Advice on a potential new purchase?

ken99287 · Post by **ken99287** » Wed Feb 05, 2014 1:13 pm

I'm looking at an 03 Vibe tomorrow. It's black, 145,500 miles, manual tranny, power doors, windows, moonroof, aftermarket cd player, new clutch 3 months ago, and new inspection.

The body seems to be in good shape. The interior seems to be in good shape.

He is asking $3,500, but when asked on the phone, said he'd take $3,200.

Do you guys think it's worth it?

If not, what do you think I should ask?

I currently drive a 2004 auto with TRD SC, so if I get this one, I'd like to throw the SC onto it. Do you guys think the mileage is too high for FI?

Salsa Guy · Post by **Salsa Guy** » Wed Feb 05, 2014 1:52 pm

It's not about the miles but the engine condition. Run a compression test first. I think you want to see everything above 150 and no more than 15 psi between them. My Vibe GT was all above 210 and it has 130K miles.

KITT222 · Post by **KITT222** » Wed Feb 05, 2014 3:33 pm

If you have a base automatic, the supercharger will not fit the GT. But if the price is right, the GT could be a nice ride. With the GT you would get the 6-speed manual, LOTS of high end power with valve lift, and a better platform for the aftermarket.

ken99287 · Post by **ken99287** » Wed Feb 05, 2014 4:19 pm

I believe the car I'm looking at is not a gt.

Anyways,I guess I just take off the engine cover, pull all the spark plug wires, replace a spark plug with the tester and crank it for a couple seconds? Then repeat with the other 3? I know some cars you're supposed to hold the gas pedal on the floor, how about the vibe? Also, should i do the compression test before our after driving the car (hot our cold)?

If it's not a gt, what is a good price?

Nasmfell · Post by **Nasmfell** » Wed Feb 05, 2014 4:24 pm

Pass. Too many miles, plus new clutch is probably hiding another problem(s).

Salsa Guy · Post by **Salsa Guy** » Wed Feb 05, 2014 5:25 pm

Everyone I was using my GT as a comparison. He's not getting a GT.
At 145K miles I'm not sure getting a new clutch is hiding any problems. I'd say he got good life out of it.

Have the compression tested before buying and putting a SC on it. Also you maybe shopping for a MT TRD ECU. The AT will work but it's not as aggressive as the MT

ken99287 · Post by **ken99287** » Wed Feb 05, 2014 6:18 pm

So... anyone want to confirm the compression test procedure I posted a couple posts back?

Salsa Guy · Post by **Salsa Guy** » Wed Feb 05, 2014 7:43 pm

It looks correct it's been years since I did one. I did some checks on the cars valve and $3200 is on par. Seen prices all over the place I'd try and get it for $3K.

hoooboy · Post by **hoooboy** » Wed Feb 05, 2014 8:10 pm

ken99287 wrote:So... anyone want to confirm the compression test procedure I posted a couple posts back?

DIY 2zz :
http://www.newcelica.org/forums/showthread.php?t=227280" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

ken99287 · Post by **ken99287** » Thu Feb 06, 2014 12:36 am

Do you need to hold the throttle wide open to get an accurate reading though? I think as long as I'm consistent, I can compare the numbers to each other, but I'd like to get correct numbers too.

Also what other things should I be looking for? Where does rust start in these things? Mine doesn't have rust, so I don't know.

glhboy · Post by **glhboy** » Thu Feb 06, 2014 6:53 am

I had an 03 Base Vibe with all options that had 187,000 miles on it when I sold it. Ran perfect and needed nothing, so I wouldn't hesitate about the mileage too much.

Nasmfell · Post by **Nasmfell** » Thu Feb 06, 2014 9:57 am

glhboy wrote:I had an 03 Base Vibe with all options that had 187,000 miles on it when I sold it. Ran perfect and needed nothing, so I wouldn't hesitate about the mileage too much.

..There is no guarantee, the seller took care of the Vibe they're trying to sell compared to the one you sold. All the more important to get it checked out if the OP is still interested in this one.

tpollauf · Post by **tpollauf** » Thu Feb 06, 2014 4:44 pm

Nasmfell wrote:Pass. Too many miles, plus new clutch is probably hiding another problem(s).

I somewhat agree with this BUT only if the tranny has NOT been replaced yet. I believe this was one of the early year builds which had the 5-speed bearing failure issue in the manual transmissions? If this is original then this Vibe is probably 50k miles or less from needing a transmission replacement

ken99287 · Post by **ken99287** » Thu Feb 06, 2014 6:40 pm

The guy is foreign. I could hardly understand him.

Turns out the transmission and clutch was supposedly replaced 8 months ago.

