Help!! Insight, knowledge, and tips needed for this...

Dilweed · Post by **Dilweed** » Tue Oct 17, 2006 9:48 am

Hi, everyone! I am new here, and of average wiles regarding vehicles, so I look forward to any help/advice/reassurance anyone here can offer to me. So I used my five-year savings on my '05 Vibe (pre-owned) this July. It was time to lay my '95 Neon to rest due to big repairs that outweighed the value of the car itself, etc. I LOVE the look, feel, maneuverability and stylish practicality of this vehicle, and, especially, the Toyota guts inside it. What is really bothering me, ironically, is one of the main reasons I chose this vehicle in the first place: the gas mileage. I didn't know where to post this, so I figured this was the best place. I drive a city/highway mix here in Maine, and I am aware of the notorious EPA ratings being a little generous with mpg, but it blows my mind to read some posts about gas mileage on some other VIbes out there! I am just not getting those great numbers, and I wonder (I know) if I just got a bad build, or something....Details: 9,000 miles (6,700 at time of purchase); used to belong to someone in Peekskill, NY (Assuming lots of hard stop/go driving?); I'm a very smooth and careful driver - practically babying it to see its optimal performance for fuel efficiency; after several fill-ups with the same gas and writing mileage on receipts with the trip resetting each time, I'm getting 20-21 mpg city and 26-30 highway; dealership service dept. says there's nothing wrong with the vehicle (no check engine light, of course), and even went through the basic stuff to double-check other possibilities.Watching that gas gauge needle shoot down after city driving start-ups is just as frightening as when it gets above 3000 rpms on the highway. I've only got 9,000 miles on it now, so should I be panicking here? This is making me actually lament the loss of my Neon's mpg, which should be absolutley crazy! Any thoughts, folks? What could be going on, or is this normal while most of the great-mileage posters out there are up over 15k on their vehicles?* Could my 17" wheels have something to do with this? Still being in the "break-in" period? (Dealership says to wait for 12k to get an accurate reading.) I've also been driving the loooong way home from work at a steadier 2000-2300 rpm and taking about 40 mins. vs.10 mins. of city/suburban stop 'n' go driving to "stretch it out". My girlfriend brought her Saab over from LA where it got 17 mpg, and after driving it on the Maine roads and highways, the digital gauge now says 29.8 mpg, so that's what I'm trying to do here. Does the logic string snap there, or is this an optimistic trial?I really, REALLY hope that my Vibe's mpg improves. I'd hate to remain disappointed in this department. Thanks for any and all help!

VforVIBE · Post by **VforVIBE** » Tue Oct 17, 2006 9:52 am

Welcome, you got a heavy right foot?

Dilweed · Post by **Dilweed** » Tue Oct 17, 2006 9:56 am

Quote, originally posted by VforVIBE »you got a heavy right foot?Nope. Been being very careful to get an accurate reading. Speed limit or just above, and staying under 3000 rpms on the highway.

VforVIBE · Post by **VforVIBE** » Tue Oct 17, 2006 9:59 am

Do you run the AC, turn off OD, fast stops, use cruse control?

GrayFox · Post by **GrayFox** » Tue Oct 17, 2006 10:15 am

V, what would cruise control have to do with it?dilweed, you're right about the EPA ratings giving alot to the dealers but I think you should be getting better than that. Most vibes should get between 30-35 MPG with careful driving. I'm guessing you're not driving with the OD off since you say "3000 rpms on the highway". I don't really know what the break-in period is for this car, tho I think you would be out of it (maybe). Check your air filter & make sure your tires have the appropriate pressure in them. Good luck in the quest for better gas mileage oh, and WELCOME TO GENVIBE!!!!!

VforVIBE · Post by **VforVIBE** » Tue Oct 17, 2006 10:22 am

Quote, originally posted by ANO_Vibe »V, what would cruise control have to do with it?A constent speed ding bat.

Dilweed · Post by **Dilweed** » Tue Oct 17, 2006 10:22 am

Thanks, ANO and V. I've gone through the cruise, OD on/off, tire pressure thing, and my careful driving include no fast stops and letting it downshift gradually whenever possible. It's frustrating as hell right now, and the dealership service dept. checked with air filter, fuel filter, all that when I brought it in a few weeks ago. 3,000 more miles to go until I hit 12k, too... Not sure if that's all it needs to get "stretched out" for more accurate road readings. Grrrrr....Honestly, if this stays like this (I now avoid short trips out of pure fear of watching that needle go down in front of my eyes), I would consider losing more money and trading it in for a Corolla. :/A funny idea: what if this one is actually AWD and just wasn't marked that way? Hah! Riiiight....

