RIP Subaru... Hello Vibe

[ripsubaru.hellovibe]

After almost 164K miles, our beloved '99 Forester just gave its life to save my husband's in a pretty serious accident. Thank G-d he is OK but needs another car ASAP. We looked at the new Foresters but - Alas! - Subaru has morphed our lovable little AWD wagon into... into an SUV! He doesn't want to give up AWD, but in this economy we can no longer afford the Subaru price. Our other car is a GM so the loyalty rebate is pretty compelling. As tomorrow is June 30, we'd appreciate any advice on getting a decent deal on a new Vibe AWD. TIA!

[Kamikaze]

Welcome Glad to hear your hubby is ok!Some others should be able to chime in on pricing on the 09's for you.

[jake75]

Who knows - the incentives may get better over the 4th of July weekend.GM doesn't even give their dealers any advance notice. My crystal ball is a little fuzzy but it seems to indicate that next, GM will convert the present loyalty rebates to rebates for anyone. I have not looked at new Subaru's lately - seems to me that I saw an ad for a new Outback priced at $20,000 several weeks ago. The Forrester was higher.Local Toyota dealer has advertised about $2,000 off the Matirx - that's $1,000 dlr disc and $1,000 rebate. The Vibe seems to be about $3,500. $1,000 dlr disc, $500 rebate, $2,000 loyalty.

[Kincaid]

Sounds about right - I was able to get a dealer to go about $1000 under invoice on my 2009, but to do that they would not give me the zero percent financing (that was maybe in lieu of $500 discount).I recommend Edmunds.com to price with options and see the actual dealer invoice (and they also tell you what "others have been paying" - though that is not so accurate these days with all the dealing going on).I also found that you get a good price going straight to the internet manager - however, they are very reluctant to deal off of that price. I got the feeling if I was willing to go in and negotiate hard with the sleezy salesman I could maybe do better than the internet mgr's pricing.Good luck!

[jake75]

The problem with Edmunds etc. is that they don't include at least 3 items that are on the invoice-1. gas - maybe $202. regional adv fee - maybe $3503. customer contact fee - maybe $20The actual invoice in my region for $19,480 msrp totaled $18,663.48.There is of course a holdback of 3% of msrp before dest - that comes to $565.35 [3% x 18,845] Then there may be other dealer incentives based on meeting a quota, or agreeing to purchase an extra x number of cars that GM wants to move.

[AKLGT]

ah good luck! the Vibe is a great car, however I don't think we'd get rid of any of our Subies for one, maybe in addition, but not in place. And yes, the new Foresters are now small SUV's, price is a bit more, but then again you're talking different categories of cars. You will miss the pep from the symetrical awd system to the Vibe's AWD, even with the newer transmission but enjoy the smaller price tag. Good luck in your search!

[michaelgt]

Quote, originally posted by ripsubaru.hellovibe »... As tomorrow is June 30, we'd appreciate any advice on getting a decent deal on a new Vibe AWD. TIA!My best advice is to contact me for the Employee price for friends (that drive competitor vehicles). You can then purchase at the GMS price on the invoice, and subtract the loyalty and rebate. This offer also expires tomorrow. Let me know. You will need to provide me the last 8 digits of the Sub VIN to be eligible.

[jake75]

Quote, originally posted by michaelgt »My best advice is to contact me for the Employee price for friends (that drive competitor vehicles). You can then purchase at the GMS price on the invoice, and subtract the loyalty and rebate. This offer also expires tomorrow. Let me know. You will need to provide me the last 8 digits of the Sub VIN to be eligible. That's VERY GOOD ADVICE!

[trask]

I am also coming from a Subaru. I sold my 2000 forester and bought a 2007 Vibe and then updated to the 2009 Vibe GT. I did not have very good luck with my forester and sold it at 80,000 miles. I do like the older Forester design more than the new 2009,the new 09`s are to big for my liking, and I`m sure the mileage will even be worse. I hope you will enjoy your Vibe, I have been very happy with mine.

