oil loss

[joatmon]

2003 base 1ZZ 5 speed 214K miles. Bone stock. Overall, the engine runs great, smooth, no loss of power or pep.I'm losing a quart of oil about every 1500 miles. That would be a leak that I could not help but notice. I park in the garage at my house, and no oil drips from the Vibe. Ever. It is not a leak. Don't even try to go there 'cuz it ain't happening. So I figure I must be burning it. I think it likely that not keeping up with the loss lost me my rod bearings, (which I replaced and are still fine) but I've been paying a whole lot more attention to the oil level now. And getting tired of feeding it a quart every four tanks of gas.I don't notice a blue cloud when I start it, but I haven't really been looking. Haven't had anyone follow me to see if I'm smoking. I haven't done anything yet to try to figure out if I've got ring blow by, leaking valve stem seals, or some sort of ingestion by the intake. haven't pulled the plugs, haven't run compression tests, etc. Time's been an issue lately, and easier for now to just keep feeding it, but I will need to deal with it for real.Lay some advice on me. What troubleshooting steps do you recommend? It's me, so you know I'll work it starting with the easiest and least intrusive (and least expensive) things to check first.

[chevelle_lover]

If there are no leaks in the drive then it is internal to the engine and there is no quick fix that I know of. To me is sounds like leak down from the cylinder head past the valve guides and seats. This is especially true if it has blue smoke on start up. One of the tricks on small block chevies that we would do is to take the valve covers off when cold and see if there is some slop in the individual valves. Try moving the valve side to side. This only worked some times as it does not take much for the oil to move through the valves. You could use those engine stop leak fixes but they are only a temporary solution to having it fixed.

[cptnsolo77]

I remember I had a similar problem on my 82 Regal years ago. Check each spark plug and check if its oil fouled. That would indicate a internal problem & that would probably be why your consuming oil. It wount tell you exactly what it is, but it will help you narrow it down to which cylinder it is.

[Caretaker]

you and me both Joatmon. You've read it from me before: my '03 also consumes about 1.5 quarts between 5,000 mile oil changes. Definitely no leaks, and DEFINITELY no blue smoke. I even had my mechanic check to see if it was mixing in with the antifreeze, but the answer was no. The stuff is just disappearing. I have no problem adding more dino oil when needed. I have no cause for care to find out what the problem is in a car that looks like crap and is at 130,000 miles. You wanna drink oil baby, I'll give you oil.I even have consumption on my '09. I simply chalk it up to a high reving Corolla engine. I used to get the same thing on my Corolla Wagon. Drive it until you need to push it over the cliff. Don't feed it synthetic; just feed it Pep Boys SJ (or whatever quality level we're up to now) shelf oil.But, if it still bothers you, I would love to hear if you can figure out the caper. My only hint is that it (as you know) is not leaking externally and it is not dumping out as exhaust. My '03 consitantly passes emissions. The fact that you have nearly twice as many miles as me means that you should go buy the "big drink" at Walmart and have it ready whenever your baby needs some liquid middle east refreshment. Good luck.

[djkeev]

Most likely you need to replace your valve stem seals. Doesn't always mean the valves are worn in the guides, though sometimes they are.Most often the intake valves are the culprit but not always, the rubber dries out and gets hard, sometimes cracks and lets a little oil by.The piston on the down stroke to suck in air and fuel is also sucking in oil down the valve stem. Just a tiny bit, but enough.The fix is often cheap (compared to an engine overhaul) and isn't hard except for Toyota's valve adjustment system!Live with it, or fix it, your choice.Dave

[star_deceiver]

If you're running synthetic oil then you won't see a cloud of smoke (unless you're really pushing the rev limit).Valve seals! Piston rings are probably worn too.

[djkeev]

Quote, originally posted by star_deceiver »If you're running synthetic oil then you won't see a cloud of smoke (unless you're really pushing the rev limit).Valve seals! Piston rings are probably worn too.Rings are a possibility but they quite honestly don't wear like they did in the "old" days.Valve stem seals however are a major problem in many newer cars. They overall do not withstand the test of time. Doesn't seem to matter model or engine, they "dry" out and fail.I'd for sure do the seals first before even thinking about the $$'s for a ring job. New Rings involves every wear item in the engine being reworked or renewed, that is to do it properly.Dave

[Sublimewind]

Compression and leak down are your next steps.. Won't tell you if it's valve stem seals though, so if the compression comes out good, i'd say look at the valve stem seals..

[Caretaker]

This needed a bump. I let my 03 go the entire 5,000 miles without adding oil to see what the result would be. Conclusion: not a drop of oil registered on the stick; it took two full quarts to get it to the fill line, and the oil light never came on. Soooo, 2 quarts every 5,000 miles. Still in specs according to Pat Goss. I'll keep feeding the Vibe's drinking habit; we'll see if it passes inspection next summer. I still would love to hear from you all on whether the valve seals are the issue here, and if so, what kind of $$ it would cost to repair. I have no desire to fix a piece of junk looking 03 when I can soon pick up another (used) 09 for petty cash.

[Cruxless]

It's probably gunking up and becoming sludge. Toyota engines are notorious in doing so.

