Paint not quite holding it's luster.

[lordvic]

I've had my 06 vibe now for almost 2 years. Love it.However I find the paint seems to have lost it's luster a bit. There are noticable swirls in the paint, and there are definately some scratches (which i guess is inavoidable).I was wonderingj, aside from a new paint job, What is the best way to smooth out these scratches, swirls and minor abrasions while returning some shine to the paint.

[kcorona]

clay bar followed by a good coat of wax of your choice. Paint is definitely a weak part of the vibe IMO.

[ToolGuy]

If I can recommend:Mothers Clay BarMothers Carnuba paste wax with cleaner3M Imperial Hand Glaze for scratchesGet a bottle of touch up paint tooThese are what I use and have been detailing cars for 15 years now and my red 2003 Vibe will burn the retinas out of your eyes! If you can feel the scratch with your fingernail, then it is too deep and will require a body shop to paint it. The 3M hand glaze will hide it a bit but would still be too deep. Despite what some say, clear coat finishes need attention and must be taken care of. The clay bar will remove the rail dust (metal little rust specs on the paint) and pollutants that are sitting on the top of the clear coat and make the paint smooth like glass. Do this at least once a year and you will be fine.

[Whelan]

Please look for my post on detailing. I do this on the side for many people. You will not find a better product than the Meguiar's Professional line. If you want comparison pics, please let me know and I will be happy to oblidge.

[Mavrik]

clay bar or buff the paint scratches out. I try to hand wash my car instead of taking it through car washes to help fight the battle against swirls and scratches.

[kevera]

So,when you use the clay bar,all you have to do afterwards is put a coat of wax on.Is the clay bar used dry or with water or something slick.And does using the clay bar leave any marks in the paint that have to be buffed out.Sorry for the noob questions.

[scott_h]

Quote, originally posted by kevera »So,when you use the clay bar,all you have to do afterwards is put a coat of wax on.Is the clay bar used dry or with water or something slick.And does using the clay bar leave any marks in the paint that have to be buffed out.Sorry for the noob questions.Clay bars come with a spray. Clay removes all contaminants and more importantly protection, so I would never clay a car if you can't put on wax before you drive it. I personally put on polish then wax after I clay.

[kevera]

Cool,thanks Scott.

[Whelan]

Yes as Scott said, clay bars come with a kit, a spray is included that you use. Optimal usage is to wash the car down with a car soap that does not have any wax mixed in it. I actually use a very small touch of Dawn to get ALL things off the car. Dawn is not harmful to clear coats. When the car is still wet, spray a section like half the hood, a door panel, etc. and hold the clay bar in your palm and rub as if you were washing it again. Cover the whole area sprayed and add more spray if needed. If you hit a spot that seems to catch the bar, that is a contaminant or imperfection. Continue rubbing the spot until it becomes smooth. Do this to the whole car and be sure to spray the area just barred with water to clean it off. I also used masking tape and...wait a second... I'll just paste my old post in here, take a look at that, I have a black car so you can def. see results! If you need more info go to http://www.meguiarsonline.comMeguiar's G100 DA Orbital Polish (aka Porter Cable 7424)6 Meguiar's Large Microfiber Towels3 Meguiar's 8006 Polishing pads1 Meguiar's 9006 Finishing padBottle of Meguiar's #83Bottle of Meguiar's #80 Speed GlazeBottle of Meguiar's Gold Class Wax (still had leftover)2 Foam Hand Applicator pads (for the small spots)1 Clay Bar System1 Roll Blue Painter's TapeI set to work with the #83 speed 5 which broke down nicely, hard to get off, but really took out some deep swirls and scratching. I moved on to the #80 on speed 5 to smooth out the paint and rid myself of the finer swirls and slight haze left by the #83. Then followed up with the Gold Class wax on the 9006 pad speed 3 to give a nice coating. Man! what a difference. The pics below prove it!2005 Toyota Matrix XR AWDBlack Pearl MetallicThe car after being washed, looks clean right?Not according to the clay bar!Some of what I was dealing with, picture your whole car covered in itHere is the products used and the car taped offNow the #83 w/ before and after picsBeforeBefore/AfterBeforeAfterAfterFinal Pics after #80 and Gold Class Covering

[kevera]

Thanks whelan,do you really need to use a buffer.This was the IM's I was sending you,but you never replied,Whelan.