[vibolista]

Good choice former Forester drivers! Welcome to Vibes. You have purchased a more frugal car that's just about the right size small Ute. Foresters are a great wagon, but like most cars they continue to grow in size every new model cycle.One thing to note... you really don't need 4 wheel/ all wheel drive symetrical or otherwise. Put a set of good snows on your front driver and learn to use them in the slick stuff. We've had major snow storms the last couple of years here in Maine, yet I've never had a problem getting back and forth to work in my 2 wheel drive... even late at nigh, after the road crews are off getting their ZZZs at home. 99.9 percent of the time you just end up dragging around a bunch of heavy hardware that adds to unsprung weight and diminishes your fuel economy. Get a good set of snow tires (and some AWD stickers for show if you need to)... and you'll end up saving a bit of money with a car that will be more fun to drive.

[AKLGT]

well, unless I get a summer car, I won't have anything less than AWD or 4WD now that I'm used to traction. Don't miss my 03 Vibe GT or our 04 base Vibe in the winter! However, I miss the great fuel economy, however last month while I drove around the new Legacy 2.5i, I avg 28 mpg, more than my Vibe GT and that's with 190 hp and AWD.When I originally looked at the Vibe back in 03, I test drove the AWD version (then) and it just sucked so badly, we got about a block away from the dealer when I turned back. That's when I decided I'd rather have the GT. Now, I'm sure it's much different with the newer engine as they have improved the AWD Vibes for 09. I'd still take a new Forrester over the new Vibe AWD, but then again, they are half the cost! and of course that's worth something!

[star_deceiver]

Nothing a good set of winter tires won't fix, 2, 4 or Awd. (Always wondered why the only vehicles you see in the ditch on a snowy winters day are 4x4 trucks.... all the computerized help and 4 wheel drive won't do jack if you're running all-seasons on ice!)

[Raven]

Not to put the Vibe down but Subaru is a totally different class of automobile. The Vibe is a cheap little rattle trap in comparison to the power, comfort, features and ride quality of a Subaru. I have a '92 SVX and 2 '97 Outbacks with over 180,000 miles on each of them and they far and beyond out perform anything my '06 Vibe can do other than miles per gallon. It's like comparing apples and alligators. I would buy a used Subaru (2 or 3 years old) for the same money you will be spending on a Vibe.Sorry fellow Vibers but it's the truth IMO.

[Ace]

I gotta add to this one. Seriously, I really doubt that you really need all wheel drive, I don't have it, and if there's anyone who really needs it, it's probably me. I live in the adirondacks, I'm a die hard skier, and I don't have the luxury of staying home when it snows.I've owned two subie's and now two Vibes, both Vibes being front wheel drive and I can tell you with a lot of experience that my front drive vibes, (with snow tires) are better in the snow than my subie's were with all season's. Personally I run studded tires, on all four wheels, and I have been able to get up mountain passes in blizzards and through over a foot of snow with no problem. In all fairness, yes I do carry chains, but I've only used them twice, and one of those times I probably could have done without them.I will say this though, if you live in the snow belt, please, whatever you drive, put snow tires on all four wheels. If you put them on only the front, your car will be dangerous in snow. If you choose not to put snow tires on, then you are putting both of our lives at risk. The way I look at it, if we are driving the same car, in the snow, and I have snows, and you are behind me running all seasons and I have to stop suddenly, I am going to stop much faster than a car running all seasons, and the car behind me will likely crash into me, and as we all know, denting a Vibe is among the worst things anyone could do.So please, regardless of what car you drive, if you live in the snowbelt, please put snow's on all fours. If nothing else, it's cheaper than paying the deductible on your insurance, plus, you won't buy new all-season/summer tires nearly as often.

