Typical life of a hydraulic clutch? GT

[Dezz1]

I would suggest replacing it with a stronger one and calling it a day. The stock isn't really made for that block and vehicle size anyway.

[VGT]

My 05 Vibe GT has less than 31k miles and it bit the dust. I start it up one morning and I can't go over 45mph now. I just took it into the dealer where they tell me they can't tell me if it's going to be covered.This isn't my first Standard Transmission, either. I've had a Silverado and an Impreza RS with perfect clutches. I always thought this thing had an odd feeling clutch. It smells from time to time and it's been randomly slipping since about 23k. It got better during this summer and then came back. I literally cannot rev higher than 4k rpms. It'll just slip and I go nowhere. In all gears. I've been described as driving like a grandma at times, so I know I haven't abused it. I don't ride the clutch and I certainly don't rev high on take offs. Drive mostly freeway and a little city (Obviously nobody can drive 100% freeway. I'd like to see where you live then.) So, I'm going to find out if GM is going to cover it for me. I certainly hope they do. I would like to continue giving them my business. (I'm a big GM guy) But I've had a TrailBlazer that was in the shop 9 times in 3 years and I'm getting a little tired of this.I think the people on this board that are claiming it's all user related should really just keep it to themselves. How do you know how other people drive? You don't know these people. Congratulations for having a decent clutch.

[jamesmetairie]

even on "toyota nations forum" they talk bad about the matrix clutch. everyone says you need to replace it with a sronger stock clutch and no more problems. pontiac is showing their azz by not replacing these clutches with a recall.

[jamesmetairie]

NOT a stock clutch !! a stronger clutch. some brands are mentioned .

[joatmon]

Quote, originally posted by jamesmetairie »i was only trying to helpI was just having fun. no worries

[VGT]

Good news on the reimbursement front.The GM dealership confirmed that I did not abuse the vehicle to cause the failure. (The plate needed to be replaced). They agreed with me that I wasn't at fault and that 30k is premature for the life of a clutch used properly. They still claimed that it's a wear part and that I had to pay in full. After much conversation with Pontiac customer service, a letter to certain individuals who can actually make decisions, I am being reimbursed for the repairs. Appx 900 dollars worth.They had told me that if the dealer did their job correctly, I would not have to have waited this long and had my claim rejected over and over. If they had relayed the information to the GM rep that they relayed to me, I would have been covered. So, basically the dealer was a little shady in the whole thing. Needless to say, they the dealer) won't be getting my business ever again.This is good news for us GT owners. I know some people weren't as lucky as I was to get this taken care of. All I can say is, don't stop looking to get it resolved. If enough GT owners take the fight to Pontiac, it will make them notice a little more. After everything is final, I will post the contact information of whom I talked to, so that future owners have a way to get help.

[Hardrocker]

I just traded my '03 GT for an '09. It had 68,769 miles and the clutch was still working fine.

[gp20mushii]

centerforce dual friction clutch. solved all my problems and probably wont ever slip.

[Dezz1]

Dang dude you ride is sick.

[gp20mushii]

thanks dezz.

[Thewolf]

114,238 miles, clutch started to slip under heavy acceleration. That's maybe 50k less than what we are used to getting out of a clutch, but not too bad. About 900 bucks to put a new one in.

[high revin]

03 GT proud to say cars at 165,000 and still has the orginal clutch id say i have another 10 k miles left in it. Bought the car new so im the only one that has driven it, and thats important too, way to many people dont know how to drive these lack of torque cars properly,

[Puckman27]

So I replaced the original clutch 2 years ago with an OEM replacement from exedy. Probably a bad move on my part, as it is starting to slip if I try to accelerate in 6th gear on the highway. (removed)!!! The car has 86,000 miles on it - how could it have gone through 2 clutches already?! I'll admit I'm more of a spirited driver, but I'm not running around with my foot on the clutch pedal all of the time, and I was able to drive 4 years with the stock clutch, and I wasn't the original owner. Does anyone find this odd? Could something else be causing this?

[Littlemule]

My 2004 Vibe GT has 85000 and the clutch is great and I drive my car hard, I like to test the 0 to sixty at every light and like the rpm window of 6000 to 8200 while going through the gears. On;y problem I have had is with the door handles.

[jjhendri]

'03 GT with 118,000 miles, original clutch and just recently started slipping in 2nd gear and I drive very hard.

[mntn-biker]

Exedy OEM clutch kit, F1 Racing Stage 1 clutch kit, or F1 Racing Stage 2 clutch kit for a 6 speed? This 6 speed will be mated to the 1zz engine so not as much hp as the 2zz engine. Completely stock car, no mods.Daily driver, mostly city driving, don't get on it too much but at times, well, you know...