NewNeptune · Post by **NewNeptune** » Tue Oct 17, 2006 10:24 am

Quote, originally posted by ANO_Vibe »V, what would cruise control have to do with it?Cruise control is able to hold speeds much better than a person can do. The drivers around here are a testament to that. If I get stuck behind someone it typically goes like this:65->62->68->72->65->77->70->69->65 and on and on.

Dilweed · Post by **Dilweed** » Tue Oct 17, 2006 10:25 am

Quote, originally posted by VforVIBE »A constent speed ding bat. The cruise seems pretty hard on this vehicle. Maybe it's due to being an automatic? I avoid using it.

VforVIBE · Post by **VforVIBE** » Tue Oct 17, 2006 10:27 am

Quote, originally posted by Dilweed »The cruise seems pretty hard on this vehicle. Maybe it's due to being an automatic? I avoid using it.How do you fine it hard?

Dilweed · Post by **Dilweed** » Tue Oct 17, 2006 10:33 am

Quote, originally posted by VforVIBE »How do you fine it hard?Sluggish kicking into higher gear when needed. Really groans and kicks the rpms way up there until it settles. Doesn't seem to like easing into constant speeds, if that helps....

ColonelPanic · Post by **ColonelPanic** » Tue Oct 17, 2006 10:39 am

Quote, originally posted by VforVIBE »How do you fine it hard?Oh, like how it FLOORS it when you go up even the slightest incline! I hated that... I never thought that could be particularly good for your mileage. The ScanGauge would show it dropping down to like 10 MPG or whatever when it did that... Eek! I always cancelled it before going up a hill and worked the throttle manually, I have NO problem whatsoever losing a few MPH going up a steep hill, but apparently the Vibe hated it so it would rather shoot up to 4K instead. It was the worst cruise system I've had for doing this, it was way to heavy on the throttle.My Vibe's replacement doesn't even have cruise... I manage to get more consistent numbers with it than I was when I relied on cruise. I don't miss cruise all that much.Hey Dilweed, one thing I always suggest is getting one of these nifty Scangauges. It can really help with figuring out what is going on your mileage.Our thread is here: http://forums.genvibe.com/zerothread?id=20577The site is http://www.scangauge.com/

2002sportside · Post by **2002sportside** » Tue Oct 17, 2006 11:02 am

Quote, originally posted by Dilweed »Sluggish kicking into higher gear when needed. Really groans and kicks the rpms way up there until it settles. Doesn't seem to like easing into constant speeds, if that helps.... I don't find the cruise in my '05 to act like that at all... All of my past cruise equipped vehicles felt like that, but not the Vibe. I thought it was the 'smoother' DBW setup. :shrugs:From day one I have managed over 25mpg in the city with my Vibe. Currently I average just under 30mpg with a mix of city/highway. I don't think it would affect it too much but are your tires the right size? It could be throwing off the odo. Maybe it is an AWD...Keep posting, we should be able to help you eventually...

ColonelPanic · Post by **ColonelPanic** » Tue Oct 17, 2006 11:15 am

Hmm, I wonder if he's got DBW or the cable? Didn't some initially have either one? Mine was an '03 so it had the cable and it sucked...

Dilweed · Post by **Dilweed** » Tue Oct 17, 2006 11:18 am

Quote, originally posted by 2002sportside » I don't think it would affect it too much but are your tires the right size? It could be throwing off the odo. Maybe it is an AWD...Keep posting, we should be able to help you eventually...Yeah, that'd be sweet if it WAS AWD... but I seriously doubt it. I'd like to know how to tell, though, in case of that longshot. It IS scary that I get such low city mpg right now, too... ugh.... I was researching tires this week (the factory ones seem to really be terrible in inclement weather according to just about everyone), and was disappointed to also find that I have an option package 17" rims. Even though those are desirable for handling, etc., I hear that they're not as good in the snow as 15 or 16" rims. Anyone know if that's true?Thanks for your continued responses, btw.

Dilweed · Post by **Dilweed** » Tue Oct 17, 2006 11:20 am

Quote, originally posted by ColonelPanic »Oh, like how it FLOORS it when you go up even the slightest incline! I hated that... I never thought that could be particularly good for your mileage. Exactly! Grrrrrr....