[vibolista]

My cheap little rattle trap (no rattles yet, though) is doing pretty well so far. At 36 mpg average, it still continues to please my wallet. If I ever needed more comfort and luxury, I'd go get one of them thar fancy Beemers or Lexus.I also travel some fairly interesting winter conditions to go skiing, so I'm with Ace on this one. A good set of snow tires, good winter driving skills and a bit of luck to dodge the A/S crowd when they lose grip in whatever direction they skid off, will help save your exterior metal parts from getting dinged or worse. I've driven a lot of the Rockies, both in the U.S and Canada and the most unbelievable roads imaginable across the Alps in Europe, during Winter, all with front wheel drive and snow tires. So far, knock on wood, these little front wheel drive rattle traps I tend to love to drive in the worst winter conditions, have been a hoot! Plus, I've never missed a day of skiing or work due to snow.I've seen a lot of luxury and AWD gear trashed in ditches, against trees and each other, along with some of the little rattle traps that were probably running A/S or worn tires, or even worse yet, a poorly trained Winter driver. I guess I have been extremely lucky, or something all these years.

[jackie879]

I'm new here and just bought a Vibe GT over the weekend (so hello everyone!) I thought I would chime in because when I was showing off my GT to a friend of mine who is a former Subaru Forester owner ('98 I think), she drove it and said it was like a "mini Forester", and that was a very good thing. Having never driven one myself I can't compare the two, but you might want to at least test drive a Vibe and see if you like it.

[jake75]

Quote, originally posted by AKLGT »well, unless I get a summer car, I won't have anything less than AWD or 4WD now that I'm used to traction. Don't miss my 03 Vibe GT or our 04 base Vibe in the winter! However, I miss the great fuel economy, however last month while I drove around the new Legacy 2.5i, I avg 28 mpg, more than my Vibe GT and that's with 190 hp and AWD.When I originally looked at the Vibe back in 03, I test drove the AWD version (then) and it just sucked so badly, we got about a block away from the dealer when I turned back. That's when I decided I'd rather have the GT. Now, I'm sure it's much different with the newer engine as they have improved the AWD Vibes for 09. I'd still take a new Forrester over the new Vibe AWD, but then again, they are half the cost! and of course that's worth something! Half the cost? How do you figure? Maybe another 5 grand unless you go high end on the Subie.

[808 Vibes]

Welcome and good luck with the Vibe search!

[bull77]

welcome to genvibe

[ToolGuy]

Welcome! Buy what you want and can afford. I am assuming the Subi was paid for, buy a vehicle that you can pay off quickly, is great on fuel because you know it will be going up again and again. And lastly, enjoy whatever you pick.I never have had AWD living in Ohio and Michigan, never had snow tires either. All season tires are just fine, unless I were towing snowmobiles up to Northern Michigan, then I would need an AWD or 4X4. My 2003 Vibe is paid for, drives like new still, does not rattle and has been a great vehicle. I am not giving it up any time soon!

[ripsubaru.hellovibe]

Thank you all for the warm welcome and your very informative replies. Yes, the 99 Subie was paid for (back when we had more money)... we were just hoping we could eke out some more miles before it met its untimely (for us) end.I'd appreciate some input on our experiences so far at more than one Pontiac/GMC dealer we've visited. We'd assumed the dealers would welcome our business in this economy, but were shocked to find the salesmen to be totally indifferent. We even had to ASK for a salesman a couple of times. And they showed no motivation whatsoever to cut a deal with us - it was pretty much take it (MSRP) or leave it, and they had no qualms about watching us head for the door. It was unlike any car-buying experience we've ever had. We wondered if it was just a GM thing or if other dealers were the same way, so we stopped at a Kia lot - but there the salesmen were "textbook" - they pounced on us and tried to sweet-talk us into signing a contract on the spot. What's going on here? Are the GM salesmen mad at GM or something?

[ToolGuy]

I have heard the same recently and do not get it either! I am so mad at the big three, when my Jeep lease is up, we are buying a Kia Soul. All the air bags, the price, the style, the great warranty, it has it all!Let the big three get their crap together and build vehicles people want and get good fuel economy, then I will be back in one. Oh by the way, my Jeep is rusting and it is not even three years old! Rusting inside the door, right at a seam. Yeah that one is not an easy fix! What a crock!