[joatmon]

I've had the valve cover and the oil pan off on mine not too long ago, and did not find any sludge, not a trace, so while that may be a factor for some, it isn't in mine.I'm waitning on warmer weather before trying stem seals, the unheated garage is fine for repairs I have to do right away, that one though, I'll feed it till it warms up some.

[cq358]

do a compressor test, and switch to high millage oil .My 96 corolla stop oil consumption when I switch it to high millage oil.Consider your millage, I think it is acceptable for your car to burn some oil.honda and BMW engine burn oil only 50000 miles.

[21Rouge]

Quote, originally posted by joatmon »2003 base 1ZZ 5 speed 214K miles. Bone stock. Overall, the engine runs great, smooth, no loss of power or pep.I'm losing a quart of oil about every 1500 miles. Bryce who doesnt post often but had 3 Vibes as part of his taxi service and each went well over 200k miles did tell me that for *each* of his Vibes oil consumption began at around 200k miles. And each had been fed a steady diet of high quality synthetic for most of their operating life.

[djkeev]

Quote, originally posted by 21Rouge »Bryce who doesnt post often but had 3 Vibes as part of his taxi service and each went well over 200k miles did tell me that for *each* of his Vibes oil consumption began at around 200k miles. And each had been fed a steady diet of high quality synthetic for most of their operating life. I said it before and I'll repeat myself but the above comment only backs up the valve stem seals as the culprit. For the most part the rubber compound isn't affected by the oil but over time and being exposed to heat they lose their elasticity and become hard and stop squeezing the valve as it slides up and down. Every down stroke takes a little oil with it and burns it.Most often the intake seals are the real problem for they operate on a suction stroke while the exhaust is a pressure stroke.Dave

[burrpenick]

OK, today I closed my VIBE chapter. It was a great car: 2003 base model w/at, had 170k after 10 yrs and still delivered 35MPG on the road. Only non common failure was passenger side wheel bearing- that may have been damaged by abuse?
HOWEVER, I was not happy with the oil consumption that started around 100K. I never measured it closely, but as the miles crept up and over 100k, it worsened. No noticeable smoke or fouled plugs, and the MPG didnt seem to suffer, but I could smell it in the exhaust. I tried flushing the motor, synthetic oil, heavier oil etc but nothing seemed to work. Finally sold it today for $3k. I informed the new owner that he would need to watch the oil level and I think he understood.

[joatmon]

OK, today I closed my VIBE chapter. It was a great car: 2003 base model w/at, had 170k after 10 yrs and still delivered 35MPG on the road. Only non common failure was passenger side wheel bearing- that may have been damaged by abuse?
HOWEVER, I was not happy with the oil consumption that started around 100K. I never measured it closely, but as the miles crept up and over 100k, it worsened. No noticeable smoke or fouled plugs, and the MPG didnt seem to suffer, but I could smell it in the exhaust. I tried flushing the motor, synthetic oil, heavier oil etc but nothing seemed to work. Finally sold it today for $3k. I informed the new owner that he would need to watch the oil level and I think he understood.

Sorry to see an envy Vibe leave the board. What did you get to replace it?

I solved my oil loss issue by swapping for a different Vibe, happy to have zero oil loss issues. In fact it seems odd to go through a whole oil change interval without having to add a quart (or three)

[zythr]

OK, today I closed my VIBE chapter. It was a great car: 2003 base model w/at, had 170k after 10 yrs and still delivered 35MPG on the road. Only non common failure was passenger side wheel bearing- that may have been damaged by abuse?
HOWEVER, I was not happy with the oil consumption that started around 100K. I never measured it closely, but as the miles crept up and over 100k, it worsened. No noticeable smoke or fouled plugs, and the MPG didnt seem to suffer, but I could smell it in the exhaust. I tried flushing the motor, synthetic oil, heavier oil etc but nothing seemed to work. Finally sold it today for $3k. I informed the new owner that he would need to watch the oil level and I think he understood.

Sorry to see an envy Vibe leave the board. What did you get to replace it?

I solved my oil loss issue by swapping for a different Vibe, happy to have zero oil loss issues. In fact it seems odd to go through a whole oil change interval without having to add a quart (or three)

There you go, both issues solved. FWIW, some 2003-2004 even 2005 Vibes/Matrixes can have oil use issues partly to the wrong oil dipstick being used (wrong oil level indicated). This issue could cause the engine to be deprived of this small amount of oil. Over time, of course, it could cause excessive oil usage which was probably the case with both your Vibes.

I guess for people looking to be a used one, to stick with the 2006 and later models?

[joatmon]

I don't buy into the dipstick causing oil loss. My second 03 and my son's 03 matrix have no oil consumption issues in spite of having the same length dipstick as my first 03 Vibe. I was also in that engine, and there was no sludge problem. Seems more likely that Toyota later realized some engines had oil loss problems moved the notches on the dipstick so there'd be more oil to lose.

[Salsa Guy]

I don't buy into the dipstick causing oil loss. My second 03 and my son's 03 matrix have no oil consumption issues in spite of having the same length dipstick as my first 03 Vibe. I was also in that engine, and there was no sludge problem. Seems more likely that Toyota later realized some engines had oil loss problems moved the notches on the dipstick so there'd be more oil to lose.

LOL