Digger · Post by **Digger** » Tue Oct 17, 2006 11:27 am

Look in the rear of the car. If you have a pumpkin ball on the reare axel then it is a AWD. I have noticed if you take short trips in cold weather ( Under 40F) the car runs in rich mode for a while. You do not smell rotten eggs do you?

Dilweed · Post by **Dilweed** » Tue Oct 17, 2006 11:30 am

Nope, no rotten-egg smells. Let's hope I never smell that from it! I know I risk sounding ignorant here, but what is a pumpkin ball? I'll check that out and cross my fingers. Heh....

GMJAP · Post by **GMJAP** » Tue Oct 17, 2006 11:32 am

That sounds low to me. The parent's 05 auto gets 29-30mpg and they do mostly city driving.They've only noticed the cruise dropping gears and flooring it on hills when the car is really loaded - 4 people plus extra cargo.There is a drivetrain TSB that's usually brought up because it can create a bad rotten-egg-like smell. But I think another aspect of it was low mileage.EDIT Digger snuck his post in while I was typing

Dilweed · Post by **Dilweed** » Tue Oct 17, 2006 11:40 am

Quote, originally posted by GMJAP »That sounds low to me. The parent's 05 auto gets 29-30mpg and they do mostly city driving.Wow! Now I'm jealous. I don't understand that sort of great city mileage. That's exactly not what I'm getting, and there doesn't seem to be anything "wrong" with my Vibe, which is the frustrating part. The roads here aren't level, but would that really make that much of a difference? We're not talking killer slopes; just not flatlands like down South. And our cities are more spread out towns, too. Nothing really bumper-to-bumper, which I imagine would be hell resurfaced to my vehicle.How many miles does your parents' car have, btw?

Capriceman · Post by **Capriceman** » Tue Oct 17, 2006 11:41 am

Dont worry about the high rpms Its a 4 clyinder and when you 70-85 mph it will be up there. Is the overdrive off?

Dilweed · Post by **Dilweed** » Tue Oct 17, 2006 11:43 am

I thought it should definitely be ON. No?

Capriceman · Post by **Capriceman** » Tue Oct 17, 2006 12:05 pm

yeah you want Overdrive on! it cause a change in ratio in the gears and lowers rpm.

2002sportside · Post by **2002sportside** » Tue Oct 17, 2006 8:47 pm

Overdrive is automatically on whenever you start the vehicle, it's a momentary switch. So, if you shut it off you would have to do it everytime you start the car. I doubt that is his problem.Once I passed the 5k mark I routinely saw 27-28mpg in the city and I don't baby the car. Something definately isn't right there. As for identifying an AWD car... it has a rear differential. If you look at the rear beam there will be a "pumpkin" in the middle, sort of like what a truck has, and independent axles. (although honestly I have no idea what a Vibe AWD's rear axle actually looks like...) Otherwise you will just have a straight beam for the rear axle. Hope that helps...

2002sportside · Post by **2002sportside** » Tue Oct 17, 2006 8:50 pm

Even easier... check the VIN. The fourth and fifth digits tell you what you have:SL-VibeSM-Vibe AWDSN-Vibe GT

ColonelPanic · Post by **ColonelPanic** » Tue Oct 17, 2006 9:15 pm

Quote, originally posted by Dilweed »I was researching tires this week (the factory ones seem to really be terrible in inclement weather according to just about everyone), and was disappointed to also find that I have an option package 17" rims. Even though those are desirable for handling, etc., I hear that they're not as good in the snow as 15 or 16" rims. Anyone know if that's true? Yep, pretty much true if you have the OEM 17" tires. Those are more of the "summer only" variety, they even went so far as to say in the owner's manual that if you want to have traction in the winter, you should consider a winter tire. Throw ya a good set of winter tires on there, maybe just go with a set of four new wheels to make it easier on you for changing them in the spring and summer (and you can go to a more snow-friendly size to boot!) and you'll be golden.

