GenVibe - Community for Pontiac Vibe Enthusiasts

I was in Advance Auto today getting some plugs for the boat and seen some Bosch Platinum+4. I bought 4 of them for the vibe to see how they will perform. LOL, there are no plug wires each cylinder has its own coil right on top of each plug. http://www.boschusa.com/AutoParts/Spark ... inumPlus4/

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LOL, stock plug about 5" down.

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"That thing got a hemi in it?"

So how are they???

Not sure yet. Didn't have time today to take it for a run. I'm going golfing tomorrow and will see how she runs.

What did they cost total? Cause if you report back you noticed a good performance gain, it's definitely a low-cost, easy upgrade to do!

quote:What did they cost total? Cause if you report back you noticed a good performance gain, it's definitely a low-cost, easy upgrade to do!Not sure about low cost. They where little over $25 for four plugs. The stock plugs are DENSO Iridium. From what I read, they are the best plugs out our engines.

DENSO Iridium are stock.

I think he's asking which you say are best, Denso or Bosch...And how do you get that plug out from in there?

quote:I think he's asking which you say are best, Denso or Bosch...LOL, not sure yet. Going to test it out tomorrow.

quote:And how do you get that plug out from in there?Spark plug socket with a rubber insert on an extension.

This is C.O.P.(coil on plug) technology! By eliminating the wire you reduce the resistance and falabilty of the carbon pile based wire! But you exponentionaly increase the cost of fixing any ignition problem! The shop you got you has to have the right equipment to diagnose COP ignition systems and being in the parts selling business I can only expect that a single 'coil assembly' is going to be worth a mint! Never mind the ignition control module where all these link to, that is going to be huge bucks! I use NGK Iridium plugs in my vibe, acually NGKs in every motor I own. I have seen people have probs with the plus 4 before, you can't gap them so they have to be very careful when choosing the proper plug, and if you ask any electrition he will tell you that electricity takes every path available to ground which means that whatever energy is focused into the tip is possibly split and not carrying all the energy in one hard blue spark!

Rasermon - what's the word? Have you gone out golfing yet?

quote:Rasermon - what's the word? Have you gone out golfing yet?Yes, just got home about 30 mins ago. I didn't see any difference with these plugs over the stock plugs. I'll keep you posted if anything changes.

Good to know. Save myself the dough until I hear otherwise.

In case anyone wants to know I asked the NGK rep for my area and NGK does in fact make the Denso brand plug. The same as Motorcraft and Autolite!

Changed to Denso iridium IK20 5304 on my GT. Smaller tip, bigger spark and easier to fire. I did feel an improvement especially in the lower RPMs. I have no idea if NGK makes it. These cost a bit more but are worth it. 30K expected life.

is that the same plug i'd use in a base model? i'd love to get a plug that gives me a bit more kick in the low end...

I think base is IK16-5303 and expect to pay more than $10 each.

Just out of curiousity, why did you change plugs? iridium is incredibly durable and long wearing, allowing as above a very fine electrode wire and thus lower voltage requirement than most. The stock plugs should be good for ~ 100 K miles, which you surely have not accumulated...PS: Re NGK building plugs for Denso, it's the other way around; Denso is a huge, diversified OEM manufacturer and builds plugs for NGK as well as for AC Delco and under their own name

The original plugs have a larger (longer lasting) electrode. The iridium electrode on the IK 20 is significantly smaller and needs much less voltage to fire a larger longer spark for more even combustion. Stock lasts 100K mi. These last 30K mi. I got a more solid even pull on my GT. I don't know if you'll get the same on a base but if ground wires are working, the plugs probably will also.

quote:Just out of curiousity, why did you change plugs?I was in the auto store picking up some oil and gear lube for the boat motor and seen these plugs and bought them. I have nothing against the stock plugs. I have notice a smoother acceleration at lower rpms.

I whole heartedly agree with you on the iridium plugs bill! These are the best plugs on the market right now, better than any platinum, plus4 or other! With the computer controlled engines today changing the plugs to a different heat range or material difference(especially down to a lower grade of conductor ie. platinum in this case) will do two things for sure; worse fuel milage or shortened life of related parts due to working outside their designed parameters. If you have radically changed the internal/external componants(turbo, s/c, cams, crank, heads, etc) then a plug change, at the very least may be nessecary! These motors are so tight to begin with a simple plug change will make no significant power gain at all! It used to be easy to drop a set of plats in to a 1980 350 s/b and really notice a better running, more powerful motor. Engines today are so efficient you really need to carve them out or ram in the air! But save your money on plugs these iridium have the premium price with the premium performance and you gottem already!

My Denso replacement plugs are iridium and did make a difference on the 2zz. The difference in this plug is that it's designed for performance instead of longevity. I didn't dyno it and never will and have no other engine mods. The ecu engine management seems less intrusive and its more solid at low rpm. Don't know if you'll feel a difference on the 1zz. http://www.densoiridium.com/performancetuning.php Tip is .4, stock tip is .7 . A stronger spark allows a larger gap and spark and better combustion at low rpm without getting blown out at high RPM. This doesn't always make a difference since stock is often good enough but I like these. It's the only replacement plug I would consider.

I don't see how you could "feel" a difference just by plugs unless the originals were fouled. Plus, the factory plugs are iridium. Reading from page 6-78 of the 2003 owners manual:Base = DENSO SK16R11, NGK IFR5A11 or GM Part No. 94859448; Gap: 0.043 inch (1.1 mm)GT = DENSO SK20R11, NGK IFR6A11 or GM Part No. 88969637; Gap: 0.043 inch (1.1 mm)*Your engine is fitted with iridium-tipped spark plugs. Use only iridium-tipped spark plugs for better engine performance.

