torn

[Mazzy21]

Okay, Vibe owners, what would you do?

So, I LOVED my 1st gen Vibe EXCEPT for the terrible way it handled in the snow. I have been told by other previous Vibe owners that their Vibes did just fine in snow, but I've also read on here a couple posts of people with 2005 bases (what I had) also had this issue. I can't help but wonder if it's somehow just that year or a couple years surrounding it??

Anyway, so I now have a 2009 GT. I hate it. I loath it, honestly. I don't even feel like I have a Vibe anymore. It seemed logical at the time, that because I loved my "old" Vibe, getting a newer version would be a good move but alas, no; at least not for me.

Now, there's a 2008 base, sun & sound package, according to Carfax - which I realize is hit and miss but that's all I have to go on - it had one owner and this owner took it to the dealer for every 'routine maintenance' and oil change and 'suggested maintenance' service for the life of the car to date. The dealership is selling it for $9K. I would have to roll over a large portion of the money I JUST paid for this '09 GT, BUT I'd at least have the car I loved back and I'd be paying on a car I plan to keep rather than one I have no intention of keeping any longer than I absolutely have to.

So I don't know what to do... Do I trade in this '09 that I've made 3 whole payments on, just accept and eat that rollover, and have my Vibe 'back', or do I accept that the Vibe's day is coming to a close, stick with the '09, and just wait it out until something else comes along that is comparable to that completely awesome and versatile car that I loved so much?? I just really don't know which is the better choice. Part of me says "why pay on a car you hate just to pay all over again on another car a few years down the road" and the other part of me says "don't be stupid. That's a TON of money you're going to eat if you roll over the cost of a just-purchased car.

So torn. Just wondering what you guys think??

[Caretaker]

Having owned a 2003 and now a 2009 Vibe, I would recommend you forget the Vibe altogether and get something better. Is snow the number one priority for choosing a car? If so, I'd ditch the GT and go get a Subaru. If snow is just one factor, I'd ditch the GT and go get a Mazda 3. If snow and utility are factors, you may want to look at the RAV 4 and Honda CRV. The reason I bring these vehicles up is because I have owned lots of Corollas and both Vibes. I think the second generation Vibe is far superior in many ways to the first generation, so from my perspective, if the GT (which I would never buy myself) is not cutting it for you, going back to a first gen seems like a step backwards not forwards, especially when you consider that you are going to take a financial bath for your decision on buying the GT in the first place. So I say get rid of the car you don't like, but refocus on getting a car that meets all of your needs. There are quite a few cars in this class that are better than the Vibe to include the Fit and others I mentioned above. If it is a first gen Vibe you want, then I would advise that you avoid the dealerships and find a one-owner used Vibe via craigslist and recoup some of the money you will lose on dumping the GT. Good luck.

[Mazzy21]

You seem to know your cars so I'll ask you - along with those you listed, do you know of any cars that specifically have the back hatch window that opens? That was/is a key feature for me that I'm missing on the '09. I'm also not liking the (what seems to me) far inferior cargo space. When I used to go camping with my '05, I could fit everything in the back; now, I just went camping with this '09 and had to stuff things in every nook and cranny of the car just to carry it all. It *seems* SO much smaller.

I do absolutely love the way this Vibe seems to hug the road where my last Vibe honestly seemed more than a bit unstable even in the most barely-wet conditions, and I'd love to keep that stability and control, but it seems to come at the cost of everything else (cargo room and utility mostly). I also of course like that I finally have what is now pretty much standard on all cars - the ability to connect my phone and hands-free talk and/or listen to my music, but I figured if I went back to an old Vibe I could just get the proper AUX hook-up and that would be taken care of.

I'm a fan of cars on the smaller side but with room to haul and pack if need be. I liked the versatility the old Vibe gave me with that back window being able to be opened. And of course, like all Vibe owners, I loved the gas mileage. But I am open to other cars. I just don't particularly know of any that offer the same level of versatility for the money. I'll check out the ones you mentioned though for sure!

[Chiadog]

Wow Mazzy, You sound just like me! Although my 05 Base is the 2nd worst car in snow I have owned in 40 snow belt years, I will likely be driving it till it dies! The reason is it's utility and efficiency. I regularly carry tools, equipment, lumber up to 12 ft. long. I also like the fact that it has maybe the best looking instrument panel I have seen on any current small car. Beyond that, If I was simply commuting, I'd be driving a Mazda 3, Ford Focus, or Elantra.


Did I mention "Easy to Clean"?

[Mazzy21]

Yes, very easy to clean too

Does the Mazda3 have the rear window that opens? There's one right here in town for sale that basically looks just like a Vibe. I don't know if the features are actually similar though.

[canadave]

Can I just ask, is the "Vibe is bad in snow" thing happening despite good snow tires? My impression always was that as long as you had good snow tires, you would be reasonably okay...is that not the case?

Spoken as someone new to snow driving

[Mazzy21]

I didn't have snow tires on mine so maybe it would have been better with specifically-for-snow tires, but honestly, I've never experienced a car with so little 'grip' on the road as my '05 Base. And still I loved that car, so I guess that's saying something.

I would prefer a car that's at least decent in snow (compared to my '05) only because I live in Michigan and obviously it snows a lot. As far as commuting to work that's a non-issue for me. I work about 15 minutes away so ~shrug~ but it still would be nice to not absolutely dread getting behind the wheel on those snow days - even if it is only for fifteen minutes.

