Engine KNOCK

kerrykerry · Post by **kerrykerry** » Wed Oct 15, 2008 3:04 am

Last night on my way home, my car started making a knocking noise. Here's a video of it:Does anyone know exactly what that crappy sound is??????

ou.grizzly · Post by **ou.grizzly** » Wed Oct 15, 2008 3:40 am

wyatt89 · Post by **wyatt89** » Wed Oct 15, 2008 3:43 am

You sound fudged. Keep us updated when you get some professional opinions.

ColonelPanic · Post by **ColonelPanic** » Wed Oct 15, 2008 3:56 am

Sounds similar to what my Vibe did but they could never figure out what was causing it... It knocked when cold and would settle down once up to normal temp. It clattered like a diesel when accelerating with a cold engine!So it just started doing this?

RIT · Post by **RIT** » Wed Oct 15, 2008 3:57 am

I would get that to a mechanic ASAP. Doesn't sound good.

03vibegt-r · Post by **03vibegt-r** » Wed Oct 15, 2008 4:08 am

read my post and whatch my vid , my vide is doing the same thing just sent my oil away for testing to find the problem . i guess keep us both informed

kerrykerry · Post by **kerrykerry** » Wed Oct 15, 2008 4:20 am

Yea, it sounds just like a diesel now. It just started outta the blue while driving home. It does it all the time, not just when it's cold. My friend said it's probably rod knock, sooooo if he's right, im running on 3 cylinders rite now.... I guess my plans to turbo are gonna be put into play sooner then i wanted too If it's the internals that are fcked, then time for the forged pistons, iron sleeved/over bored to 2.0 liter, forged rods.....could be a good/bad thing....mostly bad though, cause im broke

kevera · Post by **kevera** » Wed Oct 15, 2008 4:27 am

2 vibes in a row with the same sound.check the belt tensioner,see if the hydralic shock bounces up and down.Or it's some serious rod knock.

03vibegt-r · Post by **03vibegt-r** » Wed Oct 15, 2008 5:04 am

quote----Yea, it sounds just like a diesel now. It just started outta the blue while driving home. It does it all the time, not just when it's cold. My friend said it's probably rod knock, sooooo if he's right, im running on 3 cylinders rite now....I guess my plans to turbo are gonna be put into play sooner then i wanted too If it's the internals that are fcked, then time for the forged pistons, iron sleeved/over bored to 2.0 liter, forged rods.....could be a good/bad thing....mostly bad though, cause im broke No your not running on 3 cylinders unless the rod is broken , if it is the piston wil not moved up and down. I talked to monkeywrenchracing.com and they said it could be the ristpin bearing , they should know had the first 2zz in the 11's and the 10's they sell a "stage 4" rebuild for the 2zz for 5800, i think that the route im going to build the fastest na vibe gt 2zz

joatmon · Post by **joatmon** » Wed Oct 15, 2008 5:04 am

Quote, originally posted by 03vibegt-r Â»read my post and whatch my vid , my vide is doing the same thing just sent my oil away for testing to find the problem . i guess keep us both informedI saw your vid in http://forums.genvibe.com/zerothread?id=35174 and both yours and kerrykerry's vibes sound bad. One free thing to try would be to take off the serpentine belt, then start the engine and see if it still makes the same noise. If you're lucky, the noise will go away, and then you can try to figure out which of the belt driven things are knocking. It's a long shot, but at least it's a free thing to try. You don't want to run it with no belt for a long time or it will overheat and toast the engine for sure.but a short test should be ok. If it still makes the noise with the belt off, then it's most likely internal to the engine, which would be bad news

03vibegt-r · Post by **03vibegt-r** » Wed Oct 15, 2008 5:05 am

trying it right now thanks

kerrykerry · Post by **kerrykerry** » Wed Oct 15, 2008 5:21 am

haha, lemme know if it works for you! I just took a shower

03vibegt-r · Post by **03vibegt-r** » Wed Oct 15, 2008 6:02 am

No change well its off to the next step stage 4 from monkey racing

kerrykerry · Post by **kerrykerry** » Wed Oct 15, 2008 6:17 am

that super sucks...I watched your vid and your car sounds EXACTLY like mine soo i dont even need to try and pull the belt on mine...

