Help/Advice Please - Just got data report

[asburydan]

After having check engine light on and searching forums here, I took my '05 base Vibe to a NAPA care center and had the tests done. Yes, it is 02 oxygen sensor that needs replacing. My search showed someone who said the senor was an 80,000 mile warranty item. I have 64,835 miles. Anyone know for sure or have advice? The repair estimate at the NAPA Care Center is $262 for part and 57.60 labor. If you have experience or ideas, I would appreciate your help before I spend over $300.Many thanks.

[L5K]

That seems outrageous.O'reilly auto parts has oxygen sensors. The expensive one is 80 bucks.As far as I know, there are two sensors on the vibe. One is before the catalytic converter, and the other after. At those locations I can't imagine them being difficult to get to at all...

[asburydan]

Just checked at Auto Zone and sensors are $122 and change or $108 and change depending on whether buying up or down sensor of the two the car has. Thanks for tip.

[ColonelPanic]

Check your warranty book if you still have it... Certain components are covered for 8 yrs/80,000 miles under the federal emissions warranty. I don't remember if oxygen sensors are covered, I think they may be.Probably would be worth a shot to ask the dealer before you plop down the dough on the new sensors.

[asburydan]

Thanks. On p. 19 of the Warranty book under Powertrain Control System there is a listing for Oxygen Sensors. Previously it says parts listed here are covered as follows: 7 years/70,000 miles for California Emission Control System and 8 years/80,000 miles for Federal Emission Control Sysstem. I am calling or going to the dealer in the morning. Thanks again.

[asburydan]

Update, same old story. GM says because oxygen sensor is listed in the warranty book as part of the power train system and not the catalytic converter stuff, the sensor is not under warranty. It is GM that quoted the $262 part cost to the NAPA Care Center, and my local Pontiac dealer also quoted the cost to me today as $262. Advance Auto (vs Auto Zone as I stated above) has aftermarket one for $108. Two folks told me to be careful about not using a "universal sensor because the plug must be cut from the old one and wired to the new one. The one I mentioned above for $108 is the full unit - plug and go. Don't mean to go on, but thought this might be helpful to the next person. Any more advice will be welcome. I am thinking now of buying the $108 one and trying to put it on myself.

[L5K]

I've never seen an aftermarket sensor that didn't have the correct plug. If it was for some weird brand of car maybe, but I would imagine that pretty much all Toyota cars use the same plug for the o2 sensor, so I'm sure there are aftermarket sensors with that plug in on them.

[jake75]

On the question if an O2 sensor is an emission control part - I would think that it would depend not on how GM listed it, but how the federal government listed it.

[joatmon]

In the 2005 warranty document (softcopy available in http://forums.genvibe.com/zerothread?id=1010) on page 15 says:Quote »Federal Warranty Coverage• Car or Light Duty Truck equipped with Car andLight Duty Gasoline Engines− 2 years or 24,000 miles and 8 years or80,000 miles for the catalytic converter or vehicle,powertrain, control module, whichever comes first. and then on page 18 it says:Quote »Emission Warranty Parts ListThe emission parts listed here are covered under theEmission Control System Warranty. The terms areexplained previously in this section under the “FederalEmission Control System Warranty” and the “CaliforniaEmission Control System Warranty”.Important: Certain parts may be covered beyondthese warranties if shown with asterisk(s) as follows: (*) 7 years/70,000 miles, whichever comesfirst, California Emission Control System Warrantycoverage.(**) 8 years/80,000 miles, whichever comes first,Federal Emission Control System Warrantycoverage. (Also applies to California certified lightduty and medium duty vehicles.)and then immediately following on pages 19 - 22 it lists the compnents. Oxygen sensors arre listed on page 19, and they are not tagged with any asterisks, which means that they are only covered under the general 2 year/24000 mile federal emissions warranty.So on a 2005 Vibe with 64K miles, O2 sensors are no longer under warranty. Sucks, but that's the way it is.Now, you can get generic O2 sensors, they come with loose wire ends, then you have to cut the conenctor off the bad one and slpice it on to the wires of the new one. I replaced an O2 sensor hoping it would fix my P0420, which it didn't, but I didn't want to splice wires, so I paid extra for the O2 sensor that came with the correct connector already there.The dealer's cost of $56 Labor is probably reasonable, for a dealer service department. Their hourly rates seem unreasonably high to most of us, but they include all the cost to provide that service, including overhead, facilities, training, management, insurance on the business, health insurance for the workers, reitrement, all those little factors that get added to what the employee gets paid that make the true cost a lot higher than most people like to acknowledge. It may only be a half hour job. Which O2 sensor is it, the one up by the exhaust maifold or the one under the car by the cat converter? If it's the second one by the cat, it's not hard to replace, you have to pull up the rug on the front passenger side by the center console, unplug it, push the rubber grommet and wire throught he floor, then unscrew it from the pipe. Reverse to install the new one. If it's the one by the exhaust header, it might even be easier, but because it's a bit hidden by the heat shield you may find the job a lot easier if you can find an O2 sensor socket. AutoZone and Advance Auto both have tool loaner deals, you can put cash down, borrow the tool, get the cash back when you return the tool.

[asburydan]

Again, thanks. More info. The Toyoa part numbers for the 2 sensors are Upper (near exhaust manifold under hood) 89467-12010 and Lower (under car by cat converter) 89465-02190. The parts folks at Toyota confirmed these are correct numbers even though I had to us a magnifying glass for the one under the car and a strong flashlight and lots of stretching for the one just above the manifold. Incidentally, the Toyota parts price is $158 for lower and $199 for upper. I let Pontiac dealer know Toyota prices to confirm again my comment to them this AM that on "the vibe site" it is generally known that Toyota parts are ususally cheaper than GM. The one that is bad on my car according to dianostic test is the upper one. $57 to install is NAPA Car Care Center. Toyota was well over $100 when they priced it to me over the phone. At this point I am planning to let NAPA folks get the part from Toyota at above price and install it for $57. He said he might be able to find a Bosch one a little less now that he has the Toyota part number I gave him.