It looks good from the outside, but is beat up on the inside.

The secondary hood release by the grill doesn't work, you have to manually push it back up. And there's some special way to close it our it won't latch. (Both sides of the hood were also a good 1/2" lower than the fenders along the while length).

He had a k&n short ram installed.

The exhaust was some kind of aftermarket generic with missing hangers and with a tip welded on that's even bigger than the already abnormally large stock one.

The hatch was full of tools and parts, including the stock intake, the stock radio, a bunch of belts and cans and bottles of additives.

When I pulled the dipstick, the oil was low and a weird gray color and smelled funny. Higher up on the dipstick was a glob of "mayonnaise".

Coolant looked new.

He kept saying the car is perfect, doesn't leak a thing, no check engine light.

He started it up and it was abnormally loud! Exhaust leak! He said no, it's the k&n intake! I covered the exhaust and no change - No pressure buildup, no change in sound, engine not struggling to breath. I look under the car and see the exhausts billowing out the midpipe. I say "no, it's an exhaust leak". He just shrugs. It runs rough.

I get into the car, radio is aftermarket - sloppy install. Driver's seat is all saggy. Uncomfortable!

The window and lock controls were broken/cracked/hanging open/held in place with a drywall screw. The shift boot is not... right.

I take it for a ride. Tranny feels fine. The car doesn't feel fine. It feels BENT, like it's teetering. There is a horrible wobble from one or more wheels.

It seems slow, probably because of the exhaust leak. I only got it up to about 40mph.

We stop and I plug in my code reader. It took me a couple minutes to get my phone's Bluetooth connected to the reader. The whole time I was messing with it, I was being told there is no check engine light and it just passed inspection last week and it doesn't leak anything and it doesn't burn any oil.

Guess what? I got a pending P0420, which is the downstream O2 sensor below threshold. Bad cat, probably. He shrugs again and says he has the same thing and there is no code. It's strange that it's got a pending code. I have a Solara that had a P0420 when I had a leaky exhaust and I kept clearing it. It would go from light on (logged fault) to light off (pending fault) for about 150 miles until the light pops on again... but I wasnt trying to sell it! Sneaky sneaky!

I didn't bother with the compression test. I didn't bother to make an offer.

Compared to my 04, HUGE difference! Mine's BRAND NEW compared to this thing! I admit, I was expecting an 03 to be similar in condition... big disappointment!

tpollauf · Post by **tpollauf** » Thu Feb 06, 2014 7:47 pm

WOW... that poor Vibe sounds like a train wreck

Offer him $2000 and tell him this will be your "parts car" to restore another worthy Vibe! Awesome investigative work and hope we were somewhat helpful in swaying your decision. Now about your location ....................................................

ken99287 · Post by **ken99287** » Thu Feb 06, 2014 7:59 pm

My location?

tpollauf · Post by **tpollauf** » Thu Feb 06, 2014 8:30 pm

ken99287 wrote:My location?

Correct. The proximity in which you live in! This way there could be the possibility that some of us are close enough to be your neighbors and could potentially assist you in finding that perfect Vibe for you

Salsa Guy · Post by **Salsa Guy** » Thu Feb 06, 2014 11:21 pm

Yep sounded bad. Also the oil has coolant in it more than likely. I would have walk away at that point.

cptnsolo77 · Post by **cptnsolo77** » Fri Feb 07, 2014 6:09 am

Wow, that Vibe sounded like a total disaster. I can never undestand how people dont take good care of their vehicles....you worked hard to buy a car to let it fall apart ? what a complete waste of money !....my vibe is in better shape than when i bought it 6 years ago !

ken99287 · Post by **ken99287** » Fri Feb 07, 2014 6:39 am

I'm in the Pittsburgh area.

The car is pretty new to him also, I think. He kept saying the "previous owner" changed the radio. The "previous owner" changed the intake. Said he doesn't like the intake but didn't have time to replace original.

Anyways, my ideal vibe would be an 04 gt.

The reason I prefer the vibe over the matrix is the stock roof rack.

I haul stuff on the roof and you're stuff behind it. It's a very nice mobile. I like it, but I want something manual.

ken99287 · Post by **ken99287** » Fri Feb 07, 2014 6:42 am

A few photos

ken99287 · Post by **ken99287** » Fri Feb 07, 2014 6:44 am

A few more

Rayven01 · Post by **Rayven01** » Fri Feb 07, 2014 7:09 am

ken99287 wrote: ...When I pulled the dipstick, the oil was low and a weird gray color and smelled funny. Higher up on the dipstick was a glob of "mayonnaise".