[Caretaker]

certainly tires are the most important, and if you are really in a heavy snow area, snow tires are a must no matter what vehicle you chose. Regarding the back window, no; the first generation Vibe is the only car I am aware of that has that feature. We barely ever used ours only because we had the AWD version and roof racks, so if we were carrying anything really long for a long drive, the stuff went up top. Otherwise for short hauls, like you can do with any car, the hatch stays open for the entire trip home. While I have loved both of my Vibes, I certainly don't miss the first one (2003) too much. The seats were not as good as my '09, the radio was crap, no telescopic steering wheel, the steering was much worse, and it (AWD) was slower than a turtle. There are so many used Vibes out there to be had; even ones that the dealers have not gobbled up. If you really like the first gen, then I think you are in the driver's seat as far as spending little money to get back into one.

[canadave]

I didn't have snow tires on mine so maybe it would have been better with specifically-for-snow tires, but honestly, I've never experienced a car with so little 'grip' on the road as my '05 Base. And still I loved that car, so I guess that's saying something.

I would prefer a car that's at least decent in snow (compared to my '05) only because I live in Michigan and obviously it snows a lot. As far as commuting to work that's a non-issue for me. I work about 15 minutes away so ~shrug~ but it still would be nice to not absolutely dread getting behind the wheel on those snow days - even if it is only for fifteen minutes.

Well, I'm no expert, but I do know one thing for sure--if you're driving in snow without winter tires, you're going to think your car is terrible in snow. You absolutely need winter tires in snow, period.

[KITT222]

I didn't have snow tires on mine so maybe it would have been better with specifically-for-snow tires, but honestly, I've never experienced a car with so little 'grip' on the road as my '05 Base. And still I loved that car, so I guess that's saying something.

I would prefer a car that's at least decent in snow (compared to my '05) only because I live in Michigan and obviously it snows a lot. As far as commuting to work that's a non-issue for me. I work about 15 minutes away so ~shrug~ but it still would be nice to not absolutely dread getting behind the wheel on those snow days - even if it is only for fifteen minutes.

I have no idea how people can say the Vibe isn't good in the snow. Maybe it's the traction control for 05? Did 05's have traction control? Anyway, my 04 base is awesome in the snow. The two years I had my all-seasons I did decently. Then I lowered the car and put on some snow tires. That made it hilariously easy to drive in the snow. For example, when I drove all the way home on unplowed highways in THIS snow...



... after going back inside after taking that picture, and hanging around for another three hours, I forged a path. No ABS, no traction control, just me and my Vibe on snow tires.


Tires matter, and it just makes no sense to me (without firsthand experience in an 05 in snow) why people say they're terrible in the winter. That said, the 09 GT WILL be worse in snow thanks to its dedicated summer tires (or at least performance all-seasons).

ANYWAY... I say get the car you love. If you're willing to eat some cash to get the car you really want, go for it.

[zythr]

Since you are already paying for the '09 might as well keep it. You may find a 1st Gen, but will it be in decent shape? Dealers are frequently chopping prices, esp on the 1st Gen because of Pontiac's poor resale, and the brand and make are gone. Good luck

[thebarber]

Any car is good with the proper tires.

Get winter tires.

[Mazzy21]

Thanks for all the input, guys. As far as Vibe's go, I disagree with the resale statement. Vibe's still sell for decent money considering they aren't even made anymore. And on top of that, people keep them. Not so much the new ones - you can find endless supplies of '09s on the market - but the old style, they are scarce. There are 13 within 75 miles of me ranging from '03 to '08. I bet I could find more than that of most any other car (especially searching a five year span!), save maybe Subaru's, as people tend to stay loyal to those as well. For my '05 with 130,000 miles on it, the insurance company gave me $6200 as the current resale value/totalled payout. I don't think you'd get a whole lotta cars getting that much back with that many miles and 8 years old - plus you have to consider that the thing probably sold for easily under $20K new!

I agree that snow tires would make a huge difference, but I don't have room to store them. In addition, although again, I agree that snow tires would do wonders, I've never had a car that handled even remotely that badly without them (always bought all-seasons - including on the Vibe). A friend with an '03 said hers handled fine and another with an '04 said the same. I've read on here many people saying their Vibe's did fine in snow with regular all-seasons as well. Except the '05s. And they don't have traction control on the '05 Base (just an fyi).

The '09 is still at the shop. But they did tell me that the "comes with four new tires" that was advertised when I bought it was bs and that all four are bad. Beyond bad. They are 'lumpy'. I don't even know what causes that but I felt the lumps myself so apparently I'll need new tires if I keep it. The '09 does feel sure-footed on the road, unlike the '05 ever did. I slid in just-rain many times in the '05 while the '09 hugs the road and I don't feel in the least bit insecure even in torrential downpours, as was the case the night I bought it (nothing like trial by fire when you have a three hour drive home straight through the heart of Detroit with 6 lanes and barely- visibility! lol). So I can say that for the '09. I absolutely LOVE the way it handles (in comparison). Oh, and although they are going to be ridiculously expensive to replace and I see no reason Pontiac did this, I have to say, the more I look upon my 18" low profile tires and meaty rims, I kinda love them too.

