Torquing my wheels

[Vibe2009]

So I rotate my wheels today and according to the user manual, i am suppose to torque it at 103 Nm....I got a torque wrench from canadian tire to do this and is my first time using it...I did felt the click from the torque wrench set at 103Nm.... but it seems really not that tight.... I can use my regular wrench and tighten it more...what's the problem here, is it just me~I am considering taking to a tire place to torque it and have them compare there torque wrench from mine....One more thing, I have a 1/2" torque wrench and using a 1/2" to 3/8" adapter to fix the wheel nut... would that be a issue?advise?

[star_deceiver]

Drive about 50km and re-torque them. DON'T overtorque them!!!!! You can warp the brake rotors, snap studs, strip threads and have an all around bad day. The adaptor won't make any diffrence as long as the torque wrench is set right. But if taking it to the shop and paying a little $ will put your mind at ease then do it, better to have peace of mind when driving the being stressed out over something you did or didn't do!!!

[keithvibe]

Just because you could turn it more doesn't mean it's correct. You have now over torqued your lug nuts.The 03-08's have a 76ftlbs rating.* i don't know what the 09's require* Every time I have had a shop do an inspection on the car I besure I tell them to hand torque the lug nuts to 76ftlbs. The first year they didn't listen to me and I blew a gasket when I caught the tech using an air gun on them. Most airguns torque them to 500ftlbs... if they let it sit on the nut too long.Start over and do it right. Then check it in a week you will find 99.99% of the time no further torque is reqired.

[Vibe2009]

Thanks for the advice.I am going to buy another torque wrench today, 1/2" socket (so I can skip the adapter), and do it again.thx

[Sublimewind]

Quote, originally posted by keithvibe »Just because you could turn it more doesn't mean it's correct. You have now over torqued your lug nuts.The 03-08's have a 76ftlbs rating.* i don't know what the 09's require* Every time I have had a shop do an inspection on the car I besure I tell them to hand torque the lug nuts to 76ftlbs. The first year they didn't listen to me and I blew a gasket when I caught the tech using an air gun on them. Most airguns torque them to 500ftlbs... if they let it sit on the nut too long.Start over and do it right. Then check it in a week you will find 99.99% of the time no further torque is reqired.Where they using the torque limiting sockets (them long hourglass shaped thinggees??) Prolly not.. V2009, your REALLY don't need a different TW... 103Nm is 103Nm regardless of the wrench.. and it's not that accurate anyway.. As long as you are close, you should be fine.. even a few Nm over isn't terrible...The biggest thing is that they are even and you go back after 200km or so and check them.. ALSO, DON'T, I repeat DON'T put grease on the threads of the studs... It will DRASTICALLY change the torque of the lug, sometime as much as DOUBLE... !! Meaning that you may double the actual amount of torque, before the wrench clicks, due to the lowing of the friction between the lug and stud...

[keithvibe]

I know about the torque sticks. No they weren't using them. I won't even let them use those. I want them hand torqued because of the tuner alum lug nuts.

[Vibe2009]

when I torque the wheel nut, do I need to have the wheel completely off the ground? With the front wheel, it will move when I torque~ So I partially jack up the car, but enough tire contact to the ground that it will not move when I try to torque the front wheel... Is that good enough?.... The rear wheel I can torque it when left off the ground with parking brake lock....

[star_deceiver]

Keep the car on the ground, put it in 5th or park with the E-brake on. It's easier to do them all at the same time after you tighten all the nuts. Don't forget to torque them with the star pattern 1-3-5-2-4.

[Sublimewind]

Quote, originally posted by Vibe2009 »when I torque the wheel nut, do I need to have the wheel completely off the ground? With the front wheel, it will move when I torque~ So I partially jack up the car, but enough tire contact to the ground that it will not move when I try to torque the front wheel... Is that good enough?.... The rear wheel I can torque it when left off the ground with parking brake lock....You want to tighten the lugs semi-tight, with the car in the air, this just keeps the wheel from rocking sideways, once you put it on the ground... Then I always "sneek up" to the torque spec... I will start tightening them, and stop just before the click, and move on... then I come back and hit the spec... This gives you a nice distribution of force on the face of the hub... if you just go and tighten one all the way with the others lose, it tends to make the first lug, far tighter than the rest of them when you are finished.. I end up going around the bolt pattern about 4 times to make sure.. first a general tighten, then the first "sneek-up" tighten, then I hit the spec and finally I double check them all... I have had lugs come lose... 103Nm is NOT a huge amount of force... Which is something you mentioned in the beginning... My mothers Subaru is known for this... it's had whole wheels come lose and able to "rock" (yeah that loose)It was my fault though, because I didn't come back after a time and re-check the torque.. It's labor intensive, but it's also proper..

[Vibe2009]

These are great tips! thx!

[vintagegz]

I personally feel it is better to torque down the wheels when the vehicle is off the ground, if it is on the ground and the wheel is not perfectly on you are trying to torque it straight with the wrench. When there is no load on the wheel it will snug up straight and torque properly.

[Sublimewind]

Quote, originally posted by vintagegz »I personally feel it is better to torque down the wheels when the vehicle is off the ground, if it is on the ground and the wheel is not perfectly on you are trying to torque it straight with the wrench. When there is no load on the wheel it will snug up straight and torque properly.I agree with you, I just find it more difficult to keep the wheels from turning and not rocking on the jack... This is also why I "sneek" up on the torque spec.. so it draws the wheel down on the hub more evenly... This is ALSO why it's said you should go back after a period of time to check the lugs.. If the wheel isn't perfectly on the hub or not perfectly centered on the lugs, it will shift, finding it's resting place, and possibly with some lugs loosened because of that.. You are correct though, it's likely best to do it off the ground.. it's just slightly more difficult, dangerous..