Coolant looked new....

Wow, what a train wreck! I would have been out of there at the first look at that dipstick. The coolant likely looked new because it was topped off, since it's leaking into the engine. Nobody has oil that color long enough to leave deposits on the dipstick without knowing it (either when changing it themselves, or when warned by the mechanic changing their oil). Which means he was obviously lying about it being "perfect". Best case scenario it sounds like this guy got taken by the previous owner who trashed the car, and is trying to lie his way into scamming someone else to get his money back.

ken99287 · Post by **ken99287** » Fri Feb 07, 2014 8:29 am

Yeah, I realize the color was off and the map meant water in the oil and the new coolant is probably a bad sign. I was assuming the color was due to some kind of additive as a temporary "fix" for something.

I know I should have ended it right there, but I felt really bad for the guy! He just came off a night shift and went to sleep and I woke him up half an hour into his sleep! I didn't want to have gotten him up for just 5 minutes. Then again, I could have just sent him right back to bed, I'm sure he would have appreciated it.

Well I'm glad I test drove it. It's been a while since I've driven a manual. The last manual Toyota I drove was my old 87 4wd Toyota van. Since then, I've had plenty of Honda civics and a Saturn ion in manual, but never a modern Toyota. I think when I find one in good shape, I'll like it. And the 6sp gt would be great.

Nasmfell · Post by **Nasmfell** » Fri Feb 07, 2014 9:39 am

Salsa Guy wrote:It's not about the miles but the engine condition. Run a compression test first. I think you want to see everything above 150 and no more than 15 psi between them. My Vibe GT was all above 210 and it has 130K miles.

In this case it was, hence the suggestion to PASS.

Nasmfell · Post by **Nasmfell** » Fri Feb 07, 2014 9:44 am

tpollauf wrote:
Nasmfell wrote:Pass. Too many miles, plus new clutch is probably hiding another problem(s).
I somewhat agree with this BUT only if the tranny has NOT been replaced yet. I believe this was one of the early year builds which had the 5-speed bearing failure issue in the manual transmissions? If this is original then this Vibe is probably 50k miles or less from needing a transmission replacement

There was more wrong with this Vibe than just the tranny.

ken99287 · Post by **ken99287** » Fri Feb 07, 2014 12:26 pm

Salsa Guy wrote:It's not about the miles but the engine condition. Run a compression test first. I think you want to see everything above 150 and no more than 15 psi between them. My Vibe GT was all above 210 and it has 130K miles.

I agree. I'd trust a high mileage engine that's been taken care of and maintained over a lower mileage engine that's been beat on its whole life. But a compression test, or better yet, a leakdown test would tell.

tpollauf wrote: I somewhat agree with this BUT only if the tranny has NOT been replaced yet. I believe this was one of the early year builds which had the 5-speed bearing failure issue in the manual transmissions? If this is original then this Vibe is probably 50k miles or less from needing a transmission replacement

Thank you very much for this info! This is essential knowledge for my quest for an 03/04 gt.

Wait... is the problem on the 5sp manual or the 6sp manual? Or both?

tpollauf · Post by **tpollauf** » Fri Feb 07, 2014 1:10 pm

ken99287 wrote: Wait... is the problem on the 5sp manual or the 6sp manual? Or both?

The 5 speed manual only. Several members here have replaced the defective 5-speed models with a good used 6-speed one. All works fine from that point on!

ken99287 · Post by **ken99287** » Sat Feb 08, 2014 3:36 am

http://youngstown.craigslist.org/cto/4323055687.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Is that correct? 03 GT only came with 5 speed?

tpollauf · Post by **tpollauf** » Sat Feb 08, 2014 8:24 am

ken99287 wrote:http://youngstown.craigslist.org/cto/4323055687.html

Is that correct? 03 GT only came with 5 speed?

INCORRECT If I'm not mistaken it is the other way around! Only the SIX speed manual came with the GT for that year. Other members here can verify (or correct me) on this. If wanting a similar Vibe in that same geographical area, click this link http://www.ncautoauction.com/detail-200 ... 92530.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; and for only a mere $5000 more

you could have this Vibe. What a ripoff. Avoid these high priced greedy dealerships wherever possible.

kaflex · Post by **kaflex** » Sat Feb 08, 2014 10:38 am

tpollauf wrote:
ken99287 wrote:http://youngstown.craigslist.org/cto/4323055687.html

Is that correct? 03 GT only came with 5 speed?
INCORRECT If I'm not mistaken it is the other way around! Only the SIX speed manual came with the GT for that year. Other members here can verify (or correct me) on this. If wanting a similar Vibe in that same geographical area, click this link http://www.ncautoauction.com/detail-200 ... 92530.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; and for only a mere $5000 more you could have this Vibe. What a ripoff. Avoid these high priced greedy dealerships wherever possible.

