GenVibe - Community for Pontiac Vibe Enthusiasts

Recently been smelling raw gas under the hood, I replaced the fuel injector o rings and it seemed to stop for a few days , but has returned ? I cannot see any visible leaks...for sure its gas though. Can a injector go bad and start leaking vapors ? Is the fuel pressure regulator removable ? Thats the only thing I can see that may leak outside the injectors. Sucks....I have some beautiful wheather and cannot open the recirculation door Thx in advance !

What about the exhaust donut gasket coming off of the manifold? That should smell like exhaust, not gas, but that could be a source.

What are the odds you might have a fuel leak at the tank or something? I know you said you mostly smell it when at a stop.

Mom had a leaky gas tank, and we only smelled it after filling up, or when stopped for periods of time.

Thx for the quick replay. Sorry I should have given more details. I can smell it in a couple of ways:

-At a stop with the recirc button off an fan on.

-after comming home i can smell it from the front of the car...from the left side of the grille opening, car is off.

-Car off with hood up I can smell gas near the injectors...so I took a chance and replaced the o rings. No luck with that

I had glanced at your other post about replacing the o-rings, so figured you did have it narrowed down to the front. Just thought I'd check.

Have you done a leak down test to see if the fuel injectors are losing pressure or leaking?

I would just find it odd that you're experiencing leaky injector or otherwise, but no other symptoms.

Per AllData, the fuel pressure regulator is in the tank. Though alldata is known to have discrepancies.

The fuel supply system is a returnless design. Most of the fuel system components are located inside the fuel tank. When the ignition switch is turned to the START position and the engine is cranking, the circuit opening relay energizes the fuel pump. The fuel pump will continue to operate if the powertrain control module (PCM) receives a reference signal when the engine is started. The fuel pump operates as long as the circuit opening relay is energized by the PCM. When the circuit opening relay is de-energized, the fuel pump will stop operating. The fuel pump delivers fuel to the fuel rail at high pressure. The fuel pressure regulator, located in the fuel tank, is responsible for keeping the fuel pressure at 301-347 kPa (44-50 psi).

Here are the few things alldata has on the fuel system. If these don't work, shoot me a message and I will send you the PDF.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1g1CMOy ... sp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1m7SPxY ... sp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/11aePKm ... sp=sharing

Yes the odor is very strong near the 1 and 2 injector ( it was also strong near those injectors BEFORE the new o rings ) so I beleive im on the right track. During installation I did notice that the replacement o rings did fit looser than the OEM ones. I went ahead and threw them on anyway....since I had to stretch the old ones off...so I figured I could not put the old ones back on. The issue is that I cannot find a OEM kit that supplies the upper and lower o ring, so I went with a Beck Arnley kit that supplied both upper and lower o rings. I could only find the OEM lower o rings. The leak is actually worse now, i saw a little pooling around injector 2 today...im getting nervous here. I dont want to breathe in gas fumes nor do I want a engine fire. Im starting to think bad fitment of the replacement o rings made the leak worse. I have never done a leak down test on injectors before.

As a side note Im all for these cars lasting upwards of 300K....however you dont hear about the maintenance that is needed for a high mileage car. I just replaced 4 ignition coils, I beleive my water pump is leaking and my brakes started grinding. Sheeesh....I baby this car too. All my maintenence has been in a timely manner since I bought it at 38K. I never had repairs lined up back to back in my 12 years of owning this car. Yes....I had to vent

Gotcha. I'll do some research and see what i can find for the o-rings. I am assuming you checked with toyota too?

Yeah, once they get up there in age maintenance can either add up fast, or not at all. That's why I ended up selling my old '03. Needed some love, and it wasn't worth investing it in, when I could buy another for the same cost that doesn't need love.

Downfall of that, now I have an '04 GT w/ 100k that leaks more oil. In fact, my 280k '03 didn't leak a drop of oil. Minus needed suspension and rust repair, and some paint, it ran flawlessly.

It is still worth the maintenance. You don't have a car payment, you know the car, and it still runs good. Just needs a things here and there.

Oh absolutely. A car payment would be 3-4000K a year, and that's NOT including higher insurance rates. I would NEVER spend that much on parts even on a bad year. So its still a good financial decision to keep her. Thanks for your help too !