But the rest of the car... I truly hate. Maybe I just got a lemon. While camping the outlet wouldn't even blow up my airmattress - while in the '05 I even ran an electric grill off that bad boy! I don't really understand what the deal is there either since they are the same voltage. Again, maybe it's just a lemon. ~sigh~

Anyway, so if I do decide to for sure go with this other Vibe - the '08 - I can say so far as I'm seeing, I'm pretty confident in it. It seems to be taken care of very well. All the oil changes and 'suggested maintenance' has been performed, at the dealer and on schedule. It has almost 90,000 miles but that's a drop in the bucket. ~shrug~ It's "fully loaded" - for a Vibe - and it's the Base, so significantly better gas mileage (like my old one). I did use the window feature pretty constantly actually and that's why I'm missing it so much. But I keep asking myself "is a window really worth that much?", "is a good outlet worth several thousand dollars??", "is more cargo space really that important when truthfully, you can utilize the back and passengers seats to make up the difference if you really need the space?" And I suppose, no, each one of those things individually are not worth several thousand dollars. But when I ask myself "which one would you drive until there's nothing left of it but a pile of rust?" The answer is hands-down, the old-style Vibe.

[jake75]

Your credibility dropped with the statement that you could run an electric grill off the AC outlet in the '05. I had an '03 - that is about a 100 wt maximum. There ain't no 100 wt electric grills. I am not a tire expert but is an 18" low profile tire good in snow? Unless you are old like me and have more money than you are likely to be able to spend in your remaining years I would get snow tires for the 2009 before backtracking to a 2008 with 90,000 miles that might not be any better. If the money is not an issue, get a 2014 Subaru Forrester. Based on what I saw at the March 2013 Columbus Auto show that would be among my top choices if I had to replace my 2009 Vibe - and I really don't need a 4 wheel drive. I sold my '03 Vibe for $9.500 and bought a new '09 for $12,000 plus tax at what was essentially a fire sale in Jan. 2009. But for that I would still be driving my '03. Even a $16,000 Vibe would not have been considered. I barely miss the hatch window that would open and the slightly smaller cargo space is not a major issue. I do like the added safety features in the '09 - ABS, Stability Control, Multiple Ari Bags. It also seems quieter. And of course unless I want, at 5,000 miles a year, I may never have to buy another car. But I probably will "want" at some point. I do have a very low mileage 2007 SWB T&C minivan that we use for long trips. The Mazda 3 and Honda Fit are smaller than the Vibe and probably would not suit your needs.

[Mazzy21]

It is/was a camping grill. No need to be mean and assume I'm lying. And yeah, I could be wrong but if money were no object I think most would go with a Subaru. I'm really only debating getting rid of this Vibe for the old style, or something extremely similar. While I appreciate that some did not use the features of the old style, I did, and miss them greatly. And that outlet thing, from your post, should I just assume this is something I should expect from this '09 - that the power outlet is also somehow inferior?? I figured maybe it had a short since it wouldn't even do the pump for the air mattress.

[jake75]

I didn't mean to be mean - thought maybe your memory, like mine, was getting iffy. If that camping grill was electric I am reasonably sure it exceeded the 100 wt limit of the outlet. I am 70. I have bought a lot of cars in my life. Five were used - three of those were a total disaster. So my experience buying used cars has been mostly negative. I take it a new Subaru Forrester is not in the cards. This old man then advises a set of snow tires for the '09 Vibe. I don't care what anyone says, miles matter. I once bought a Toyota Celica with a little over 100,000 miles. The engine blew 10,000 miles later. But as they say, your mileage may differ. Used cars are a crap shoot. And used cars also depreciate quite a bit once your drive them off the lot. I wish you luck whatever you decide. P.S. [The pump should have a wattage draw on it. Have not checked my '09 manual but assume If less than 100 it should work. [100 = wt is about 0.9 amp. ]

[Mazzy21]

Thank you for the info about the outlet. I honestly don't know what the airmattress pump wattage is. All I know is that last year at this time I was camping with my '05 Vibe and it blew up the mattress, I sat the coffee pot in the cargo area and set up a whole little 'coffee area' back there with creamer and stuff just cuz it seemed like a fun idea and that's where we made our coffee in the mornings (plugged into the outlet) and I thought I plugged the grill in too (it's truly a tiny thing for like eggs; otherwise we cook on the fire) but now you have me questioning myself on that. It doesn't matter... anyway, I absolutely know I blew up the mattress with the car on many camping trips and did the coffee thing cuz after that first time it just made me smile to have a kinda 'full coffee bar' while out camping. While this year, with the '09, I plugged in the coffee maker, it beeped/lights turned on, and then everything went off. I decided for whatever reason maybe this outlet wasn't as powerful as the '05's was (even though they are both 115V - I dunno. I was grasping at an explanation) and couldn't handle a whole coffee pot with the heating element and all, and so went to run my airmattress and that wouldn't even work. That's when I figured it had a short. But now I question that too.

My '05 had 130,000 miles when a deer killed it. It never had a single problem. My '09 has 44,000, purchased three months ago. It's in the shop as I type this. It's having some kind of timing issue and I think a baring might be bad in the tire-area. I don't know enough about cars to tell exaclty but hopefully you catch my drift. I don't feel as strongly about mileage but that doesn't mean I'm not considering your advice here. I appreciate it, along with your years of car buying experience. I don't think my '09 was well taken care of at all - now that I've driven it for a bit. And maybe the bitter taste in my mouth is more from the dealer I bought it from, considering it is/was supposed to be Certified, than it is from the car itself. So far I have had two completely shot wipers (part of the certification check list), one windshield sprayer that doesn't work (part of the certification), a broken radio knob (part of the certification), and now an unidentified noise that I feel like this slimy dealership may have just put some kind of quick fix/patch on that they knew would cover it up until any test driving was over, and that's why I'm only hearing this noise now, such a short time later. The dealership that has it now (a different place) is great though. They know it was bought certified and they seem to be trying to make right all the wrong of this other 'ship that they really have no association with other than them both being GM. They also know that I'm mulling over the idea of trading it in so they might be hoping to get it once they fix it.

