Possible lemon.....

[w42w42]

I posted here a few weeks ago, regarding 'gravel in the radio', and a check engine light on a new Vibe, purchased on 09/14. It's been mostly down hill since then. I'd like to know if any of you have had similiar experiences, or heard of others that have.09/18 - 09/20: 1st visit, waited for a new radio, check engine light was reset.09/24, 2nd visit: Ordered a coil assembly, and swapped suspect from #1 cylinder (#1 Cylinder Misfire was computer code) to #2, for diagnostic purposes.09/30, 3rd visit: Light on again, coil in from factory. Replaced coil, reset light, sent home.10/02 - 10/3, 4th visit: Light on again. While dropping car off, I asked about the computer code on prior visit, and if they replaced the coil on Cylinder #1, or #2, and what the code actually was. They stated that it was still #1 misfire. I asked why then, did they once again replace a coil assembly when they had already eliminated that by swapping it with #2. The service rep agreed that it was a bit pointless. They also sprung for a rental car this time.Rep called at home later that night, and said they'd taken a new car off of the lot, and used it's fuel injector rail, coil packs, and computer module, and put into my car. They would drive it home that night, and back in the morning, to make sure it was okay.I went to pick it up, and they pulled the car out front. I hadn't gotten my seat moved back to where I want it when I noticed the light was on again.They still have the car, for what I would consider the 5th trip. A factory guy is being sent up, he's supposed to be here Monday. If he can't get it fixed the first time, I'm probably going to do the lemon law thing. If you live in Washington, checkout http://www.wa.gov/ago/consumer/lemon/ Other states should have similiar sites setup, very informative on what you can/can not do regarding lemon law issues.Thanks guys, it's nice to be able to rant a bit. I'll keep you posted on what happens with the car.Paul

[m4VibeGT]

Good luck with having your car fixed. If the factory guy can't fixed it, they should offer to replace it with a new car of your money back.So far, no problems with my car (knock on wood), which is only four days older than yours.

[dlmetzger]

I see lemon law and I have to chime in (see "engine stalls"). I sold my vibe back to GM a month or so ago. Don't be fooled, GM will not just offer to buy it back. They will continue to have you return the car to service time and time again. You will have to get a lawyer involved, then they start to listen. Just my $0.02.

[yank dini]

not sure about your state but Michigan Lemon Law states if your return a new vehicle for services 3 times for the same problem you are supposed to get a new car or your money back

[dlmetzger]

Actually, that is not correct. Michigan Lemon Law states it has to be 4 times for the same problem or 30 days in the first year. The 3 comes into play since you are required to give the automaker a "final chance" to repair the vehicle, thus you inform them that number 4 is their final chance. And as far as them voluntarily offering up a new car or buy back, that won't happen until you get a lawyer to put them on notice that you intend to sue or actually take them to court. The other route is the non-binding arbitration that is offered by the BBB.I had them put on notice and then they settled. It was much faster than the arbitration.

[yank dini]

I stand corrected Mr Fieger!!!!Just kidding lol

[w42w42]

Hi guys,Just an update. They still have the car from my 1st posting, still replacing parts. They know how to identifiy the problem without the engine light coming on, but that hasn't seemed to help them diagnose it.My concern now is that I get it back fixed, but it's totally rebuilt by hand and rattles like a jalopy for the rest of its life.Paul

[w42w42]

Well, it's the 16th, and they still have it from the 2nd. A factory guy has shown up, and I believe tomorrow will be his third day with it. I wonder how long he's willing to stay to fix it.33 days of ownership, it's been at the shop for 20 of those.

[Vibe Rater]

They do seem serious about fixing it. Being a new vehicle in first year of production, they want to make it right. Either that or the factory guy really likes the Seattle area. Keep us posted. Thanks.

[RAC]

We are still waiting for GM to respond to the paperwork sent by the attorney. They don't seem to care about customers who buy these lemons. 7 attempts to fix the check engine light, 29 days in the shop and 600 miles of test drives where they replicated the problem. All the parts they threw at it fixed nothing. If they took ours back in August when even the dealer told them they should, maybe they would know the cause by now. We did keep getting those customer survey though!!

[w42w42]

I *WISH* I had one of those customer surveys. I did get a phone call, albeit about three weeks ago, on the dealerships service.

[w42w42]

We talked to the GM of the dealership last week, and he said that they were down to replacing the engine block - they really had no idea. We agreed that wasn't a desirable thing to do on a brand new vehicle, and he sent an email to General Motors. They agreed to replace/refund the vehicle, and we go in tonight. My Wife and I both want to replace the vehicle, as we like the car. I have this bad feeling though that they're going to try and re-negotiate something, which will set me off the deep end I'm sure. We'll see though.I know a few on here have had lemons, was the dealership pretty accomodating in finding you a new vehicle that you liked? Anyway, wish us luck, I'll let you guys know how it goes.Paul

[MiamiVibe]

God Luck Paul. Sould move to Flori-duh, lol. After the 3rd visit the lemon law would have been sealed.