Hi cptnsolo77, regarding the leak down test on your fuel injectors, is the car hard to start? If you have a leaky injector the fuel pressure will drop in the fuel rail as the car sits. The leaky injector will leak the fuel into the cylinder which will misfire at startup because that cylinder is flooded with fuel from the leaky injector. The longer the car sits, the worse the starting gets with a leaky injector. A bad fuel pressure regulator and/or check valve on the return fuel line can cause a pressure drop in the fuel rail too but you would not have the misfire from a flooded cylinder at start up like you would from a bad injector.

You can hook up a fuel pressure gauge to the fuel line to watch the pressure over time once the car is turned off. The problem with the Vibe is that Toyota never put a schrader valve in the fuel line so there is no place to hook up a test gauge. I have posted on here before about the setup that is needed to test the fuel pressure. If you search, you should find it. The adapter required for this is no longer made but you may find one on ebay.

As the car sits over night, does it start hard and have to be cranked over a lot before starting? Does the fuel pressure have to build back up before the engine starts? It is also possible that you have a cracked fuel rail. It may only leak or spray out under pressure. Can you run the engine with the top cover off and watch around or see any clean spots on the engine where fuel might be washing dirt from the surface of the engine. Pooling around an injector is not safe and the "O" rings need to fit properly. Lubricate the "O" rings before installing the injector to prevent the ring from rolling or tearing as the injector is installed.

Hope any of this will you and good luck with the troubleshooting.

This may be the OEM kit for ya.

https://www.ebay.com/i/331954183959?chn ... ZQEALw_wcB

Or, the individual part #'s listed in that kit: 90301-A0036 and 90301-07037

https://www.toyotapartsdeal.com/oem/toy ... a0036.html

https://www.toyotapartsdeal.com/oem/toy ... 07037.html

Hey Thanks for you going out of your way to help. I was able to find the OEM orings ( both of them at the local delaership ) 32 bux total. The car starts/drives otherwise, no issues no CEL. Just a strong gas odor near the injectors. Im going to give the OEM o-rings a shot and see what happens. It only make sense to me that the generic o rings do not fit well because the leak got worse with them. I did double check that they were all seated correctly before I tightened everything.Yes I did lubricate them with silicone spray before installation. Im going to try again to see if I can find any visible leaks....the odor is pretty darn strong. This is my only car so im hoping nothing happens before I repair it Its crazy because of how STRONG the odor is you would THINK that a leak would be easily seen, unless its just gas vapors.

Lub "O" rings with oil, do not use silicone. The smallest amounts of silicone can ruin a catalytic convertor.

Gasket silicone used on engines had to changed when catalytic convertors were first used on cars because of this problem. The silicone gasket would out gas into the crankcase, then the PCV valve would suck the silicone vapor/particals into the combustion process, and finally out the exhaust where the silicone particles coat the catalyst, ruining the convertor. Only use the proper approved silicone around a engine where there is a convertor.

Ok its DEFINITELY the disc that LOOKS like a pressure regulator on the fuel rail. Theres small amount of gas seeping from it. Everytime I looked for a pressure regulator it say IN TANK....so whats that disc on the fuel rail ?....well time to go to work

https://www.megaparts.eu/en/product/1047555766

I dunno if that is sold separate. I don't even know what I'd call it. Is it a check valve?

Looks like Toyota calls that "PIPE SUB-ASSEMBLY, FUEL"

https://www.toyotapartsdeal.com/oem/toy ... 22061.html

https://www.toyotapartsdeal.com/oem-toy ... l=&Filter=()

Here's one on eBay.

https://www.ebay.com/i/132571311999?chn ... PVEALw_wcB

I don't think it's separate either. Local dealer wants 162 bucks I can go to the local u pull it and I'm sure I can find another one out of a Corolla.... but I really hate to do all that work to put on a used part. I have no problem spending $100 on the part to fix it. Cheapest Toyota online parts dealer I found for 88$ plus shipping but I have to wait almost a week....ugh....

Ok I finally found out what that disc on the fuel rail is called. It's a fuel pulsation damper. It's designed to smooth out the fuel pulsation from the fuel delivery system. It has a diaphragm in it that can go bad and leak. So far from what I can find it's not a separate piece and is part of the fuel rail. At least we know whàt it is now.