PS - random - the reason I ever stopped in to this (new) dealership in the first place is because I had already been missing my old Vibe so much and they had a black Base sitting int he front of their lot. Turns out it belongs to their finance guy, but I mentioned to a salesman that if they could get him to trade it in I'd buy it in a heart beat. His response was "that car has like 240,000 miles on it! You don't want that thing!" and when I said "240? psft! it's just broken in!" he responded with "yeah, that guy loves that car. He won't ever part with it."

[jake75]

A coffee pot also draws way more than 100 watts. My 12 cup Coffee-mate says 900 watts. I suspect that your mattress inflator motor also exceeds 100 wt. I bought a 12 volt inverter for my T&C - it has a 150 wt limit. My guess is that these inverters have a built in overload cut off. Maybe that failed in your '05. But if it did one would think it would then blow a fuse. I have seen some 12 volt inverters on eBay that claim far higher wattage but I don't know how well they work from a cigarette lighter connection., Electricity in not my strong suit. Maybe someone else here can offer an explanation. Inquiring minds want to know.

[tpollauf]

Keep the 2009 Vibe GT ...... BUT do get separate all-season tires OR snows. Have them on their own rims and change them every season. MANY of us here do this and it makes the world of difference when winter rolls around. You're just an hour to my north and I run my Vibe GT with 16" all-season tires in the winter and have had NO issues whatsoever. Other than the hatch glass not opening I feel the 09 is a safer Vibe than the older ones. Interior volume has to be extremely close to that of the first gen Vibes if not identical.

[Mazzy21]

Well, when I first got the '05 I did blow a fuse twice. Could that really be it? Because I absolutely did use that outlet constantly while camping (and really constantly period but that was just to charge my phone). I am an avid camper which was what makes the Vibe partly so appealing to me. You can pack it out and still have room for myself and my 100# 'puppy'. I has the outlet which is so versatile while camping when you don't have electric on-site. So if it is true that something was actually "wrong" with my '05 outlet then really I'd like to figure out how to "break" the one on the '09 so I could get even half the performance that I got from the '05.

[Mazzy21]

@tpollauf - I don't know what the exact cubic feet of the interior are on the two versions, but I would say that even if it is technically the same, the design of the newer version doesn't allow for the same amount of stuff to be packed in. Maybe it's the slant of the hatch compared to the 1st gens or ?? but the 2nd gen really doesn't even come close to comfortably holding what the 1gen did.

[trb]

I know that our electric air mattress pump would blow the circuit breaker on my son's 06 Vibe also. We took it on a camping trip and I ended up having to sleep with the sleeping bag on the ground. I haven't tried it on my 10GT yet, but I also have a $30-40 power inverter that works great if I really need power. It is rated to 400W constant, 700w peak and can be plugged into the power outlet for low power, and it has clips to attach directly to the battery for higher power needs.

Looks just like this one, but red:


I've run all kinds of things with the inverter. Big screen TV, satellite box, DSL model and router all at the same time when we had our last hurricane and no power.

I really do prefer the way my GT handles vs my son's base 06. I can push it much more with the stability control, TC, & ABS, not to mention all the other safety features on it. Of course we get "snow" maybe once every 20 years, so that is not a factor for us. I do kind of miss the rear window too, but IMO it is a minor inconvenience for the additional benefits you get. My son would take my GT in a heartbeat if I offered it to him!

[Mazzy21]

That's so weird. That's one of the many reasons I loved my Vibe - because it was so customized to car camping. I can't explain why mine worked, but it certainly did and I used it several times over many summers. This last trip I was thankful we had electric on-site since there was a big fat nothing happening when I plugged in the mattress. It would have been a most uncomfortable weekend if I'd had to sleep on that rocky ground!

[KITT222]

Best question to ask: If you eat some cash and get the first-gen, will you be happy? Or will you forever harbor regrets about keeping the 09? When you look at the car when you're walking up to it are you happy to see it, or are you disappointed in the vehicle? And again, will you be happy with the first-gen?

[Chiadog]

That's so weird. I can't explain why mine worked, but it certainly did and I used it several times over many summers.

Did you buy the 05 used? Previous owner may have upgraded to a larger converter.

[Mazzy21]

@Chiadog - yes, I did buy it used. If someone put some aftermarket stuff on it I thank them because that was a great little car.

Also, I've been thinking about my first camping trip this season (with this '09). It was with some friends who camper-camp instead of tent-camp. I was the only one who set up a tent that weekend, and since there were power cords everywhere (they had a Kurig set up on a table right outside the camper and basically a 'charging station' set up for phones - it was nothing like "camping" at all lol) I can't actually remember if I grabbed my cord and plugged it in to the car for my mattress or if I just grabbed one of the cords already plugged in and laying out. The reason that might be important is that the first time I actually remember plugging something in was when I plugged in my coffee maker in the morning before anyone else got up. The coffee pot turned on, beeped & lights came on, and then immediately turned off. The next time I used the car outlet was the next camping trip when it wouldn't even turn on the pump to blow up the air mattress. I'm now wondering if I blew the fuse that day with the coffee pot. Going to go plug my phone into it when it gets light out and see if it charges or if it does nothing at all. If it works then I can't explain why my old Vibe handled this stuff and my new one doesn't, but if the phone doesn't charge then maybe that morning with the coffee pot it was user error and the outlet *would* work just fine except I broke it. I may solve this mystery yet.