[jjhendri]

I did buy the Exedy Stage 1 Clutch but so far have not changed so cannot tell which would be better. But the reviews seem to be the Exedy Stage 1. Still on original with 122+, still spirited

[TrojanGT]

OK, I'm baaaack. And we're waiting to hear what we know we will have to do - install clutch NUMBER 5. Yeah, it's me, the original poster on this thrad.In summary:Clutch #1 - Original bad lot of OEM clutch. Died early... replaced by the dealer under protest but comp'ed.Cluch #2 - Dealer-provided clutch, lasted a bit longer than the original, maybe 30k? Not looking at my own history here!Clutch #3 - Exedy (see thread) - lasted about 50kClutch #4 - Exedy Stage 1 - dying out around 33k... and 13 months. I'm disappointed.Clutch #5 - Thinking I should be looking at a Stage 2? Or there is a F1 Stage 3? Or that just not something to consider? I really, really want something that will just last. I could probably live with 50k, but jeez. Only 30k? My independent mechanic suggested looking at the ACT clutch, but the price is significantly higher. Is it worth the money?Always seeking input!Mahalo nui,Dawn

[star_deceiver]

Welcome back!!! Clutch 5, wow, I'm guessing that you do a lot of city/stop and go driving!!! Try the stage 2!

[mntn-biker]

Quote, originally posted by TrojanGT »OK, I'm baaaack. And we're waiting to hear what we know we will have to do - install clutch NUMBER 5. Yeah, it's me, the original poster on this thrad.In summary:Clutch #1 - Original bad lot of OEM clutch. Died early... replaced by the dealer under protest but comp'ed.Cluch #2 - Dealer-provided clutch, lasted a bit longer than the original, maybe 30k? Not looking at my own history here!Clutch #3 - Exedy (see thread) - lasted about 50kClutch #4 - Exedy Stage 1 - dying out around 33k... and 13 months. I'm disappointed.Clutch #5 - Thinking I should be looking at a Stage 2? Or there is a F1 Stage 3? Or that just not something to consider? I really, really want something that will just last. I could probably live with 50k, but jeez. Only 30k? My independent mechanic suggested looking at the ACT clutch, but the price is significantly higher. Is it worth the money?Always seeking input!Mahalo nui,DawnI would call Gripforce and let them know what you have tried and ask their opinion what you should try next. You can get their number off their website gripforce.com FYI - They sell on Ebay. They had the Exedy OEM and an F1 Stage 1 for around $100 plus $17 shipping. They also had the F1 Stage 2 listed for $135 plus $17 shipping. I did the "Make an Offer" and offered them $110 plus shipping since they had 4 available and voila, saved myself $25

[jjhendri]

Wow, 5 clutches that's a bunch (was it a lot of spirited driving) I can assume not? It does not give me great comfort to know that the Stage 1 only last 30K..as this is what's going in next in my 'GT when I replace. Let me know how the F1 works out if that's your choice.

[JustinVGT]

No offense, but after going through 5 clutches, it sounds like it is more of a driver's technique causing the extra wear rather than defective products. My stock original clutch is going on strong at 110k miles. I've ridden with other people who drive manuals and it seems they don't realize they are unnecessarily slipping the clutch all the time. It's as if they haven't figured out how to shift smoothly without slipping it. Hope your next clutch is the last you have to buy!

[TrojanGT]

Haha. No offense taken.We may be more spirited than a set of parents-of-a-college-age-child should be, and we do conduct a good deal of our driving in Los Angeles commuter traffic.That said, I ate fewer clutches in my '83 CRX in 265,000 miles than we have in this Vibe GT. We may have some blame in the matter, but truly, it isn't just our driving. Don't get me wrong, I love my car... can't wait to get it back... my independent mechanic has had it for a full week now. There's just a bit of a weakness in the clutch situation.OK, so it SOUNDS like (darling daughter was last one to talk to mechanic, I was driving!) we're getting an ACT clutch installed (mechanic's research and procurement) for around $700. And while they're at it, with the transmission off, they noticed the engine mounts were shot, so another $300 for front and rear engine mounts. Guess I'll be looking for some overtime...We're at 155,000 miles now. Maybe I should just be looking at a new car, but really, really can't afford it. Not that I can afford to keep up with this kind of maintenance, though. Hopefully I won't be asking questions for another 75k or 80k miles. This 30-50k thing is just killing me! Will post again once I find out what we've got, and how it feels... Mahalo all!