This says it fits, but it's also ebay, so who knows. When googling the part number the provide, doesn't give much info on it.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Toyota-1-8L-Fu ... 2533348058

Almost like its a obscure part OR doesnt go bad very often. Im going to go ahead and just get the whole rail. From the stock photos of toyota parts dealers online the drawing shows the fuel damper and rail as one piece. I dont wanna chance getting the fuel damper to find it doesnt fit.

OK....looks like it was the fuel pulsation damper. It has one full week and zero gas odors.This part is not seperate and is built into the fuel rail. 100 bux shipped here : https://parts.conicellitoyotaofconshoho ... 2380722061

I know $100 is more than you wanted to spend, but worth it to prevent an engine fire

Glad that fixed it for ya. Conicelli Toyota is a great place to get OEM parts for pretty reasonable prices.

zbyers wrote: ↑Mon Dec 23, 2019 4:06 am Glad that fixed it for ya. Conicelli Toyota is a great place to get OEM parts for pretty reasonable prices.

Yes They are...when I was replacing my engine/tranny mounts a member mentioned them. I saved a good amount of money using them over olathetoyota. I will be using them for all my OEM parts now, and I wish I would have known about them sooner. Yeah....its 100 bux i didnt want to spend, but a NEWER car will cost me $400 - $500 a month....that includes car payment, ins and gas. No way Im going to ever spend 4 -5K on repairs a year on the Vibe. so ill keep her till she blows blue smoke out the tailpipe

Thanks for your help !

jolt wrote: ↑Wed Dec 04, 2019 12:27 am
You can hook up a fuel pressure gauge to the fuel line to watch the pressure over time once the car is turned off. The problem with the Vibe is that Toyota never put a schrader valve in the fuel line so there is no place to hook up a test gauge. I have posted on here before about the setup that is needed to test the fuel pressure. If you search, you should find it. The adapter required for this is no longer made but you may find one on ebay.

Jolt, is this where you describe hooking up the gauge?: viewtopic.php?t=45481#p514969

I'm wondering because I've been trying to test the pressure on my base '03 and I rented a gauge kit from Autozone, but I am having a hard time hooking it up. (The pdf in that topic is a broken link.) The instructions you gave are to disconnect the fuel line where? As far as I can tell there are two locations. Nearer to the fuel rail and as it comes up into the engine bay. I think the matrix instructions (hosted on madstyle1972) are for the latter. There is a quick connect fitting there and I was thinking of sliding the one tester hose piece over the male end and using hose clamps and removing the female receptacle from the other end (going to the engine) and using hose clamps as well (clamps come with the test kit). I assume that piece is removable. Kit has a T type adapter with two male ends and a schrader valve fitting in the middle.

Any help clarifying the procedure would be much appreciated.

That is the link that showed the tester from GM that is used to hook to the lines. If I remember that was for a second gen Vibe. I would guess that the first gen would be close to the same thing, but if I remember right, the first gen took a different tester hose setup then the second gen did. Here are some cuts from manual for a 2009 with info on it:

#Using the J 43178 , disconnect the quick connect coupling of the fuel feed hose from the fuel feed pipe of the fuel rail. Use a shop towel in order to catch any remaining fuel that may leak. Refer to Metal Collar Quick Connect Fitting Service.

#Install the J 42982 between the fuel feed pipe of the fuel rail and of the fuel feed hose.

Do not cut the fuel line. Fuel Line Disconnect Tool J-43178 https://www.toolsource.com/fuel-line-di ... 47232.html or something similar to get the line off the fuel rail, that is the quick connect fitting for fuel injection systems. I have not seen a fuel pressure test kit that had the proper fittings for the second gen Vibe to test pressure with so cross your figures. You are dealing with with ~45 psi of fuel. The ends do not come off the fuel line. In most cases the ends are fused to the hose for safety reasons as any fuel leak can set the whole car on fire. Four causes of fuel pressure drop are a bad fuel pump, leaks in the lines, bad fuel injector, or a bad fuel pressure regulator.

Thanks. I'm talking about first gen (2003). I wasn't about to cut the fuel line. The instructions here seem to indicate the connector comes out of the tube ("take out the fuel tube connector from its tube"):

And the tube they want you to buy is this

And the setup looks like this


In any case, there are two ends to that fuel tube, and I can imagine setting up a pressure gauge at either end. But the key to me seems that this indicates the fuel tube connector comes out of the tube. And if that's the case I should be able to take it out and use a T with a generic test kit... perhaps.