[Mazzy21]

@KITT222 - thought about your questions and they were excellent questions to give me some insight into my own mind on this.

When I approach the car, honestly I'm looking at it with derision and usually thinking "not-a-Vibe. This car is NOT a Vibe." And then I think I usually do a quick mental run down (without even fully thinking about it/being aware that I'm doing it) of all the reasons it's a not-a-Vibe which just reinforces my dislike of it - because I specifically meant to purchase another Vibe. Not just some random "little car" which is now how I see this car - as just being another generic "little car", like any other random "little car" you see on the road rather than a true Vibe. It's almost a feeling of being booted from a very exclusive club even though I realize how cheesetastic that sounds.

So, after thinking about your questions and realizing that I do that, when I was making a quick store run yesterday I purposely walked up to the car telling myself "you DO have a Vibe. It's a VIBE! It says 'Vibe' right on it!" and "What do you LIKE about this car?" And this was my mental run-down then:
Upon approach:
-There's that signature Pontiac grill that you've loved since you bought your very first Pontiac 20 years ago.
- From the front it's got that 'meaty' look of the Vibe
- These are awesome rims
- (slight mental waver) From the side this looks like any other compact car. No distinguishing Vibe-ness.
Inside:
-(wavered a litter bit more) - this radio panel sucks. It's super ugly. And doesn't glow red. ... I can't hook up my phone in a 1st gen though.
- This interior is awesome. I love it. Really don't want to give up these seats for the boring 1st gen look again. ... but is this car really worth just it's seats?
- Excellent handling. Puts old Vibe to shame.
- I've never had a car with such bad gas mileage. Never. True Vibes have good gas mileage. It's not a Vibe!

So yeah. That happened. ... I may have over-shared there. No disrespect to those who love their 2nd gens. I wish I loved mine too.

But that mental exercise did make me realize something very important - the real reason I'm wavering on this decision at all is simply because I don't want to be bored with my car by going back to what I was already driving for so long. No matter how much I loved my 1st gen, when I get right down to it, I want my 'new car' to feel "new". So by the time I was pulling back in to my parking space I was looking at the car like 'what can I do to improve the things I don't like?' I can buy new tires and maybe that will help with the unbelievably poor gas mileage (I'm lucky to get 22 mpg on it's best day). I can add a roof rack for cargo space. Maybe I can buy some small foo foo little girly embellishments for the dash to detract from the ugly radio...

I contacted the dealer yesterday with that '08 Base, but I'm not gonna go test drive it on Tuesday like I planned. I'm gonna try to stick this one out for a couple more months. I'm gonna buy those new tires; see how it handles when the roads start to turn to crap... We'll see. I don't know as though I'll keep it for long, but at least I'm gonna keep it for now.

Thank you, everyone. Your input really helped a lot. Without it I'd still be going back and forth endlessly. I really appreciate you taking the time to share your thoughts and help me out with this.

[tpollauf]

Messed up this post ... read next one

[tpollauf]

Wow .... this is really eating you up inside At least you're coming to your senses and trying to rationally see just where you're at with this dilemma. As an family of two 2009 Vibe GT's (three Pontiacs total ) I'm going to try to point out the pros & cons from my perspective and maybe allow you to rest a bit easier on your purchasing of this Vibe GT.

-There's that signature Pontiac grill that you've loved since you bought your very first Pontiac 20 years ago.
- From the front it's got that 'meaty' look of the Vibe
- These are awesome rims

This is what most of us buy a car for ..... it's appearance & appealing to the customer! Every time you approach your 2009 Vibe GT you just get that "good feeling" of how sharp it looks and you then feel good when you get into it.

From the side this looks like any other compact car. No distinguishing Vibe-ness.
Inside:

This is because it is shared with the Toyota Matrix! No Pontiac individuality here at all. Sharing components with other makes/models helps the manufacturer keep costs down so that the car can remain affordable.

this radio panel sucks. It's super ugly. And doesn't glow red. ... I can't hook up my phone in a 1st gen though.
- This interior is awesome. I love it. Really don't want to give up these seats for the boring 1st gen look again.

You could put a filter (red mylar film) on the inside of the radio display and then it would be red instead of white. Too much work though just to have a color change. Also I couldn't agree with you more on the seats Florida & back, 2500+ miles .. no back aches or any uncomfortable issues at all. Extremely pleased with the journey!

Excellent handling. Puts old Vibe to shame.

This is the big advantage of the "low profile" 18" performance tires PLUS the GT suspension package on these cars. Have you taken an off/on ramp on I-94 or I-75 yet at 80 mph? You don't sway or lean at all. It just hugs the road Very impressive for a small car

I've never had a car with such bad gas mileage. Never.

This one I can NOT relate to as I have the manual transmission and get 26-27mpg city and mid 30's highway. Keep in mind that all first gen Vibes only came with a 1.8l engine. You are now driving a 2nd gen Vibe with the bigger 4-cylinder 2.4l engine. It's going to consume more fuel and the auto trannys are geared more for "quick get up & go" rather than fuel economy. However, your driving behavior is the biggest factor in optimizing fuel economy. Take it easy & coast to stop signs & red lights well ahead of time if/when you know it's there & don't have traffic on your tail!