1oldbanjo · Post by **1oldbanjo** » Tue Oct 17, 2006 9:45 pm

Have you checked the accuracy of your odometer? Maybe your mileage is fine and your mileage calculations are not accurate. The Base Vibe with 16 inch wheels uses 205/55-16 tires that turn 837 revolutions with each mile. When you put the 17 inch wheels with the 215/50-17 tires they are slightly bigger in diameter and turn 814 revolutions for each mile - which would mean that you odometer is only reading 97% of the actual mileage traveled. (I believe the GT is calibrated for the 17 inch wheels which are stock on the GT). I checked my odometer with the stock 16 inch wheels and tires and found that my odometer was off significantly - while the speedometer was pretty accurate. In my car I lose about a tenth of a mile every 5 miles - which means my reading is only 98% of the actual mileage I travel.To check your odometer and speedometer - drive on a highway that has mile markers along the side of the road. Drive at a constant 60 mph and using a stopwatch or watch with a second hand it should take exactly 60 seconds to go between mile markers. If it takes less than 60 seconds your speedometer is reading slow and you are going faster than your speedo says - if it takes more than 60 seconds your speedometer is reading fast and you are traveling slower than the speedo says.To check your odometer reset your trip odometer just as you pass a mile marker and record the number of the mile marker. The odometer should gain another mile with each mile marker and should be changing at exactly the point where you reach the next mile marker. If the mile markers are coming faster than your odometer changes your odometer is recording less mileage than you are actually going and your mileage calculations will not be accurate. The farther you travel the more accurate your calculations will be - in my case I was on the same highway for a trip and used 100 miles to do the calculations for the odometer. Divide the distance the milemarkers indicated by the reading your odometer recorded - and you will know the correction factor to use when calculating your gas mileage. (This number will probably be above 100% for your car with the 17" wheels).If you have 17 inch wheels with tires of different size than the stock GT 215/50-17 size - your actual odometer reading could be significantly different. I often see people who file tire reviews with the Tire Dealer websites who claim that they changed tires and lost 3 mpg with the new tires - but they often don't understand that they bought new tires that were a different size and their odometer no longer reads accurately. When you get a bigger diameter tire it turns less revolutions for each mile - and your odometer will record less mileage than you actually traveled - this will affect your mpg calculations.Dave

GrayFox · Post by **GrayFox** » Tue Oct 17, 2006 10:45 pm

Quote, originally posted by VforVIBE »A constent speed ding bat. geez... I thought you were saying the cruise control was a bad thing, which in hilly situations it can be.Were the 17s an option on a base?

VforVIBE · Post by **VforVIBE** » Tue Oct 17, 2006 11:22 pm

Quote, originally posted by ANO_Vibe »geez... I thought you were saying the cruise control was a bad thing, which in hilly situations it can be.don't worry, I forgive you

djb383 · Post by **djb383** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 12:07 am

I think your mpg (city) is about right. My '05 does a consistent 22 mpg city which consists of 30 to 45 mph speed limits in residential and business areas with stop and go every 2 to 4 blocks.Some people drive on freeways or loops at 60 mph, within city limits, and say they get 28-30 mpg city 'cause they're in the city. That's not city driving, that's highway driving and the EPA highway mileage numbers are determined at a steady 60 mph.

Dilweed · Post by **Dilweed** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 12:20 am

I stop about 6-7 times around 30-40 mph within ten minutes in my morning city commute, and that's how I get my city-only mileage. Interesting, djb. When I'm all highway, I do not come close to those 33-38 numbers that I've seen floating around for the automatic, though. 65 mph speed limit, and I find myself right around 70-73mph, trying to duck below the 3000rpm range.I will have to try the mile marker test soon, too. 17" alloys should be a good thing, but I'm now disappointed because they seem to be impractical here in Maine. I'm a schoolteacher without a strong budget, so replacing the wheels themselves probably isn't in the cards for me right now. I'm looking for reliable all-conditions tires. Sucks that they have to be expensive 17"-ers, but what can ya do? I wonder if I should take it back to the dealership service dept. to check out the odometer?

Dilweed · Post by **Dilweed** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 7:07 am

Quote, originally posted by 2002sportside »Even easier... check the VIN. The fourth and fifth digits tell you what you have:SL-VibeSM-Vibe AWDSN-Vibe GTBleh. Not that I got my hopes up too much, but it is an SL Base model. Thanks for that info, though!

Tubaryan12 · Post by **Tubaryan12** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 10:10 am

Quote, originally posted by Dilweed »I'm looking for reliable all-conditions tires. Sucks that they have to be expensive 17"-ers, but what can ya do?offer to trade them for some 16" steels....that way it won't cost you anything

Dilweed · Post by **Dilweed** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 11:18 am

Quote, originally posted by Tubaryan12 »offer to trade them for some 16" steels....that way it won't cost you anything How could I go about doing that??A tire dealer would do that? (And isn't aluminum better?)

Tubaryan12 · Post by **Tubaryan12** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 12:14 pm

Quote, originally posted by Dilweed »A tire dealer would do that? No, but I'm sure several posters on this board would love to help you out with that type of trade.