[michaelgt]

Quote, originally posted by ripsubaru.hellovibe »Thank you all for the warm welcome and your very informative replies. Yes, the 99 Subie was paid for (back when we had more money)... we were just hoping we could eke out some more miles before it met its untimely (for us) end.I'd appreciate some input on our experiences so far at more than one Pontiac/GMC dealer we've visited. We'd assumed the dealers would welcome our business in this economy, but were shocked to find the salesmen to be totally indifferent. We even had to ASK for a salesman a couple of times. And they showed no motivation whatsoever to cut a deal with us - it was pretty much take it (MSRP) or leave it, and they had no qualms about watching us head for the door. It was unlike any car-buying experience we've ever had. We wondered if it was just a GM thing or if other dealers were the same way, so we stopped at a Kia lot - but there the salesmen were "textbook" - they pounced on us and tried to sweet-talk us into signing a contract on the spot. What's going on here? Are the GM salesmen mad at GM or something?I suspect that it is the dealer. With employee price offer, you would be able to buy at the GMS stated price. However, I believe that they may be able to reject the sale. If so, I would call several other, closest dealers and ask if they are willing to sell at GMS if you have the employee price certificate.

[ripsubaru.hellovibe]

Quick question - some of the Vibes we're finding are equipped with larger 17" wheels (which are expensive). Is there any advantage to them - are they safer? Do they save gas (fewer wheel revolutions to get from point A to point B)?

[jake75]

Quote, originally posted by ripsubaru.hellovibe »Quick question - some of the Vibes we're finding are equipped with larger 17" wheels (which are expensive). Is there any advantage to them - are they safer? Do they save gas (fewer wheel revolutions to get from point A to point B)?My understanding is that the 17" refers to the "wheel". The diameter of the tire is the same - it just has a narrower sidewall. So the revs are the same - the ride is a bit harsher, but the handling a bit better. Not of interest or worth it to me but I am an old folk - I could have said "old f---" but all would have probably put in the wrong missing letters!

[rAERRK]

Quote, originally posted by ripsubaru.hellovibe »Quick question - some of the Vibes we're finding are equipped with larger 17" wheels (which are expensive). Is there any advantage to them - are they safer? Do they save gas (fewer wheel revolutions to get from point A to point B)?they mostly just look better

[Kincaid]

My experience at GM dealerships was kind of the same. I went to the Pontiac GMC dealership twice - the first time I wandered around the lot for twenty minutes, looking at various cars and trucks, and then left. No one even said boo. Went back a few months later after calling and getting price quotes from the internet sales woman. They came in under invoice a little and were not willing to deal more than that.A Chevy dealer gave me an internet quote that was the same as their online price. They also rejected two offers I made and they didn't even bother to counter or even call back to follow up.Finally, the other Pontiac dealer I contacted and eventually bought my 2009 from was reluctant at first to move from their internet price but eventually was able to get them to deal.I can only assume that they are kind of circling the wagons and trying to sqeeze the most they can - meanwhile GM's corporate incentives may be keeping the traffic to the dealerships up a bit so they are not agressively dealing.OTOH, Chrysler seems to be having a fire sale, judging by their ads. But I guess when you got to move a lot of overpriced pick ups and 300's you got to come down pretty far.

[vibolista]

The industry is going through a really bad time... so sales people and other employees are probably not at their best, right now. Take the time to keep looking for a dealer that wants your business. Eventually you'll run into a good deal on a Vibe. Hang in there.

[AKLGT]

Quote, originally posted by star_deceiver »Nothing a good set of winter tires won't fix, 2, 4 or Awd. (Always wondered why the only vehicles you see in the ditch on a snowy winters day are 4x4 trucks.... all the computerized help and 4 wheel drive won't do jack if you're running all-seasons on ice!)I'd say that studded snow tires on a FWD vs studded snow tires on AWD.... AWD is better.