These are Denso performance iridium-tipped spark plugs and apperently the gaps are the same so they fit the guidelines. The electrodes are even smaller and don't last as long but are easier to fire and throw a better spark. Guys on the Celica forum with 2ZZs have been useing these for some time with success. My guess is that I'm getting a slightly more complete burn where the 2zz has some issues. I was also a skeptic before I tried them so I understand where you're coming from. A 1zz may not benefit the same way but if grounding helps these cars, the spark may be involved. I didn't reset the ecu with the change so my impressions are for the plugs only. Oh, and the difference wasn't huge, just noticable. Here's from Denso:"Until recently, platinum was considered the best material to use on the top of an electrode because of its durability. However, Iridium is 6 times harder, 8 times stronger, and has a melting point 1200 degrees higher than platinum. Put that into a harsh environment such as an engine piston chamber, and you have a spark plug that can resist wear much better than platinum. Additionally, the DENSO Iridium Power alloy is so durable; it allowed our engineers to produce the world’s smallest center electrode (.4mm) which reduces the voltage requirements, concentrating its sparking power. Also, its smaller size, combined with the tapered U-Groove ground electrode, allows more room for the flame kernel to develop and produce a more efficient combustion." Stock electrode is .7mm. I also think the stock plugs are fine and most replacements are worse. I'm just relating my experience with the Denso IK20 in a 2zz. By the way, the stock plug is an SK22 not 20 unless it's been changed since my 03 but if it's rated to 100k mi, it will be the larger tip.

I just bought a set of IK20's. Wow, $12.99 each. I will install them today and report on my results.

Okay what pulgs should i get again,someone pelease explain? GT vibes come with denso irdium's right? SO why change it? Does anyone know which plug i need,to be one step colder?

quote:GT vibes come with denso irdium's right? SO why change it? Good question. Unless the originals are bad, you've driven 100,000 miles or you've added a supercharger, turbo or nitrous, there is no reason.quote:Does anyone know which plug i need,to be one step colder?What makes you believe you need a colder plug? Unless you've installed a turbo, supercharger or nitrous you don't want a colder plug.

I bought these spark plugs with no intentions on engine performance gain. It was something new that I wanted to try. I’m still amazed where the plugs are located on our engines. I have only worked on V-8’s and 6’s, so this is all new to me. Like Scott said, there is no real reason to change your plugs with a stock engine. My $25 for the new plug could have filled my gas tank, lunch and a diet Pepsi.

Thats right baby iam getting Nitrious soon

I just got the denso iridiums with the .4mm tip and I think they help in the lower rpms, it also is a lot smoother when I quickshift and accelerate, just need time to see how it does on the gas milage. I got em at autozone for $54.

I have also heard of people cooking the upper cylinder with the +4 plugs. I'm told that they should only be used in certain engines, but I don't know which ones.

what about these spark plugs?http://nology.com/silver.html

I checked my plugs today (~45K miles) They look pretty good still.At least I think so. The center electrode is conical. This is the first car I've had with plugs like that, so please let me know that this is normal

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the denzo ik20 plugs are much better then the OEM GT plugs that are denzo sk20r11, you'll notice the difference right of the bat when you change them. I would recommend any one with a 2zz replace the plugs asap to the denzo ik20 5304 plugs...they run $10.00 - $15.00 ea Autozone sales them. . . .

anyone got any more pics of the engine with the plugs out...want to see hwta it looks like before i tear nay plugs out.lol....and what are the BEST plugs to buy for the 1zz base motor?a denzo plug or ngk is what iam lookin at.

Quote, originally posted by Stang2Vibe »I have also heard of people cooking the upper cylinder with the +4 plugs. I'm told that they should only be used in certain engines, but I don't know which ones.You're right, Bosch plugs don't work well in every engine. Normal GM engines reject them like a bad implant. Not sure about the Toyota engine, because I would never put a German plug in a Japanese engine. Seen too many Bosch plugs cause problems in normal GM engines. Most of the time, the only way a plug will get 'cooked' in is if you don't use anti-seize when you install them, especially in an aluminum head.

i inspected my plugs at 30000km due to a rough idle. the plugs all have a white coating on them indicating to lean of a fuel mixture and there getting to hot.

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I changed my plugs @ 117k and HOLY S**T they were TIGHT !!! I honestly thought I was going break something ! After I removed them the rest was a peice of cake. Needless to say I was very generous with anti seize on the spark plug threads & the bolt for the coil/spark plug boot. Also put a dab of dielectric grease on the plug boot. Original plugs looked good with no signs of fouling. Im not used to old plugs looking so clean.The Results: Car idles better and the throttle reponse has improved. I dont know if that because the old plugs were worn or the new plugs are just better. So its a toss. I used NGK Irridium IX ( part # 5464 ) and did not gap them. I have averaged 28 MPG city since I have owned the Vibe so it will be easy to tell if I get a improvement in MPG. We shall see. Hope that helps, we sure have a lot of spark plug threads around here LOL.

My Vibe is an 03 and has like 180,000+ miles on it. I bought it two years ago with 158,000+ miles on it and have never changed the plugs nor do I know if they ever have been changed. I have never heard of this anti-seize fro around the threads of the plugs. My previous car was an old beat up 88 Chevy Celebrity and when I swapped in new plugs and wires on that I never used anything on the threads. What are the exact plugs I need to ask for at Auto Zone, and what is this Anti-seize stuff for the threads called? Is there anything else I should do besides using the stuff on the threads and changing the plugs? Everything is stock and my Vibe isn't a GT or anything fancy.

NGK Irridium IX ( part # 5464 ) Thats the number on the box. I have a 03 as well. The stocks are Denso. I dont know the part number. I used the NGKs for a possible MPG increase. I paid $27 on Amazon with free shipping. Hope that helps.