a vibe head unit and amp in my 95 trans am and was able to get my factory steering wheel controls to work via those 2 pins , which I got from a 2003 Grand Am radio skematic with radio controls ....pretty cool

5lbsofswisscheese · Post by **5lbsofswisscheese** » Wed May 19, 2004 12:17 am

So you can, in fact, take the radio out and install it on a different car? I ask because I am trading an '03 Vibe for an '04 Vibe and want to keep the 6-disc changer (which the 04 I want didn't have). The dealer offerred to swap them out, but the service guy said it would deactivate the radios.

ragingfish · Post by **ragingfish** » Wed May 19, 2004 12:42 am

You CAN do the swap.I installed an 03 6-disc in an 04 for VibeChick and it worked fine...There is NO theftlock on these radios. The red flashing light is a decoy, and has no functional purpose.

ZubenElGenubi · Post by **ZubenElGenubi** » Wed May 19, 2004 12:42 am

If the dealer offered to swap them out at no charge, have them do it. The radios won't "deactivate" (this is a new one to me). OTOH, I understand that the '03 radios are not compatible with XM, so if your new car has it, or if you're thinking of getting XM, you might want to check on that.-Glenn

ragingfish · Post by **ragingfish** » Wed May 19, 2004 12:44 am

Quote, originally posted by ZubenElGenubi Â»OTOH, I understand that the '03 radios are not compatible with XM, so if your new car has it, or if you're thinking of getting XM, you might want to check on that.Excellent point, but it would only be an issue with a factory XM system. If there's no factory XM system in the new car he's getting, it shouldn't be a problem. Aftermarket XM systems mated with a stock head unit have to be installed via FM modulator (unless it's a nav system and you use an aux adapter), and FM modulation is not dependent on the head unit itself.

5lbsofswisscheese · Post by **5lbsofswisscheese** » Wed May 19, 2004 12:58 am

The salesman offerred to swap them out for the cost of labour. The new car has the single CD player, and the M&T amp, no XM radio (XM still seems like a rip-off to me anyway). I called him back, mentioned that the Vibe radios do not have the Theftlock system, gave him the document ID for the the Vibe Radio/Audio system, and told him to call the service people back and have them check their sources. It's taking longer than I wanted to get this new car! P.S. I am a he, not a she.

ragingfish · Post by **ragingfish** » Wed May 19, 2004 1:10 am

Quote, originally posted by 5lbsofswisscheese Â»The salesman offerred to swap them out for the cost of labour. The new car has the single CD player, and the M&T amp, no XM radio (XM still seems like a rip-off to me anyway). I called him back, mentioned that the Vibe radios do not have the Theftlock system, gave him the document ID for the the Vibe Radio/Audio system, and told him to call the service people back and have them check their sources. It's taking longer than I wanted to get this new car! P.S. I am a he, not a she.Well, XM to me is the best thing since swiss cheese , but that's another topic for another thread.If it takes them longer than 20 minutes to swap the radios, you should go to another dealer. It's absurdly easy, and if they'd let you, I'd say do it yourself, but obviously that won't happen.Good luck, keep us posted..PS - As to the s/he, that's why I like to use that when I'm unsure, it covers both worlds. I've updted accordingly.

5lbsofswisscheese · Post by **5lbsofswisscheese** » Wed May 19, 2004 12:41 pm

Turns out they charged me $21 for the labor involved in the switch, but it took most of the day for them to decide wether or not to do it. It went off without a hitch, and both radios still function. I'll take posession of the car tomorrow morning.The next trick is to get them to cover it on the new car warranty.

Psychobroker · Post by **Psychobroker** » Wed May 19, 2004 3:19 pm

I just picked up a Sony MEX-HD1, so am considering selling my 6-disc HU. If so, I'll list it in the F S/W forum. Thanks for all your help Jahntassa

Jahntassa · Post by **Jahntassa** » Wed May 19, 2004 10:01 pm

Not a problem! I hope you enjoy it, and I really want to know how well it works out. I was drooling over those things since they hit the market! (The sony, not the 6-disc)

Psychobroker · Post by **Psychobroker** » Thu May 20, 2004 4:00 am

Will do! I'm sure to post pics after the install, along with the Polk db6750's .I was able to pick up the MEX-HD1 from eBay for ~$490 shipped, which comes with a 90-day wty from Sony since it's a factory refub, plus a 4-year extended wty for an extra $105. I then bought a sosche mounting kit, ant adapter, wiring harness, and 4 6.5" XTC baffles from Crutchfield for $60 shipped. Not bad!

Questions about stock head units

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