[AKLGT]

Quote, originally posted by jake75 »Half the cost? How do you figure? Maybe another 5 grand unless you go high end on the Subie.Most of the Foresters I've looked at are of course, turbo so you're talking $28K for a new 09 FXT vs $14-16K for a new 09 Vibe. I'm sure the AWD makes it more, but you're still talking a significant difference in cost! Subies are NOT cheap! Even the low end 2.5i impreza's are going to be $20K. Maybe that's because we're in Subie country here, so the cost seems to reflect the region. I know I sold my 05 LGT last summer with 54K miles, for $2K OVER retail book value. I could sell our 07 STI for $25K easily and still give someone a good deal and my 08 for $30K. Cost of ownership on the Subies is also more since the parts are not readily available like GM/Vibes.As I said, I LOVE my Subies and won't trade them, even for another Vibe, but wouldn't mind adding a new Vibe into the fold. the new 2.5i PZEV systems seem to work really well as I got awesome fuel economy the last month my car was in the shop and I drove around the Legacy. Still, $24K which is again, MUCH more money than the Vibe.

[ripsubaru.hellovibe]

Thanks, vibolista!You were sooooo right! Tonight we finally found the dealer, the deal, and a drove home a Good Vibe!

[AKLGT]

Congrats! we expect pics!!!

[michaelgt]

Quote, originally posted by ripsubaru.hellovibe »Thanks, vibolista!You were sooooo right! Tonight we finally found the dealer, the deal, and a drove home a Good Vibe! :-)Let me guess. Did you get a Liquid Platinum Metallic AWD with Auto, Sun & Sound, Preferred Package, 17in Aluminum, fog lamps, and theft-deterrent alarm?

[ripsubaru.hellovibe]

Michael! How did you know??? Not only are you The GMS Guru®... you're clairvoyant! ;-)Thanks again... you rock!!!

[vibolista]

Way to go! Pics! Pics!

[ripsubaru.hellovibe]

Thanks, will send pics as soon as I get a chance. We got a fully-loaded AWD for around $6000 less than what we paid for our fairly-loaded '99 Forester S about 11 years ago. Our deal was a combination of GMS (disloyalty discount thanks to Forester), $2000 GM-owner incentive (loyalty discount thanks to GMC Savana), $500 customer cash, and the fact that this car was an "older" 09 with the lower base MSRP on the sticker (about $1500-$1600 below the current MSRP). :-)Oops, a center wheel cap already fell off and is lost.

[star_deceiver]

Quote, originally posted by AKLGT »I'd say that studded snow tires on a FWD vs studded snow tires on AWD.... AWD is better. I guess the same can be said for weather you'd rather snowplow through the corner or fishtail and donut through, eitherway, it's always 4x4 trucks and cars with crap tires.

[lovemyraffe]

Where are the pics?

[Tubaryan12]

Quote, originally posted by Ace »I will say this though, if you live in the snow belt, please, whatever you drive, put snow tires on all four wheels. If you put them on only the front, your car will be dangerous in snow. If you choose not to put snow tires on, then you are putting both of our lives at risk. The way I look at it, if we are driving the same car, in the snow, and I have snows, and you are behind me running all seasons and I have to stop suddenly, I am going to stop much faster than a car running all seasons, and the car behind me will likely crash into me, and as we all know, denting a Vibe is among the worst things anyone could do.So please, regardless of what car you drive, if you live in the snowbelt, please put snow's on all fours. If nothing else, it's cheaper than paying the deductible on your insurance, plus, you won't buy new all-season/summer tires nearly as often.With all due respect for those of us that drive safely, the only person that will hit you in this situation is someone following you too closely for conditions.Smith Driving System: it will save your life and your cash more than snow tires or AWD combined can ever hope to.Tubaryan " no accidents" 12