As far as your Vibe becoming a Boring ride ..... never! There were limited runs of our 2nd gen Vibes and this simply means you won't find that many on the roads at any given time. Now if you're driving a car that was one of say 700,000 made ... well that could be boring. The 2nd gen Vibes do not fit this category.

So yeah. That happened. ... I may have over-shared there. No disrespect to those who love their 2nd gens. I wish I loved mine too.

Over shared .... Never. That's what this forum is for and that's why us members here like to help others out

I contacted the dealer yesterday with that '08 Base, but I'm not gonna go test drive it on Tuesday like I planned. I'm gonna try to stick this one out for a couple more months. I'm gonna buy those new tires; see how it handles when the roads start to turn to (removed)... We'll see. I don't know as though I'll keep it for long, but at least I'm gonna keep it for now.

Wise choice .. for now anyways. Get newer A/S tires prior to winter (seek us out here first before buying tires ... lot's of helpful suggestions from us that have had to replace tires already, especially 18' rubber!)

[KITT222]

I'm glad I could help. At some point I wouldn't mind getting a second Vibe. Maybe a 2.4l base for the extra oomph. Just be light with the pedal, don't go from pedal to pedal (pedal juggling), keep ~3 seconds between you and the car ahead (gives you amble time to react instead of jerky reactions. Those truly are what cause traffic and bad mileage), and remember that just coasting and burn off speed, too. Other members get high 20's with their automatic GTs. It's all in taking it easy. Also, don't take forever to accelerate. I've found I get the worse mileage when I'm accelerating slowly from red light to red light and trying to hit 50mph between each light. That said, don't be speed racer, keeping the RPMs below 3500 should be sufficient, especially with the larger engine.

[trb]

Wow, 22 mpg is a bit low, unless it was only city driving. I get about 24-25 on my commute which is 37 miles, 75% highway and 25% city streets, but with some stop and go traffic on the highway. I do drive a bit hard on occasion; we have a nice cloverleaf intersection I enjoy. On solid highway driving I can get 29 if I try.

One thing to think about, if you have a smart phone, you can buy the Torque app for it that will connect with your car's computer via a bluetooth adapter (ELM327) you can buy on ebay for about $20 from a US seller. I use it a lot and have it set up to register instant MPG, average MPG, MPH, and a bunch of other things. Pretty neat tool to help you gauge your driving habits for less than $30.

[Mazzy21]

I drive about a 60/40 split highway/city. It seemed low to me too but I figured because it's the GT I may just have sealed my mpg-fate with that decision. Maybe the filters need to be changed. Lord knows that dealership didn't do anything to it before they slapped the "Certified" sticker on it. As much as I love the Pontiac styling I'm kinda kicking myself now for not just going with a new Matrix. In a year (when I pay off another bill I just acquired from my pup chipping a tooth (side note: vet care has become unbelievably ridiculous in $$!!) I may still look at the Matrix. But even then it seems I will be missing the same key features I loved so much on the 1st gen Vibe.

[thebarber]

The biggest issue with the 2.4 2azfe is that its the same engine they put in the Camry over a decade ago...the tech/design is far from up to date.

That said, driving style is the biggest factor in mileage. I get 30mpg in my 03 GT in the city...and that's with intake, header and exhaust...

[vibenvy]

To re-iterate what others have said, my mom and I see an average of ~26-28 MPG with 50/50 driving in our 2009 Vibe GTs (both 5-speed autos). I've gotten as high as 34 MPG with 99% highway driving, so it is definitely possible to get decent gas mileage out of the 2.4L engine. As others have suggested, one easy thing to do is keep your RPMs under 3000 when accelerating. Don't stomp on the gas pedal, just take it nice and slow when taking off from a stop sign, etc. This alone will make a huge difference. It probably wouldn't hurt to check the air filter as, since you said, the dealer seems to have missed a lot on your "certified" Vibe. A dirty air filter could definitely hinder performance and gas mileage.

[Mazzy21]

I apid attention to the RPMs earlier today and that is an easy adjustment I can make - thanks guys! I have been pretty shocked by the mpg even though I realized from teh start that the GT with the bigger engine wasn't going to get the 36mpg that my '05 Base got.

I have to take the car back in tomorrow. The dealership that is fixing things has to fix something on the back wheel that they had to order in. Then I have to take it back again because they also ordered a new radio while they were at it - though I don't really care about that; I suppose it'll still be nice that all the knobs work. I have another appt. at a tire place after that because the two back tires are completely shot. So much for that "comes with four new tires" part of the advert. The tire guy actually said "low profile tires suck. Even the new ones will go bad real soon." I'm willing to try to fall for this thing but seriously - can't it even meet me half way?? lol

[jake75]

Beautiful cars and beautiful women - both high maintenance .

[zythr]

Wow .... this is really eating you up inside At least you're coming to your senses and trying to rationally see just where you're at with this dilemma. As an family of two 2009 Vibe GT's (three Pontiacs total ) I'm going to try to point out the pros & cons from my perspective and maybe allow you to rest a bit easier on your purchasing of this Vibe GT.

-There's that signature Pontiac grill that you've loved since you bought your very first Pontiac 20 years ago.
- From the front it's got that 'meaty' look of the Vibe
- These are awesome rims

This is what most of us buy a car for ..... it's appearance & appealing to the customer! Every time you approach your 2009 Vibe GT you just get that "good feeling" of how sharp it looks and you then feel good when you get into it.