03vibegt-r · Post by **03vibegt-r** » Wed Oct 15, 2008 7:02 am

nope plus its a pain in the *** i got my forearm stuck between the firewall and the plastic cover on the head

engineertwin2 · Post by **engineertwin2** » Wed Oct 15, 2008 7:19 am

Just an FYI, most of what I'm aware of as rod knock is excess clearance between the crank and the rod, which is usually the result of lack of lubrication.Check the lube oil system while you're tearing stuff down. Might be time to replace the oil pump lobe.In fact, I'd almost be willing to bet it is the connecting rod bearing furthest from the oil pump.

kevera · Post by **kevera** » Wed Oct 15, 2008 8:36 am

Quote, originally posted by engineertwin2 Â»Just an FYI, most of what I'm aware of as rod knock is excess clearance between the crank and the rod, which is usually the result of lack of lubrication.Check the lube oil system while you're tearing stuff down. Might be time to replace the oil pump.True Fact!!!!Oil pump Failure FTLYou must have been booting the crap out of it for that to happen.

03vibegt-r · Post by **03vibegt-r** » Fri Oct 17, 2008 5:23 pm

what can i say i love valve lift

03vibegt-r · Post by **03vibegt-r** » Mon Oct 20, 2008 11:34 am

kerrykerry---- i found the problem and i can fix yours for 250 plus parts , mine was the # 4 rod bearings and i caught it just in time yours sound the same way mine did so i figured out the 2zz and 1zz dilema with the "strange" knocking noise

kerrykerry · Post by **kerrykerry** » Wed Oct 22, 2008 1:34 pm

Sooo what did you have to do?

03vibegt-r · Post by **03vibegt-r** » Wed Oct 22, 2008 1:52 pm

replaced the rod bearings they are 105 + tax from mwr i drove to there shop picked them up and put them in now its on a break-in period so that means no valve lift for at least 100 miles ( im at 18 right now )

kerrykerry · Post by **kerrykerry** » Wed Oct 22, 2008 11:45 pm

Awesome! I guess ill try that first before spending around $2000 on all new internals Did you pull your entire motor, or did you just pull the oil pan off, or what?Thanks again for the info!

03vibegt-r · Post by **03vibegt-r** » Thu Oct 23, 2008 2:53 am

you have to pull the pass. side tire, cross member, plastic gaurds and then the oil pan and inspection cover , oil pump screen , and also catch plate, make sure you get the hi temp gasket sealer for the oil pan becasue the factory didnt use any gasket just sealer. o and pull spark plugs , this process of changing the rod bearings will take 2 people when i comes time to put the new ones in and get some emery cloth (fine grit) to polish the crank on the #4 cylinder

engineertwin2 · Post by **engineertwin2** » Thu Oct 23, 2008 4:22 am

Pictures? Write-up?