[Whelan]

I know, finally got them one night randomly and did reply, odd you didn't get them.You do not have to use a buffer, you can use your hand. But I strongly recommend using a Foam applicator pad over the microfiber ones. And use a microfiber towel to remove product. Of course you will not get the same results with a hand application compared with a buffer. The Dual Action Orbital machine mimics a hand motion of circles randomly orbiting, only about 1000x faster so the final results is better, deeper, more even coverage. The unit costs about $150 for the machine, and well worth every penny. Detail one persons car for cash and it pays for itself.Go to http://www.autodetailingsolutions.com for products. Meguiar's uses a # system to denote which product is which. Here is a listing of what they have so far. I tend to stick with the tan bottles, you cannot get them at your local Auto Zone and they are much much better than what you get from those places!Again, hand application is fine, and using a machine does not necessarily mean it will save time, it just means that you get a better outcome overall.Working by hand, go herehttp://meguiarsonline.com/forums/11/ShowForum.aspx #00 = Hi-Tech Wash - (Professional Line) #1 = Medium-Cut Cleaner - (Professional Line) #2 = Fine-Cut Cleaner - (Professional Line) #3 = Machine Glaze - (Professional Line) #4 = Heavy-Cut Cleaner - (Professional Line) #5 = New Car Glaze - (Professional Line) #6 = Cleaner Wax - (Professional Line) #7 = Show Car Glaze - (Professional Line) #8 = Maximum Mold Release Wax - (Professional Line) #9 = Swirl Remover 2.0 - (Professional Line) #10 = Clear Plastic Polish - (Professional Line) #12 = Cleaner Wax - (Consumer Line) #16 = Professional Paste Wax - (Professional Line) - Discontinued #17 = Clear Plastic Cleaner - (Professional Line) #18 = Clear Plastic Detailer - (Professional Line) #19 = Professional Cleaner/Wax Paste - (Professional Line) - Discontinued #20 = Polymer Sealant - (Professional Line) #21 = Synthetic Sealant - (Professional Line) #23 = Odor Eliminator - (Professional Line) #26 = Hi-Tech Yellow Wax - (Professional Line) #28 = All Metal Polish - (Professional Line) #33 = Quik Detailer (Trigger) -or- Quik Detailer (Aerosol) - (Consumer Line) #34 = Final Inspection - (Professional Line) #36 = Hi-Tech Wheel Cleaner - (Professional Line) - Discontinued #38 = Trim Dressing Gel - (Professional Line) - Discontinued #39 = Heavy Duty Vinyl Cleaner - (Professional Line) #40 = Vinyl & Rubber Cleaner/Conditioner - (Professional Line) #43 = Boat Wash - (Marine/RV Line) #44 = Color Restorer - (Marine/RV Line) #45 = Boat/RV Polish - (Marine/RV Line) #46 = Gold Teak Oil - (Marine/RV Line) #47 = Hard Water Spot Remover - (Marine/RV Line) #49 = Heavy Duty Oxidation Remover - (Marine/RV Line) #50 = One Step Cleaner/Wax - (Marine/RV Line) #52 = Quick Clean Marine - (Marine/RV Line) #54 = Boat/RV Gel Wash - (Marine/RV Line) #56 = Boat/RV Pure Wax - (Marine/RV Line) #57 = Vinyl & Rubber Cleaner/Conditioner - (Marine/RV Line) #59 = Quik Wax Marine (Trigger Spray) - (Marine/RV Line) #60 = Bilge Cleaner - (Marine/RV Line) - Discontinued #62 = Car Wash Shampoo and Conditioner - (Professional Line) #63 = Flagship Premium Marine Wax - (Marine/RV Line) #64 = Flagship Premium Vinyl & Rubber Protectant - (Marine/RV Line) #65 = Flagship Premium Marine Wash - (Marine/RV Line) #66 = Quick Detailer (Cleaner/Wax) - (Professional Line) #67 = One-Step Compound - (Marine/RV Line) #68 = Non-Skid Deck & Hull Cleaner - (Marine/RV Line) #69 = Quik Wax Marine (Aerosol) - (Marine/RV Line) - Discontinued #70 = Black Streak Remover - (Marine/RV Line) #71 = Canvas Cleaner - (Marine/RV Line) #72 = Canvas Protectant - (Marine/RV Line) #73 = Carpet & Upholstery Cleaner - (Marine/RV Line) #74 = Cabin Odor Eliminator - (Marine/RV Line) #75 = Glass Cleaner - (Marine/RV Line) #80 = Speed Glaze - (Professional Line) #81 = Body Shop Professional Hand Polish - (Professional Line) #82 = Swirl