From the side this looks like any other compact car. No distinguishing Vibe-ness.
Inside:

This is because it is shared with the Toyota Matrix! No Pontiac individuality here at all. Sharing components with other makes/models helps the manufacturer keep costs down so that the car can remain affordable.

this radio panel sucks. It's super ugly. And doesn't glow red. ... I can't hook up my phone in a 1st gen though.
- This interior is awesome. I love it. Really don't want to give up these seats for the boring 1st gen look again.

You could put a filter (red mylar film) on the inside of the radio display and then it would be red instead of white. Too much work though just to have a color change. Also I couldn't agree with you more on the seats Florida & back, 2500+ miles .. no back aches or any uncomfortable issues at all. Extremely pleased with the journey!

Excellent handling. Puts old Vibe to shame.

This is the big advantage of the "low profile" 18" performance tires PLUS the GT suspension package on these cars. Have you taken an off/on ramp on I-94 or I-75 yet at 80 mph? You don't sway or lean at all. It just hugs the road Very impressive for a small car

I've never had a car with such bad gas mileage. Never.

This one I can NOT relate to as I have the manual transmission and get 26-27mpg city and mid 30's highway. Keep in mind that all first gen Vibes only came with a 1.8l engine. You are now driving a 2nd gen Vibe with the bigger 4-cylinder 2.4l engine. It's going to consume more fuel and the auto trannys are geared more for "quick get up & go" rather than fuel economy. However, your driving behavior is the biggest factor in optimizing fuel economy. Take it easy & coast to stop signs & red lights well ahead of time if/when you know it's there & don't have traffic on your tail!

As far as your Vibe becoming a Boring ride ..... never! There were limited runs of our 2nd gen Vibes and this simply means you won't find that many on the roads at any given time. Now if you're driving a car that was one of say 700,000 made ... well that could be boring. The 2nd gen Vibes do not fit this category.

So yeah. That happened. ... I may have over-shared there. No disrespect to those who love their 2nd gens. I wish I loved mine too.

Over shared .... Never. That's what this forum is for and that's why us members here like to help others out

I contacted the dealer yesterday with that '08 Base, but I'm not gonna go test drive it on Tuesday like I planned. I'm gonna try to stick this one out for a couple more months. I'm gonna buy those new tires; see how it handles when the roads start to turn to (removed)... We'll see. I don't know as though I'll keep it for long, but at least I'm gonna keep it for now.

Wise choice .. for now anyways. Get newer A/S tires prior to winter (seek us out here first before buying tires ... lot's of helpful suggestions from us that have had to replace tires already, especially 18' rubber!)

Good information you gave to him. Obviously, he wants another 1st Gen, and he's looking for assurance he is doing the right thing, or he would not be questioning his decision on getting the 09.

[zythr]

Not really torn, You want a 1st Gen and want justification from members of this group in that decision. Sell the 09, (if you can) find an 08 since it will have the best chance of being maintained,( plus as an added bonus it was the last of the 1st Gen) loaded and you'll be happier. Sure the 2.4 is quicker, but it is a Camry motor, not a "sports car" engine. Besides, why even buy the 09-10 Vibe, when the better purchase, IMO would be the Scion XB.

[vibenvy]

Good information you gave to him. Obviously, he wants another 1st Gen, and he's looking for assurance he is doing the right thing, or he would not be questioning his decision on getting the 09.

The original poster is female .

[Mazzy21]

zythr isn't wrong. If money were no object I would ditch the '09 in a heartbeat and go back to a 1st gen. My only wibbling on this comes from the plain and simple fact that buying a car and then four months later trading it in is never a financially sound idea, and the fact that if I did this, not only would I have to contend with those financial issues, but also with (as previously mentioned) the fact that getting an almost identical car to the one you've been driving for years prior doesn't lend itself to that fun "new car" feeling, which could itself insight a feeling of "this was a poor decision" and leave me in the same boat. Bottom line is, for me, of the two (1st vs. 2nd gen), the 1st gen is everything I want and need in my vehicle and the 2nd gen falls way short of that. The 1st gen is a small enough car that I can handle it easily while still giving me the 'hauling' capacity of having a smaller truck, and being dependable and (at least as far as my old one was concerned) maintenance free. As a single female that is very appealing.

But as we all know, Vibes aren't plentiful on the Used market. 2nd gens, in comparison, are a dime a dozen, but 1st gens are almost non-existent. I had the same idea zythr mentioned - find a loaded out '08 - but the closest I could come to that was to find a couple 'everything but ABS/traction control' 1st gens out there. I first searched 100 miles out, then 200, then 500, then "any distance" which I assume means a search of the entire US, and there's not one. Not even ONE '08 'all options' Vibe out there. I expanded my search to '07s and still nothing. And so, it is a case of 'keep what you have and TRY to like it, or go back to what you had and settle'. Neither is a really appealing option which is why I'm choosing to try to stick with what I already have and make the most of it.

[Chiadog]

I have another appt. at a tire place after that because the two back tires are completely shot.

I hope you will get an alignment check at a good tire shop. I've heard Improper alignment can scrub off several mpg's.

[zythr]

Good information you gave to him. Obviously, he wants another 1st Gen, and he's looking for assurance he is doing the right thing, or he would not be questioning his decision on getting the 09.

The original poster is female .