my 03 GT has a 6 speed

ken99287 · Post by **ken99287** » Sun Feb 09, 2014 5:09 pm

tpollauf wrote:
ken99287 wrote:http://youngstown.craigslist.org/cto/4323055687.html

Is that correct? 03 GT only came with 5 speed?
INCORRECT If I'm not mistaken it is the other way around! Only the SIX speed manual came with the GT for that year. Other members here can verify (or correct me) on this. If wanting a similar Vibe in that same geographical area, click this link http://www.ncautoauction.com/detail-200 ... 92530.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; and for only a mere $5000 more you could have this Vibe. What a ripoff. Avoid these high priced greedy dealerships wherever possible.

That's what I thought, I always thought the GT and XRS only came in 6 speed.

Salsa Guy · Post by **Salsa Guy** » Wed Feb 12, 2014 3:00 pm

It may be badged as a GT. Look at the engine and see if it has metal in take runners, if yes it's a 2zz and a GT, if not it's a 1zz. Someone could have swapped a 5-Speed in it but that would be like kissing your sister.

ken99287 · Post by **ken99287** » Sat Feb 15, 2014 12:33 am

http://cleveland.craigslist.org/cto/4333462748.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

This looks like a pretty good deal if you could knock off $1k or maybe a bit more... too far for me to check out though...

tpollauf · Post by **tpollauf** » Sat Feb 15, 2014 7:49 am

ken99287 wrote:http://cleveland.craigslist.org/cto/4333462748.html

This looks like a pretty good deal if you could knock off $1k or maybe a bit more... too far for me to check out though...

Yeah that would b a 2-3 hour drive for you BUT if this is the original owner, has a complete history of the car documented, and mileage is legitimate, then it would be worth considering. Contact the seller and see if they'll e-mail you pics direct, this way you'll have a better idea as to the condition, features, etc. Don't let the distance stop you from getting a Vibe. When we were looking for one for my son, we found his 2009 Vibe GT down in Cincinnati and I drove there one weekend to check it out, then the following weekend to purchase it! Three years & counting and we still have it and all is good! FYI .. I work in Sandusky quite a bit and possibly could swing over to Lorain and check it out for you?

ken99287 · Post by **ken99287** » Sat Feb 15, 2014 11:40 pm

My local toyota dealer actually has one leftover 2013 awd loaded. He "says" he just wants to unload it. It stickers over 25k, he said he'd make a very good deal. Said something like $23k and can still make a better deal if I'm interested.

Aren't the 08+ not so good? That's what I heard anyways.

Nasmfell · Post by **Nasmfell** » Sun Feb 16, 2014 10:59 am

ken99287 wrote:My local toyota dealer actually has one leftover 2013 awd loaded. He "says" he just wants to unload it. It stickers over 25k, he said he'd make a very good deal. Said something like $23k and can still make a better deal if I'm interested.

Aren't the 08+ not so good? That's what I heard anyways.

In a word, NO.

Nasmfell · Post by **Nasmfell** » Sun Feb 16, 2014 11:02 am

Nasmfell wrote:
ken99287 wrote:My local toyota dealer actually has one leftover 2013 awd loaded. He "says" he just wants to unload it. It stickers over 25k, he said he'd make a very good deal. Said something like $23k and can still make a better deal if I'm interested.

Aren't the 08+ not so good? That's what I heard anyways.

In a word, Maybe.

jake75 · Post by **jake75** » Sun Feb 16, 2014 6:30 pm

ken99287 wrote:My local toyota dealer actually has one leftover 2013 awd loaded. He "says" he just wants to unload it. It stickers over 25k, he said he'd make a very good deal. Said something like $23k and can still make a better deal if I'm interested.

Aren't the 08+ not so good? That's what I heard anyways.

If AWD is a must have I think a 2014 Subaru Forrester would be worth the small extra difference in price.

lannvouivre · Post by **lannvouivre** » Sun Feb 16, 2014 10:14 pm

ken99287 wrote:When I pulled the dipstick, the oil was low and a weird gray color and smelled funny. Higher up on the dipstick was a glob of "mayonnaise".

Heck yeah, that's a keeper alright!

tpollauf · Post by **tpollauf** » Wed Feb 19, 2014 7:12 pm

A message to the original poster here. Looks like another newer member of GenVibe is selling their 2003 AWD Vibe and they are in your Pittsburg area ................. viewtopic.php?f=46&t=42995" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; Check it out!