Free Polish - (Professional Line) #83 = Dual Action Cleaner/Polish - (Professional Line) #84 = Compound Power Cleaner - (Professional Line) #85 = Diamond Cut Compound 2.0 - (Professional Line) #86 = Cut & Polish Cream - (Professional Line) #87 = High Temp Mold Release Wax - (Professional Line) #88 = Universal Mold Release Wax - (Professional Line) #90 = Hull and Bottom Cleaner - (Marine/RV Line) - Discontinued #92 = Metal Guard - (Marine/RV Line) #93 = Metal Polish - (Marine/RV Line) 7000 = 8" Softbuff Foam Cutting Pad 7006 = 6.5" Softbuff Foam Cutting Pad 8000 = 8" Softbuff Foam Polishing Pad 8006 = 6.5" Softbuff Foam Polishing Pad 9000 = 8" Softbuff Foam Finishing Pad 9006 = 6.5" Softbuff Foam Finishing Pad A12 or A-12 = Cleaner Wax - (Consumer Line) APC = All Purpose Cleaner - (Detailer Line) APC+ = All Purpose Cleaner Plus - (Detailer Line) - No Link ASD = All Season Dressing - (Detailer Line) DACP = Dual Action Cleaner/Polish - (Professional Line) DC#1 = Deep Crystal System Paint Cleaner - (Consumer Line) DC#2 = Deep Crystal System Polish - (Consumer Line) DC#3 = Deep Crystal System Carnauba Wax - (Consumer Line) Dline = Meguiars "Detailer Line" of products EK = Engine Kote - (Detailer Line) - Discontinued Extra = EXTRA All Surface Cleaner - (Consumer Line) - Discontinued FD = Final Detail - (Detailer Line) - Discontinued FI = Final Inspection - (Professional Line) G100 = 6" Dual Action Polisher G100A = 6" Dual Action Polisher G104 = 6" Cordless Orbital Buffer - Discontinued GC = Meguiars "Gold Class" line of products HD = Hyper-Dressing - (Detailer Line) HP = Body Shop Professional Hand Polish - (Professional Line) HW = Hyper-Wash - (Detailer Line) IS = NXT Generation Insane Shine Tire Coating - (Consumer Line) LT = Last Touch Spray Detailer -or- Last Touch Foam Detailer - (Detailer Line) MOL = Meguiars Online MPLC = Medallion Premium Leather Cleaner - (Professional Line) - Discontinued MPPC = Medallion Premium Paint Cleaner - (Professional Line) - Discontinued MPPP = Medallion Premium Paint Protection - (Professional Line) - Discontinued NXT QD or NXT SD = NXT Generation Speed Detailer - (Consumer Line) QD = Quik Detailer (Trigger) -or- Quik Detailer (Aerosol) - (Consumer Line) QO = Quik Out Carpet Stain Remover - (Consumer Line) QID = Quik Interior Detailer - (Consumer Line) QWD = Quik Wheel Detailer - (Consumer Line) SD = NXT Generation Speed Detailer - (Consumer Line) SFD = Silicone-Free Dressing - (Detailer Line) SS = Supreme Shine Microfiber - (Consumer Line) -or- Single Stage (Automotive Paint) UB = Ultimate Bonnet - (Professional Line) - Discontinued UQD = Ultimate Quik Detailer UW = Ultimate Wipe - (Professional Line) - Discontinued W7000 = 8" Softbuff Foam Cutting Pad W7006 = 6.5" Softbuff Foam Cutting Pad W8000 = 8" Softbuff Foam Polishing Pad W8006 = 6.5" Softbuff Foam Polishing Pad W9000 = 8" Softbuff Foam Finishing Pad W9006 = 6.5" Softbuff Foam Finishing Pad WB = Wheel Brightener - (Detailer Line) WBD = Water Based Dressing - (Detailer Line) - No Link WM = Water Magnet Microfiber Drying Towel - (Consumer Line) 7336 = 6" Dual Action Polisher/Sander (Porter-Cable) 7424 = 6" Dual Action Polisher (Porter-Cable) BC/CC = Base Coat/Clear Coat (Automotive Paint) CB = Clay Bar DA = Dual
Action DISO = Dealer Installed Swirl Option ESP = Engineered Synthetic Polymers FWIW = For what it's worth IG = Stoner's Invisible Glass IMHO In My Humble Opinion IMO = In My Opinion lol or LOL = Laughing Out Loud LSP = Last Step Product MF = Microfiber Towel MSDS = Material Safety Data Sheets OB = Orbital Buffer (Anything that's not a PC, usually bigger and slower) PC = 6" Dual Action Polisher (Porter-Cable/Meguiars) PM = Private Message QEW = Protect All Quick & Easy Wash RB = Rotary Buffer RIDS = Random Isolated Deeper Scratches SS = Single Stage (Automotive Paint) -or- Supreme Shine Microfiber SW = Spray Wax TIA = Thanks In Advance UMR = Uniform Material Removal WM = Wash Mitt WW = Waffle Weave Towel - (Consumer Line)