[Vibenator]

In early April this year I installed a new clutch disc, pressure plate, and refurbished flywheel in my '03 GT with 32,000 miles. The clutch was starting to let go in 3rd gear on freeway ramps – not fun when merging with high-speed traffic. I’m an old man, and drive like one, and have owned many MT cars in the past (including a 1968 BMW 2002 with 187,000 miles) and have never had clutch problems. It’s not my driving, the clutch is definitely a bad design (or some sub-standard parts got by Toyota’s (GM’s?) famed quality control.) In any case, I installed a new OEM-type Exedy clutch which was very different in design than the stock unit it replaced. They are definitely not the same units. I’ve been driving the new clutch for four months now with no problems. I babied it for the first 500 miles, and then stuck my foot in it a few times to test it. No problems – it’s tight and grippy. I can even chirp the tires from a standing start. It also seems easier to launch the car now, and the trans even seems to shift better (!!??). Time will tell. From my experience, I would say that the replacement OEM Exedy clutch is better than the stock unit. And, it's a lot cheaper ($119) than the performance clutches.

[DannyZRC]

Hi everyone, long time listener first time caller .We've had our 03 Vibe GT (Abyss, Moon n' Tunes) since summer '06, and it's a fabulous car, except for the clutch.we bought the car with ~36k on it, and at around 42k the clutch gave out.I've been nursing it since, a little over 90k miles on it now. Clutch won't hold more than about 25-30% throttle (though I think there is some assembly order effect, sometimes it can take full throttle), but by the power of low gears and gradual acceleration it gets us around anywhere we need to go and the enforced hypermiling is good for our MPGs, heh.so, we're getting ready to (finally) get the clutch replaced, looking like the ACT is the better option, but I wanted to ask Dawn; where are you getting it done for $700? I'm in central cal, but I have a feeling that I won't find a quote nearly that good anywhere here.Regards,-Danny=D

[NMR Guy]

One more data point for everyone: I have an '03 GT with 159,000 miles, and am still on the original clutch.

[Dianamite]

I'm just wondering (it's not clear to me from the posts on this thread) if this is strictly a GT issue or if the regular Vibes have a short-lived clutch as well?We have a 2006 Vibe and the clutch is slipping at 70,000 km. I think this is very unusual. My boyfriend drives a little bit more aggressively than I do but not excessively so, although the car is driven almost exclusively in the city. I've never had to replace a clutch before and I've had several vehicles that were standard.We did loan the car to my brother a couple times but I wouldn't think he could kill the clutch in one weekend?

[KNINE]

My 2006 has 120,000 + miles with no slipping. My driving is mostly highway. It seems to me that your clutch shouldn't be slipping already. It's hard to determine without experiencing your driving habits.

[mntn-biker]

My clutch on my 03 base lasted me 93k without slipping before the notorious internal bearing (notorious on the base model 5 speeds - Toyota has a manufacturing defect on their bearings specifically on the 5 speeds - they just won't own up to it and the direct replacement is the same darn bearing) became too loud that I replaced the trans with a 6 speed from a Toyota Corolla. If most of your driving is city driving, that could be part of the reason. More reasons is driving habits -> driving with foot on the clutch, "inching" at stop lights while waiting for the light to turn green, slipping the clutch between gears, etc.

[Vibenator]

The fact that there are Vibe GT drivers who haven't had clutch problems does not negate the fact that there is a problem with SOME GT clutches.There are too many reports of clutch prolems from experienced drivers to attribute it to "driving style." Notice that I said "some." There may be intermittent quality control problems with the clutch disc, pressure plate, and flywheel suppliers which can be exacerbated by aggressive driving or a faulty launch technique. The clutch may be delicate to the point where it can last thousands of miles of gentle driving, but begin to slip only after a few miles of aggressive driving. However, I think a "delicate" clutch is a problem in itself. Also, the Vibe GT clutch, which is connected to a motor that doesn't produce much torque at tip in, demands a special launch technique. The clutch should be slipped momentarily, at low RPM, just enough break inertia and get the car rolling. You should accelerate only after the clutch has fully engaged, that is, with your left foot flat on the floor. Still, all the info on this site points to the fact that there is a problem with some Vibe GT clutches, whether it be the disc, pressure plate, or flywheel. From my experience and study, I honestly believe that there are defective Vibe clutches out there, and I had one of them.

[elbertwells]

Add me needing a new clutch at 136,000 but have always had "smell" and odd feeling about this clutch from-time-to-time despite trying to be easy with it!

[Vibe4Me]

Replaced mine this past weekend with 101,000 on the clock.

[htrdce69]

I have 122K on my '03 GT and just starting to have a hint of slippage when downshifting to accelerate hard. I bought mine while stationed in Germany and by no means babied it. It visited the speed limiter at 138 mph almost daily and my wife isn't the easiest on the clutch. I've experienced the "burning clutch" smell on a few occasions. Usually when starting from a steep hill. I must have gotten one of the good ones.