Oops, My bad

[zythr]

zythr isn't wrong. If money were no object I would ditch the '09 in a heartbeat and go back to a 1st gen. My only wibbling on this comes from the plain and simple fact that buying a car and then four months later trading it in is never a financially sound idea, and the fact that if I did this, not only would I have to contend with those financial issues, but also with (as previously mentioned) the fact that getting an almost identical car to the one you've been driving for years prior doesn't lend itself to that fun "new car" feeling, which could itself insight a feeling of "this was a poor decision" and leave me in the same boat. Bottom line is, for me, of the two (1st vs. 2nd gen), the 1st gen is everything I want and need in my vehicle and the 2nd gen falls way short of that. The 1st gen is a small enough car that I can handle it easily while still giving me the 'hauling' capacity of having a smaller truck, and being dependable and (at least as far as my old one was concerned) maintenance free. As a single female that is very appealing.

But as we all know, Vibes aren't plentiful on the Used market. 2nd gens, in comparison, are a dime a dozen, but 1st gens are almost non-existent. I had the same idea zythr mentioned - find a loaded out '08 - but the closest I could come to that was to find a couple 'everything but ABS/traction control' 1st gens out there. I first searched 100 miles out, then 200, then 500, then "any distance" which I assume means a search of the entire US, and there's not one. Not even ONE '08 'all options' Vibe out there. I expanded my search to '07s and still nothing. And so, it is a case of 'keep what you have and TRY to like it, or go back to what you had and settle'. Neither is a really appealing option which is why I'm choosing to try to stick with what I already have and make the most of it.

Too bad you weren't looking a little over a year ago. There was a nice (though was in a minor accident) 2008 in Cleveland, well technically Bedford Oh. It was on the dealers lot for a while was under 10K and did not sell. It went to auction a Columbus area dealer bought it and it sold for over 10K.

[Mazzy21]

There's a loaded up '08 available right now in Defiance and it's even black, which would be in my top two color choices (I can't really decide if I like the Neptune or the black better on the 1st gens). BUT - it doesn't have the ABS and Traction Control options. So I guess it's "mostly" loaded. It's tempting to be sure.

[jake75]

There's a loaded up '08 available right now in Defiance and it's even black, which would be in my top two color choices (I can't really decide if I like the Neptune or the black better on the 1st gens). BUT - it doesn't have the ABS and Traction Control options. So I guess it's "mostly" loaded. It's tempting to be sure.

My guess is that these were not popular options given the cost. On a positive note - fewer things to go bad.

[Mazzy21]

Agreed that less "options" equals less to worry about down the road, but I am leery of not getting Traction Control considering how my '05 handled. It was my only complaint about that car, but not so much that it was worth losing/trading in, which is why I kept it through 4 accidents (not my fault - visit Ann Arbor and you'll be thankful for even your very worst drivers in comparison!!) and even a bent frame (thank you A2 driver who didn't notice the stopped gigantic bus in front of us) until the final deer hit it and the insurance company decided it really wasn't worth fixing again. This '08 is $9K, $9022 to be exact, so not a bad price (when comparing to the price of others for sale) but ~shrug~ it's not like I have to get a car right away, so I have the time to be patient and maybe find one with all options that would offer additional peace of mind in the snow - provided those things wouldn't crap out on me at some point of course.

[zythr]

Agreed that less "options" equals less to worry about down the road, but I am leery of not getting Traction Control considering how my '05 handled. It was my only complaint about that car, but not so much that it was worth losing/trading in, which is why I kept it through 4 accidents (not my fault - visit Ann Arbor and you'll be thankful for even your very worst drivers in comparison!!) and even a bent frame (thank you A2 driver who didn't notice the stopped gigantic bus in front of us) until the final deer hit it and the insurance company decided it really wasn't worth fixing again. This '08 is $9K, $9022 to be exact, so not a bad price (when comparing to the price of others for sale) but ~shrug~ it's not like I have to get a car right away, so I have the time to be patient and maybe find one with all options that would offer additional peace of mind in the snow - provided those things wouldn't (removed) out on me at some point of course.

If you're talking about Defiance Oh, be aware that the sales tax rose .0025%(?), effective Sept 1. I don't know if that would temper your choice of buying a Vibe in Ohio.

[jake75]

1/4 of 1% = 22.50 on $9,000. However, a Michigan resident would be paying Michigan sales tax - not Ohio sales tax, even if purchased in Ohio.

[Mazzy21]

OT: jake75 - I just noticed you were in Columbus. We shall have to meet back here to razz each other during The Game!

[Mazzy21]

Just for kicks, I emailed the dealership with the '08 last night asking what a ball park figure would be for what I could expect to get for trade on my '09 GT. Now I wish I would have left it alone because they just emailed me back saying that in their market, the '09 GT would trade for somewhere between 10-11k. All that did was make me waver again because even at 10k, I would be rolling over less than I thought and financially it would not be the huge bath that I'd expected to take. Now, of course, that email is nothing official, so that might end up being nowhere near what they'd actually give me on trade, but it does make it more tempting - a car that's only one year older, same "loaded" features, BUT it does have significantly more miles as mine is only at 44K and the '08 is at 89K. Although I kinda consider that to maybe be a wash considering how long Vibe's tend to run and when I factor in the cool but cost-prohibitive tires that I'm hearing will likely have to be regularly replaced on this '09 (two separate tire guys made comments about the lack of longevity of low profile tires now, since I've been calling around asking about prices for replacing the rear two). ... I really should have just left it alone.