[lordvic]

dang Whelan! that is some spiffy shine!!! ( i can't believe i just typed that sentence)But those swirls are exactly the thing i notice on my car all over it. I was wondering if i had them because I did something when washing it once, or something from the showroom as i did buy the floor model.But now i see, it looks like most of the darker paints on these cars seem to do that. I'd love to do what you did, But i don't have the tools or the know how. Wonder if i can find a fellow torontonian who can help me out

[Whelan]

There's bound to be someone around. Go to meguiars.com and email them, they can get you some people. Call them up and see if they know anyone. Or just go to the forum and look em up!A job like the one I did would cost a person at least $300 to bring that kind of paint back for a full detail.

[lordvic]

A little more than i would spend. So last night i picked up some of the cleanin stuff. I couldn't find the Macguire stuff at canadian tire, So i went with the Mother's Original Carnuaba car wax tub, a clay bar kit and ton of soft cloths.Washed the car with soap and water till it was pretty clean looking. shiny, but i could still see the swirls. Than went over peice by piece of th hood with the claybar. You are right, it's amazing how much crap came off. What shocked me more was the chips that became uncovered! Suffice it to say, After 2 hours of kneeding, Scrubbing, waxing and cleaning. I finished my hood, front fenders and front bumper. And wow it made a difference. Even my mother walked came by and saw it asked why it was so shinyHowever some of the deeper swirls and lines are still visible up close. I'm wondering if another coat of wax might help, or another coat of something else?I used a hand applicator for the wax. Would it have worked better with a powered orbital tool? Canadian tire was selling a cheap one for $50 that i might want to pick up then

[NewNeptune]

I must admit, I was skeptical about what clay bars could do. Up until recently, I had never seen the results of one in person. That is, until McDonald's decided to repaint my car. (Sidebar: fine mist of beige paint on the driver's side of the car one day through the McD drive through.) They had the car clay barred at the nearest car wash and my car looked better than new!