[GT-X]

Well this is my first post in years. But anyhow 2003 GT owned since new, has about 175,xxx miles just now have to do the clutch not really much slipping but a ton of noise and grinding due to the throwout bearing letting go and such. On a side note does anyone have a link to a how to page for install.

[mntn-biker]

This is what I used when I replaced my 5 spd with a 6 spd: http://wehavescissors.blogspot....html

[GT-X]

awsome thank you very much!

[mntn-biker]

No problem! The other thing I found useful was to take pictures as I was taking components off then I would view the pictures on my laptop in reverse order that they were taken during re-assembly.I other thing that is useful is stabbing the trans back on the engine was a bit tricky and is easier if you have someone helping.Have fun!On edit: I did replace the OEM clutch on the replacement trans with an F1 Stage 2 clutch before installing the replacement trans. I did this after reading about so many others having issues with their OEM clutches. It is grippy and my wife and son will not drive it

[Dezz1]

I've had had my GT since day one (2002), and the problem isn't with the clutch or driving styles, the problem is that the tranny system was not made to support the GT, its really made to support the celica GT-S. Since the GT is heavier than the Celica I am sure we can easily figure out what will happen. I replaced my clutch and pressure plate with a performance package from ACT at around 80,000 miles. Currently I am at 130,000 miles and since the change no slippage, no smell, no anything other than the performance i've been looking for. However, now I have no problems with tranny but I have a muscular left leg b/c clutch requires some pushing power. Wifey hate it, but it keeps her out of the car. lol!!!

[NMR Guy]

Been a year since my last post - now at 185k miles on my '03 GT, and still on the original clutch. Maybe I will make to to 200k!

[jjhendri]

NMR Guy, that's great so there's hope after all, I got 136,000 on mine some slight slippage but got a Stage 2 waiting to put in when it does go. So here's to 200K.

[DopeVibeGT]

I'm having my clutch replaced today with an ACT. I've had the ACT clutch for 5 years waiting for the original to go out. Finally, after 186,000 miles (I'm the original owner), it's slipping after a lift or two. Not bad.

[DraziWDragon]

I had to replace my clutch after a pressure spring snapped and knocked my fly wheel off center. I raced my 2003 GT since the day I got it, and after 70k miles, the spring broke, and around 90k, it started to slip. I only felt the unalignment at idle speeds, so I didnt think much of it.HOWEVER, GM said that the BASE vibe clutch usually goes around 15,000 miles.the GT clutch goes around 30-50K.But I noticed that people whose clutch slips around these LOW milages, drive with their foot resting on the clutch pedal.Now I have an F1 racing stage one lightweight flywheel, exedy stage 1 racing clutch, K&N air filter, and a MAF sensor temperature diode.

[Bedlam]

Quote, originally posted by DraziWDragon »I had to replace my clutch after a pressure spring snapped and knocked my fly wheel off center. I raced my 2003 GT since the day I got it, and after 70k miles, the spring broke, and around 90k, it started to slip. I only felt the unalignment at idle speeds, so I didnt think much of it.HOWEVER, GM said that the BASE vibe clutch usually goes around 15,000 miles.the GT clutch goes around 30-50K.But I noticed that people whose clutch slips around these LOW milages, drive with their foot resting on the clutch pedal.Now I have an F1 racing stage one lightweight flywheel, exedy stage 1 racing clutch, K&N air filter, and a MAF sensor temperature diode. c'mon now. don't get silly here. Clutch in a base model has no issues with 150-200k miles of operation. the 5 speed transmission itself is usually the part that dies before the clutch with the bearing issues.The 6 speed, granted did not have the right clutch and pressure plate design for the vehicle and motor upgrade over the base. driven properly it still can reach 125-150k miles or more easily. People that slip and think they bought a race car burn them out quicker (along with any other vehicle you can buy if driven like that).Take care of a clutch and it will last a long time, plain and simple. GT's were short changed a bit with a under spec'd clutch but there is no reason they can't last if not beaten to death. Most early failures are a result of needing the driver mod.

[Vibenator]

"Take care of a clultch and it will last a long time." While this statement is generally true, there are exceptions. I firmly believe that there is a problem with "some" GT clutches. I have been driving sticks for the past 40 years - among them Plymouth Road Runners, Volvos, BMWs, Mercedes, K-cars, and VWs, and have never experienced a bad clutch until I got my '04 Vibe GT. I drive conservatively (like the old man that I am), don't slip the clutch unecessarily on launch, and never rest my foot on the clutch pedal. Still, my clutch began slipping at 28,000, miles. While it's true that some drivers destroy their clutches prematurely due to poor technique, there have been too many other cases like mine to blame the driver. I think this evidence is conclusive.

[NMR Guy]

Well, I made it - 200,000 miles on the original clutch. My secret? I have no idea. Just lucky I guess. :-p