2002sportside · Post by **2002sportside** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 8:35 pm

You could probably get people to trade their stock 16" alloys for your 17s too. Thats the way I'd try to go...Curious, do you have the moon and tunes package (sunroof and seven speaker sound system)?

zionzr2 · Post by **zionzr2** » Wed Oct 18, 2006 9:59 pm

Quote, originally posted by 2002sportside »Overdrive is automatically on whenever you start the vehicle, it's a momentary switch. So, if you shut it off you would have to do it everytime you start the car. I doubt that is his problem.Once I passed the 5k mark I routinely saw 27-28mpg in the city and I don't baby the car. Something definately isn't right there. As for identifying an AWD car... it has a rear differential. If you look at the rear beam there will be a "pumpkin" in the middle, sort of like what a truck has, and independent axles. (although honestly I have no idea what a Vibe AWD's rear axle actually looks like...) Otherwise you will just have a straight beam for the rear axle. Hope that helps...yes the AWD has a small "pumpkin and an independant rear suspension. SO if you are seeing a straight bar you do not have the AWD.and for the GT's, they do not have auto trannys and they have rear disc brakes.

Dilweed · Post by **Dilweed** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 7:20 am

Quote, originally posted by 2002sportside »You could probably get people to trade their stock 16" alloys for your 17s too. Thats the way I'd try to go...Curious, do you have the moon and tunes package (sunroof and seven speaker sound system)?Nope. No M&T package. Just the upgraded Rockfords in the doors (which did make a big difference by themselves).

2002sportside · Post by **2002sportside** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 10:18 am

Ok, that explains what you said in another post. I can't complain about the M&T system. It's the first stock stereo I have no desire to change... it actually sounds pretty good. But I wouldn't expect the four speaker to perform that well... Seperates up front probably would have been more of an improvement for you.

redlava · Post by **redlava** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 3:21 pm

Just out of curiosity, what type of fuel do you put in? Are you running an Ethanol blend? If you are, then try switching to just regular gas with no ethanol and you should see your fuel economy go up.If I remember correctly it took my Vibe quite a while before I really started to see 30MPG consistently. Not sure of the exact milage, but it was probably 8 months or so. And to be honest I don't get much over 30 MPG now with 40,000 miles on mine. I have about a 60/40 split of highway and city driving. Of course my CAI is probably not helping much either.

NewNeptune · Post by **NewNeptune** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 4:42 pm

I second the fuel suggestion. My last car got whatever was cheap. Mileage declined steadily over the ownership period. I would do this: Run your current tank down as far as possible, put in a bottle of Chevron Techron (GM just rebottles this stuff as their own fuel injector cleaner) and then get your gas from one of these gas stations for at least 5 tanks:http://www.toptiergas.com/retailers.htmlI've put nothing but QuikTrip in my Vibe since I have owned it, and at over 7k, the mileage and idle have not gotten any bit worse since I bought it.Also, you may have answered this question, but, how do you calculate mileage?

Dilweed · Post by **Dilweed** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 7:56 pm

Quote, originally posted by redlava »Just out of curiosity, what type of fuel do you put in? Are you running an Ethanol blend? If you are, then try switching to just regular gas with no ethanol and you should see your fuel economy go up.If I remember correctly it took my Vibe quite a while before I really started to see 30MPG consistently. Not sure of the exact milage, but it was probably 8 months or so. And to be honest I don't get much over 30 MPG now with 40,000 miles on mine. I have about a 60/40 split of highway and city driving. Of course my CAI is probably not helping much either. Interesting! I get gas from Cumberland Farms (not sure if those stores are nationwide), which is Gulf gas. I've tried Irving (TERRIBLE!), Mobil (eh), and Citgo (meh), as well. Gulf has been giving me the reading that I'd been posting here, plus I wanted to stick to the same pump while trying to find an accurate measurement of my mpg, if at all possible.I'm writing the total miles (after having the trip reset each time) on the receipt at fill up. Divide the miles by gallons, and there ya go....Thanks, folks! Keep the tips and advice coming! I'll look into that gas mixtures... And let me know if there's a certain company that I should stick with, if you know anything about gas in New England. Thanks!

2002sportside · Post by **2002sportside** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 8:35 pm

I buy whatever I happen to be driving by at the time... At 14k I haven't noticed a difference between filling up at a Shell, Sunoco, Gulf or small independent station. It's always between 28-30mpg. I try to avoid Exxon Mobil though... I owned a car that wouldn't run on it and I've never forgotten. I don't think what you are getting is normal... do you know the history of this vehicle at all? If it's that bad now I'd hate to think what will happen when the "winter blends" hit the pumps, if they haven't already.BTW, I don't think I can even find gas without Ethanol in RI anymore...