[star_deceiver]

Just don't forget to re-torque after driving around for a while. If you get your wheels changed at a tire shop they should re-torque for free.... or you could get some of those green pointer thingys (Proper name???) that some rigs and busses have on their lug nuts.

[airplaneflyer]

I've seen on garage shows that bolts should be lubed for torquing, or you end up under-torqued - this leads to the bolt having sufficient friction to meet the torque requirements, but not sufficient tensile load to properly hold whatever it's holding.

[keithvibe]

Quote, originally posted by airplaneflyer »I've seen on garage shows that bolts should be lubed for torquing, or you end up under-torqued - this leads to the bolt having sufficient friction to meet the torque requirements, but not sufficient tensile load to properly hold whatever it's holding.I'm confused by your post. You should NEVER lube any lug bolts it will throw off the settings and you will over torque your lug nuts if not snap a stud.

[djkeev]

Ah, metallurgy of fasteners and torque!!I LOVE this topic but I'm not going to preach for pages on it. I will point out that torque is a LOUSY way to measure tightness of fasteners but it is about the best economical way we have right now.There are ways of measuring nut tightness accurately but we don't want to pay for them right now! A cheaper way is torque angle but isn't widely used on many items. It's most often used spot is for engine head bolts today.When tightening a bolt you are essentially stretching it like you would stretch a rubber band. The memory in the steel shaft is trying to pull back to its original length. This is what makes something tight, how much you stretch a bolt until the point comes where you break it and it cannot remember its original length.Torque is simply a measure of friction. The friction is calculated to stretch the bolt. The friction can be in the threads, the friction can be against the item being tightened, friction can be rust or dirt.That all being said do NOT over tighten a lug nut. The torque measurement gets you into a safe tightness that should be adhered to.Do NOT lubricate the threads as already mentioned, though it will give you a more consistent and equal torque measurement this is an area that could also cost you your life if you do this.Do clean up the threads, the outside of the lug nut where it rides on the wheel and the wheel recess. Get the dirt and rust out of there.The wheel on the ground will affect torque. The bottom of the lug nut is being mashed against the wheel recess creating more friction. Do apply the brakes and with the wheel up an inch or so, run the numbers. Get a helper to foot the brake is a quick and easy way. Don't have it up high in the air, you can topple a car off of it's jack / supports.I'll shut up now...dave

[vibedrivermatt]

hey I just did this recently. Maybe it seems like your wrench isn't making the lugs tight enough because your using a 1/2" drive wrench with a really long handle. I have one that goes to 250 ft-lbs its pretty gigantor. If you held it towards the end you could torque the lugs to 76 ft-lbs with very little pressure. I use a 3/8 drive wrench that's shorter so it probably feels closer to tightening with a tire iron (proper name lug wrench) but it doesn't anything different that a 1/2" drive wrench would do. my 21mm 3/8 socket is the only socket I keep in my cup holder. Quote, originally posted by Vibe2009 »when I torque the wheel nut, do I need to have the wheel completely off the ground? With the front wheel, it will move when I torque~ So I partially jack up the car, but enough tire contact to the ground that it will not move when I try to torque the front wheel... Is that good enough?.... The rear wheel I can torque it when left off the ground with parking brake lock....Yup I've done this too. Nothing wrong with taking a little extra effort to torque the lugs evenly, especially with your own car! but to me seems like wasted effort. to keep things simple I'll just get them tight, lower all four wheels to the ground and torque with the wrench. done! I'm pretty sure that's how mechanics do it. Then periodically recheck as those guys mentioned.

[Caretaker]

I just got back from shopping for torque wrenches at three different stores (WalMart, Home Depot, and an auto parts store). I ended up getting a 1/2 inch drive model at WalMart for a discount price of $25. I just retorqued both Vibes only to find that Costco did a perfect job in not overtightening my lugs after getting the new Michelins. As for the 03, Firestone not only over tightened one of the wheels, but lost one of my lug nuts and replaced it with one that has a size 20 head instead of the usual size 21. Fortunately, once again, I had the tools at home to compensate for a mechanics incompetence.

[djkeev]

FYILittle known fact, little followed technique but after you finish using your wrench and you've got the "click" style, turn the setting down to zero to store it. Helps to maintain its accuracy (yes they can be adjusted / tested)Dave

[scherry2]

torquing the lugs to the nominal of 103 nm (+/- 10nm i believe) be it by hand or a pulse type will not loosen up when driving. most dealerships have adjustable air or electrical tools and using an air tool to tighten fasteners doesn't harm them. Vehicles built in the assembly plants aren't rechecked after securing at the assembly plants or the dealership. Only harley davidson has you bring your vehicle in to retighten fasteners. any fastener tightened down to the proper torque that is a KPC fastner will not loosen up per the MVSS regulations. just a little heads up. And tight as it can be isn't always good. you would be suprised to know that some ground straps on the engine are only 9 +/- 2 nm.

[vibolista]

All the advise here is great, but I don't let anyone near my alloy wheels with an air tool, adjustable or not. I've witnessed many mangled lug nuts and scarred wheels as a result of careless air gun use.