[RAC]

If you like the car take the exchange. It's the only way to get it off your hands quickly. They will ask you to pay for the miles on the Vibe. They wanted .25 per mile from us and we said no way especially since they put on 600 of them with their test drives. Our light is still on 2 months after the last time and 7th time they tried to fix it. Our lawyer appears to have fallen asleep so the lemon law won't get things done very fast. Someone else had a decent lawyer last summer who settled fast and got the mileage charge way down. GM told me they charge miles based on the state you live in. I don't believe them... everything is negotiable. I'll let the group know the firm we used after he wakes up and settles this thing. If anyone else uses the lemon law get the lawyer to put in writing how long he expects the settlement to take. Tell him he gets that amount of time plus 30 days or he's fired just like you would do with a real estate listing.

[vibb]

quote:I know a few on here have had lemons, was the dealership pretty accomodating in finding you a new vehicle that you liked? Hi I last posted to this forum Sept 10 not long after I sold my Vibe back to the dealer. I could have gone through arbitration for my lemon, but at that point I had lost any faith in Pontiac or the dealer to stand behind a warranty on any future car they would sell me. At the end of 2 months of hassles, service was saying the Vibe was not a true Pontiac and therefore the problems were normal and something I had to live with.

[w42w42]

The service dept. basically stated that because it wasn't a Pontiac, it shouldn't be expected to run correctly? I'd have laughed my head off just before smacking them. You could have said something like "I'm sorry, I'm originally from the States, I can't be expected to behave correctly" ;-)On our Lemon Vibe though, we had our meeting on Monday, which seemed pretty fruitless at the time. We showed up on time, the Service Mgr met with us, and introduced us to a sales type. My guard was up at this point, and we were asked to wait while they figured some things out. Turns out, the service mgr went to the Fleet Mgrs desk, and explained to him for about 20 minutes what our situation was, then called us over. All that we basically accomplished that night was to confirm that yes, we'd like a new Vibe that has the same features/color/appearance as our current one. The Fleet Mgr said he'd have to call around the next day to see if a trade could be made. We then went home.My Wife called the GM of the dealership the next morning and indicated that the night before was our 9th trip to their dealership on this one issue, with no concrete resolution, and we were becoming somewhat frustrated. She also asked him what he could do to make us happy again, as we were when we first bought the car. To his credit, he appologized, and said he was trying to make it right. Also to his credit, he went to bat for us regarding the car swap, and it sounds like will be getting one with the Power option, where we didn't have that before. I laughed when he told me about the conversation he had with one of the people at GM regarding the car swap, asking them how they'd feel if it was their car they had just bought, but were without for over 30 days. The person on the other end of the phone agreed that it would probably be frustrating.The car is supposed to be here next week, and I think that my Wife and I are finally happy with how things are turning out. I have to say that we could easily be feeling differently, if not for the GM at this dealership.

[rodzombie]

Man I hope nothing like that happens to me. I'm glad after all that has happened you still want another Vibe. I Love mine. I can't think of another vehical that fit my needs and wants and was also a blast to drive. ( never thought I'd say that about a front wheel driver ) (It's also my first four banger.) Keep us posted on your situation. I work for GM and we have manufacturer reps. that help us in situations like yours. I don't know if they could help non GM employees or not but I can check if you'ld like. Keep us posted and let me know if you'ld like me to check on this for you.

[LindaL]

I am not happy that you have had bad luck with your Vibe but I am happy to hear that I'm not the only one. I bought my in August and have had nothing but bad luck. The CD player didn't work from day one, then the engine light kept coming on. I have taken it for repair so often. Now I'm sick of it. One of the salesmen said that Pontiac is not settling with anyone about this problem. I live in Tennesse. Any suggestions from anyone?Thanks

[LindaL]

While I am sorry you've had problems with your VIBE, I am glad to know I'm not the only one. I've had the same problem with the Engine Light. I was told that the part to repair it is under review by GM. One of the guys at the dealership said that Pontiac was not doing anything at this point to compensate folks like us. What hogwash! I live in Tennessee. Any suggestions from anyone.?

[w42w42]

Well.....still here, and waiting. Our meeting last Monday (on the 1st) was the last time we had a face to face with them. I had a call from a gal at GM at few days ago, referencing paperwork we'd have to sign to complete the deal. Sounds fine, though the paperwork has yet to appear at the fax machine. I called her today to ask what the holdup was, and they apparently haven't recieved all invoices yet for the new vehicle (wheels/tint). She was hoping it'd be done by Monday.Here's the kicker. We've been in a rental car for awhile now, and the service department has said all along, "don't worry about it, we'll extend it if your car isn't returned to you shortly". Well the phone rang a few days ago, and it was a lady from Avis, asking if I still had the car. I thought that was a weird question, and she explained that it was considered stolen at that point - because the contract had expired about a week earlier. I called the dealership, and talked to the service manager. He said he'd call avis and get it straightened out. With this, our (mythical) car, and my lack of confidence in the service manager, I didn't sleep well that night. I decided to call our local Avis the next afternoon. As I suspected, they hadn't heard from the dealership, and agreed to extend it through this week.Despite the GM of the dealership working with us on this, we probably will not be going back their for service. It's been one snafu after another. I feel like this could be a part of a script titled "National Lampoons Trip to the Service Department".Ah, the phone just rang. They want me to drive down there (a 10th visit), and trade in the rental, they have an Aztek for me to drive. That's going to improve my mood. I'll keep you updated.