Dilweed · Post by **Dilweed** » Fri Oct 20, 2006 12:05 am

Quote, originally posted by 2002sportside »I don't think what you are getting is normal... do you know the history of this vehicle at all? If it's that bad now I'd hate to think what will happen when the "winter blends" hit the pumps, if they haven't already.BTW, I don't think I can even find gas without Ethanol in RI anymore...Yeah, no kidding! That's why I'm taking the extra long route home from work to stretch it out with better, longer roads. Worked for my girlfriend's Saab (went from 17 mpg in LA to 29.8mpg on the Maine Turnpike!), so I figure that, since this vehicle only had 6700 miles on it and it's in impeccable condition (the body, motor), those miles must have been really hard stop/go miles from the previous owner. It was leased for a year in Peekskill, NY, if that tells us anything. ~6500 in 12 months tells me that it was driven pretty hard for short distances, or not very often, which likely isn't the case since it was leased.Leased, stomped hard, then traded? Hmmm....The dealership service dept. couldn't find anything "abnormal" at all. They said to wait it out so it can calibrate itself and hope for the best. Hmmmmm... but what about all the other posters here who get in the 30's with barely any miles?? I want that. You know?

NewNeptune · Post by **NewNeptune** » Fri Oct 20, 2006 3:12 am

Quote, originally posted by Dilweed »The dealership service dept. couldn't find anything "abnormal" at all. They said to wait it out so it can calibrate itself and hope for the best. Hmmmmm... but what about all the other posters here who get in the 30's with barely any miles?? I want that. You know?I think those are the slow-pokes. Calling 55 MPH highway, no A/C and probably barely crossing 2500 RPMs on acceleration. Around here, that's city driving.

Dilweed · Post by **Dilweed** » Fri Oct 20, 2006 3:27 am

Quote, originally posted by NewNeptune »I would do this: Run your current tank down as far as possible, put in a bottle of Chevron Techron (GM just rebottles this stuff as their own fuel injector cleaner) and then get your gas from one of these gas stations for at least 5 tanks:http://www.toptiergas.com/retailers.htmlWe do have Shell and Texaco here, so I'll try that next. I put a bottle of Fuel Injector cleaner/Fuel Treatment at my last fill up the other day by Lucas Oil Products. Kick (removed) company with stuff made to last with racing cars (my dad used to sell for them, and the products proved their value with my family's vehicles). That was Gulf gas, so we'll see how it goes. I can't think that the injectors would ever need cleaning at 9k, though.... Wishful thinking....

4azdmunky · Post by **4azdmunky** » Fri Oct 20, 2006 3:10 pm

You could also run some seafoam in your tank. gas will make a difference. 711 (citco) makes my car run like crap, the dealers here even told me not to run citco gas.Also, have you reset your PCM? I know that when I drive from Denver to Pueblo (around 2000 ft difference) the car runs great in Pueblo, but runs like crap when I get home. Same thing happens when I go to the mountains. It runs like a old people fornicating in the mountains, but when I drop down in altitude it runs like a raped ape.You might be higer in altitude that the previous owner.

Viberrrr · Post by **Viberrrr** » Sat Oct 21, 2006 10:28 pm

Quote, originally posted by 1oldbanjo »I often see people who file tire reviews with the Tire Dealer websites who claim that they changed tires and lost 3 mpg with the new tires - but they often don't understand that they bought new tires that were a different size and their odometer no longer reads accurately..Dave Yee haaaw, my mileage will go up this winter once I put on my 15" snow tires. Just think of the mileage if I could find some 13" tires that could fit.

Dilweed · Post by **Dilweed** » Wed Oct 25, 2006 11:16 am

Quote, originally posted by 4azdmunky » Also, have you reset your PCM? I know that when I drive from Denver to Pueblo (around 2000 ft difference) the car runs great in Pueblo, but runs like crap when I get home. Same thing happens when I go to the mountains. What is a PCM?

joatmon · Post by **joatmon** » Wed Oct 25, 2006 7:13 pm

Quote, originally posted by Dilweed »What is a PCM?my guess would be powertrain control module, sometimes referred to as the ECU, which is perhaps electronic control unit. The car's computer that controls how the engine runs, and when an automatic tranny shifts. You can reset it by diconnecting the negative lead on the battery for a while, some say 2 minutes, others say 15.