[Sublimewind]

It seems there is some missed here in terms of detailing... Whelan certainly has 99% of it coveredOne glaring problem i see is the use of sponges and mits... both hold dirt and you drag that dirt over the surface, creating scratches. If you ever drop your mit or sponge, many times you can get "most" of the crap out but not always... A brush is best, but not just any brush.. you need a BOARS hair brush. Yes, pig hair... Why, well A. its a natural fiber, that is both smooth and stays stiff in water.... The smoothness allows you to rinse the dirt out cleanly and the stiffness give you the power to remove that grime.... These can be found out there, the one place i know of it Griots garage (online) B. the brisles along with the smoothness of the fiber allows you to easily rinse out the dirt. While they are NOT cheap, they last for ever... If you really want to do it right, look into one... Another thing is NOT ALL TOWELS are made alike... 100% cotton doesn't always mean 100%... many times the threads are made pf a poly matieral that can cause as many spiderweb scratches as anything else out there... an easy test is to light the thread on fire..... poly melts, cotton burns (please, don't light the whole thing on fire, just test the threads) DO NOT USED FABRIC SOFTENER in your wash towels... while it makes them soooo soft, it's a WAX and keeps the towel from absorbing water as well as it should (in terms of drying a car) DO make sure that when they are in the drier, they get COMPLETELY dry.. and moisture can cause them to dry "stiff" and/or rough to the touch.Bag EVERYTHING, your wash stuff should be kept in ZipLoc bags, if they aren't already... you want to keep any contamination or cross-contamination from happening... just tossing it into a box at the end of the day is a good way to make things worse the next time... Towels can be kept in garbage bags ir in clean rubbermaid containers as your was/wax stuff should be kept in clean rubbermaid as well, if it isn't already. If your using a bucket, DO NOT let you wash mit/sponge/brush touch the bottom of the bucket... common since i know, but that is where the heavy stuff collects... Griots as i mentioned before, sells a rather expensive bucket with a "grill" in the bottom so you wash stuff never touches, but dirt falls through... cheaper can easily be made with a little ingenuity Clay is your friend, unless you happen to drop it... i noticed a pic that looked like the clay was put on the garage floor to take the pic... BIG NO NO... If you get ANYTHING that resembles dirt in your clay, YOU MUST PICK IT OUT... or you run the extream risk of dragging that across your paint and really scratching it. Clay only needs to be used once or twice a year, depending on where you live and how much air born contaminants your car gets on it... Polish is your friend as well. Clay, quick detail wipe down, polish to fill light scratches, sometimes 2-3 applications of polish can REALLY do wonders on scratches, then a good layer or 2 of wax... I personally like paste wax in the tub, but everyone has a preference.. Again, bag everything, keeping you application pads in separate bags.... You have to think CLEANER that you work, it's called detailing cause it's all in the details, not in the muscle you put into it... Forgive me if i just recovered many things Whelan went over in his detailing post...

[Whelan]

Hey Sublime, Good call on the boars hair brushes. I also would say use the two bucket method when detailing. And as far as the clay bar is concerned. It was put on the driveway after I used it. That is when I took the picture. They never touch the ground during the cleaning process and if they do, I replace them asap! I took that picture when I was done to show the effect. I bought this car in Aug. '06 and I don't think it ever had a detail like the one I did. Come the next few weeks this car will be overhauled inside and out for detail work, so keep an eye for some amazing pics everyone!

[scott_h]

One fun thing to do - I still do it every time I clay one of our cars. Grab a standard sandwich baggie, put your hand it it, and rub your fingers across your hood. In fact, do it right now even if you have no plans to clay. Let me know what you think, then do the same after you clat. In a way, I kind of follow a 3-bucket wash method (not all at once ). First, I have a rolling seat that I sit on, and roll around the car washing just the tires, rims and bottom of the car all around where it gets the grimiest. I use a couple brushes on the tires/rims and a soft mitt that has the 'bug scrub' backing on the other side for when I really need to scrub to get the gunk off (like the bugs on the front bumper). I dump the bucket when I'm done with that. I then put fresh water/soap in the bucket, and get a different mitt. I use that to wash the full car, dunking the mitt in another bucket of simply water to rinse of the gunk now and then.