joatmon · Post by **joatmon** » Thu Jul 23, 2009 10:08 pm

I had some bad bearings on my 1ZZ after only a token 207K milesI didn't take off the tire or the crossmember, although the number 4 was kinda tough to work on. The crank was in great shape, only a slight discoloration on number 1. For access I jacked the car up and put cinderblocks under the front tires, with a safety jack at the center of the crossmember T. Seemed to provide enough room to work on it.Taking the plugs out helps make it easier to turn the engine to rotate the crank for access to the rod bearing caps. I didn't use a second person, just put a 19mm socket on a big ratchet and used that to turn the crank at the pulley.The inside of the pan has a reinforcement for the drain plug, and that obstructs total draining of the pan, there's still about a quarter cup of oil in there, maybe more. One side effect is that after completely cleaning out the oil int he pan, the new oil is still so clean it's hard to see ont he dipstick. Makes me neervous when I check the oil level, and can't see the oil, but when I look closer, it's there. Also, all the glitter and metal bits hang on the bottom of the pan, don't wash out with just the normal drain you'd do for an oil change. Maybe an oil analysis would detect tiny particles. The bearings seem to be on a main ferrous substrate, but the contact surface with the crank appears to be aluminum, not magnetic, so a magnetic drain plug likley wouldn't catch any little bearing pieces until it's worn into the harder metal.I bought a pan gasket, then stupidly overtightened it, wasting the gasket, (luckily I noticed before putting oil in) so I tried it without the gasket, but my overtightening it with the gasket had slightly deformed the pan around the bolt holes, so that it leaked when I put oil in. So, I had to take the pan back off (again) clean all the surfaces (again) and ding the pan around the bolt holes back flat, then put a good bead of hitemp rtv on, screwed it on tight (but not too much) and let it sit for about six hours before putting oil in. I had to go get new oil because I rand the car for about ten minutes before I noticed the leak, and when I took the pan off again there was some new glitter in there, guess it had been washed out. So finally, I was so incredibly happy when it didn't leak. If you skip the unnecessary pan gasket, the repair is quite inexpensive, a couple of bucks for a tube of hi temp gasket sealant, about 25 for the new bearings (which AdvanceAuto can get next day) and obviously new oil and oil filter. Took me about six hours, (not counting selant cure time) but remember I had to remove the pan and clean mating surfaces three times due to stupidity instead of just once, and I also had to spend some time looking for tools. In the 1ZZ, the rod bearing caps are 10mm 12 point, and for a long time I could only find six point sockets, which will not work. I've got fresh oil in there now, will change it again after I put a few hundred miles on it. Blessed absence of knock. If you pass a dirty 2003 silver two tone vibe in MD it might be me taking it real easy on the new bearings.anyway, thanks 03vibegt-r, it was good to see that you had already done this before I decided that was my next step.

Sublimewind · Post by **Sublimewind** » Thu Jul 23, 2009 10:49 pm

Holy crap Joat... So it was bad bearings.... I will never doubt you from afar again Sir...

millster · Post by **millster** » Fri Jul 24, 2009 12:12 am

Even after 207K, it's a little disheartening to see those bearings chewed up so badly, especially since I know you take it pretty easy on your engine. The bearings on my Ford 2.9 with 212K and a history of a manufacturing flaw that leads to poor oiling don't even look that bad (they were just slightly spun so I had to drill the oil passages back out, smear the bearings lightly with Locktite, let them sit and put them back in. Good as new... until the starter bound up... Anyway, that much scoring with proper maintenance looks like there are oiling problems intrinsic to this engine... have to keep a close eye on the Wife's Matrix.

joatmon · Post by **joatmon** » Fri Jul 24, 2009 2:53 am

Quote, originally posted by millster Â»I know you take it pretty easy on your enginethat's not really a safe assumption1 and 4 were both spun, I think the majority of damage to the bearings occurred after that. I drive a lot, and having only the one car, it's the one I drive a lot. The engine had been making noise for some time, so there were a lot of miles on them as they were failing. But I put off taking care of it, and then tried other things first because the knocking sound was hard to pin down. I put an extra 1K miles on it even after I was fairly sure it was the bearings, so I'm not surprised they look nasty. And it was only the top thin layer of soft aluminum is damaged. If they were the solid brass ones of olden days and looked like that, well, that would be different.My only concerns at this point are if there was some oil pressure anomaly that will cause the problem to come back, or if some other item will puke it's guts when it encounters a random leftover piece of shrapnel.But I haven't been especially nice or easy to this engine, so I'm not surprised that it happened. Just glad it doesn't knock anymore

star_deceiver · Post by **star_deceiver** » Fri Jul 24, 2009 9:28 am

Just out of curiosity... What brand/weight of oil did you use (dino/synth) and what were the changing intervals?

joatmon · Post by **joatmon** » Sat Jul 25, 2009 3:20 am

Was always Castro gt-x 5W30 With purolator pure one filters about every 5k miles. Should have been good enough

star_deceiver · Post by **star_deceiver** » Sun Jul 26, 2009 2:02 am

200'000+ miles on a roughly treated engine is pretty good. Can you imagine how many miles you'd get if your maintenance was less then stellar?

Engine KNOCK

Engine KNOCK

Re: Engine KNOCK (kerrykerry)

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Re: Engine KNOCK (ColonelPanic)

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