[w42w42]

I do have a suggestion. Three, actually. 1) Talk to the GM or Owner of the dealership. It's in their interest to help you, and not go through arbitration under your states lemon law.2) Find the specifics on your states lemon law, I know a few here have mentioned Michigan and Washington, the latter has a pretty good website on it. Get the details, collect your paperwork, and decide how you would proceed under this.3) If the dealership doesn't help you out here, talk to a Lawyer. You shouldn't have to go through this, stand up for yourself. Trust me, they won't do it for you.

[w42w42]

We just got our new car this last Saturday, and so far all is well. GM hasn't finished the actual paperwork for the swap, but the dealership sent the car home with us regardless.

[RAC]

Congrats on getting rid off the lemon. If you like the Vibe you definitely did the right thing. A cooperative dealer was a big help. Giving you the new car forces GM to take the lemon back. Too bad GM doesn't care as much about customer service as your dealer has shown he does. All we got from Pontiac customer service was 'we are sorry the problem cannot be resolved to your satisfaction'... words but no action. Someone posted that the Vibe engineers read this site. If so, let management know they are losing customers when GM doesn't take responsibility for their products. If anyone else has the problem with the check engine light at least GM will finally have a Vibe with this CEL problem so its engineers can find the real cause. The question is will GM do the right thing and give it to the engineers who visit this site so that others who get a Vibe with this CEL defect can expect a TSB that provides a one time fix... and the production line finally gets defect free parts.We are still waiting on our lemon Vibe with the check engine light, but our case was filed and a response from GM's local lawyer is expected soon. Claims to be very busy... which doesn't give me much comfort. We need 2 new cars now since the 92 Astro is getting long on miles. Damn good vehicle as is the 2001 Malibu. Not a single warrantee visit for the Malibu. Driveway may be going from 80% GM to 40% soon (the '72 442 is safe too)... all depends on customer service. Are you listening GM?

[LindaL]

Well, we continue to get the run around about our loser Vibe. The GM rep supposedly sent the "new and improved" computer component needed to make our Vibe good as new. I am so tired of the hassle and double talk. They said if this doesn't work then they'll go into arbitration. I'm warning anyone interested in a Vibe to look for something else. I can't express my disgust enough. Thanks for letting me vent. I've been "Vibe-Venting" since August.Linda

[RAC]

Unfortunately if they are replacing the ECM it won't solve the problem. They put a new one in ours last June or early July. The CEL light won't go out until the bulb burns out. Still waiting for the GM lawyer's response to the filing of our suit. I count 3 Vibes from this list with the CEL problem. This community represents just under 2% of Vibe owners. Come on GM, statistically that could mean 150 Vibes with potential CEL problems. Take these 3 back and find the real solution before you have a major recall.

[NovaResource]

150 potential Vibes out of 30,462 built (as of October) equals less than 1/2 of 1 percent (.0049%). That's normal, not a "major recall". I know you're annoyed (and you have every right to be) but lets have a reality check.

[RAC]

The Lemon Vibe is finally gone. If you ever get a lemon my advice is to work for an exchange and not use the lemon law. It takes too long and only the lawyers come out ahead. Also cancel your extended warrantee immediately if you get a lemon. Do this regardless of whether you plan to go for an exchange, arbitration or lemon law. GM does not refund it under the lemon law since "it is not theirs" (even though it says GM Protection Plan with their logo on it). After 60 days it starts to depreciate. Ours lost about 15% of original cost in 8 months. Sure, some will say take them to court and ask for everything back. Then expect to wait a year for your court date... and keep making those payments in the meantime unless you want to hurt your credit rating.GM did not come out ahead since they paid the lawyer fees and had to take it back. We ended up paying about the same as if we had leased the car with the mileage charges, non refundable court filing fees and "expert opinion fee" the lawyer charges. The only ones coming out ahead are the lawyers. Good luck to all and most Vibes are great cars. Just don't buy a used Salsa one with a check engine light on. RichardPS: the day after the Vibe was returned the CEL come on in our 2001 Malibu. The dealer had a TSB saying how to correct by reprogramming the computer and all is fine. Someday GM will solve it for these Toyota engines too! (Damn is it hard to buy American these days!)

[bellwilliam]

I think you guys just got incomptent technicians, that they can't seem to fix 1 problem. I think you guys got a lemon technician rather than the lemon car.I would personally define a lemon as a car having x number of different problems. there must be 1 correct fix for your 1 consistent problem, it's just that the Pontiac technician can't find it.