What is the good, the bad and the ugly about the AWD Vibe?

[Contriver]

I am in the market for a new car. I am looking into a few different vehicles and the Vibe is one of them. I am looking for something that has space to fit things and also isn't too expensive to own. I would really like to get something that has AWD. I live in NEPA and while its not the North Pole here, we do get our share of snow and when it does snow, instead of staying inside, you can usually find me out on the road going somewhere to enjoy the snow. I was wondering how well does the Vibe's AWD system works? Another vehicle I am looking at is the second generation Toyota RAV4. I may be wrong, but I have heard that the RAV4 is build on the Corolla and as I understand it, the Vibe too is built off the Corolla. That being said, does the Vibe and RAV4 share a similiar AWD system?In any case, I would like to know what the pros and cons are of the Vibe's AWD system:1) How much better is it in the snow than the FWD version? 2) How does its AWD system compare to say the Subaru Impreza's? 3) How much worse gas mileage does it get compared the the FWD version? 4) Is it as reliable as the FWD version? Does the tranny hold up as well? 5) Are the AWD replacement parts super expensive?Thanks for your help guys!

[Mavrik]

Well... you caught a subie guy here and though I love my Vibe I'd sooner pick a awd Impreza over an awd VibeAWD Vibes have the same HP as the base FWD Vibe how ever with the additional axles/weight and driveline at the rear, you suffer a slight power loss and of course use more fuel. The Subaru Impreza Outback Sport however has 173HP and gets about 23 in town and 28 highway fuel mileage and 16lbs torque. Its a very peppy little turbo-less wagon with as far as I'm concerned about as much room as a Vibe. This is a great writeup to compare Subaru's Symmetrical AWD compared to regular AWD. http://www.subaru.com/sub/misc/coretech/index.html Of course you can op for the turbo Impreza WRX wagon which is twice as much fun to drive then the outback sport.Also since Pontiac has dropped the Vibe GT and AWD Vibe from its lineup... parts and repairs at some point will become difficult to find. Subaru however is dedicated to awd and always will be.I used to work at a Pontiac dealership but now I work at a Subaru one. I love my Vibe but my next car is going to be a Subaru Impreza WRX STi. My Vibe has been very dependable for me but from my experience working with Subaru, its proved to me as well they are just as dependable.

[kevera]

The best guy to ask these questions to in regards to having a AWD Vibe is CAN-AWD-VIBE.The subaru dept is Mavrik and hope's.

[mikey00]

I am not sure what the deal is in Canada but in the US the AWD has less HP then the base (check the specs). This is due to the fact that the exhaust has to make a few extra bends around the AWD components and is more restrictive. The Vibe is kind of underpowered to begin with, so I didn't want to take the additional hit of AWD. AWD also has a smaller gas tank, higher initial cost, reduced mpg, and no StabilTrac option.For a snow car I chose a FWD Vibe with StabilTrac, Traction Control and ABS options. I also use dedicated winter tires.

[Mavrik]

I'm also surviving just fine, my second winter in Alaska with my FWD Vibe and a set of snow tires. AWD would be better obviously but I'm managing just fine. Of course give me some ice and I can't even get out of my own way lol

[AKLGT]

Quote, originally posted by kevera »The best guy to ask these questions to in regards to having a AWD Vibe is CAN-AWD-VIBE.The subaru dept is Mavrik and hope's.keep in mind, i drove my 03 VGT and also Mav's 04 base vibe around town for over 3 almost 4 yrs now. so, i would think that both of us, Phil especially since he worked for GM up until last June, are pretty well versed in how AWD vibes/trixes do in the snow. i test drove the AWD version 6 months prior to me buying my VGT in April 03. was not impressed. it was a dog. super freaking slow and since it was only available in AT, i was greatly disappointed. i LOVE toyota and toyota engines. i was coming from an 01 Tundra 4x4, so wanted to stick with toyota. my family's most loved vehicles growing up were toyotas. i figured the FWD would be fine for winter with good snow/studded tires. they were until i a) added more power and tq to the fwd like unichip, cai, etc, b) started to drive 50% MORE for my job around all over town and out of town and c) our winters here became more icey than snowy. I had my VGT for 2 full winters. first winter, non-modded with new studded snow tires driving just a little for work: no problems. second winter i left all my mods on the car and was driving a good 50-80% more for work. this was bad. the roads were iced over more and snowy and i could not get traction. there would be several times a day that i would get stuck at an intersection because i couldn't get moving. when i drive to work every day, i see the FWD cars spinning their tires, people honking at them (like they can MOVE... that's why their tires are still spinning!), etc. if your winter is mild and you only commute back and forth to work, do not need to drive around all day, then FWD should be fine. Phil doesn't even have studded snow tires on his base vibe and it drives fine to get him the 3 miles to/from work. but if we go anywhere or he needs to drive someplace more than those 3 miles, we take my car or we take the trailblazer (if ground clearance will be an issue). the question is, do you NEED the awd, or is it just something that would be nice to have? i can tell you that i will always own an AWD or 4WD vehicle from this point on as a daily driver. no spinning tires (unless i'm intentionally doing it) or stand still when i'm at an intersection or launching the car at the drag strip. it's smooth acceleration is awesome. i have an auto in my LGT, but it's no dog. my 1/8 mile times are better than the MT counterparts and i can hang with the stock STI folks (up to the 1/8 then i get smoked). if you just get the occassional dusting of snow that melts in a few days, don't bother or spend the extra money on AWD. go with a base vibe or GT. it will be fine provided you have good snow/winter tires. but that's just mho.

[kevera]

Sorry Hope and Mav,I stand corrected.

[Cougar Vibe]

1) How much better is it in the snow than the FWD version? Honestly, I don't think too many people here can answer that question. I mean, 99% of Genvibe owners have one Vibe, so it's a little difficult to make fair comparisons. And for those that have driven both, I don't know how much weight should be alotted for short test drives, etc.2) How does its AWD system compare to say the Subaru Impreza's?It's a completely different system. Contrary to what Pontiac calls "AWD" (and Toyota labels "4WD"), the AWD Vibe will never have all four wheels receiving drivetrain power at the same time. That said, I've been through two rough winters with my AWD Vibe and it's done everything I've asked it to do with relative ease. I can't see how the Impreza would have performed any better than my Vibe in those situations.3) How much worse gas mileage does it get compared the the FWD version? If you believe the EPA ratings, the AWD Vibe gets 6mpg less than the FWD version for both city & highway. I generally get about 24-26 in the city, 32+ on the highway. However, I watch the RPM's carefully and drive fairly conservatively.Note: Pontiac used to market the AWD Vibe as the most fuel-efficient AWD/4WD on the road. I don't know if that is still a valid claim...4) Is it as reliable as the FWD version? Does the tranny hold up as well? All of the tranny issues I've read about (and which are still rare), were AT's on FWD Vibes. I don't think that has anything to do with FWD vs. AWD, but rather that there are a lot more FWD Vibes out there. Power management is more finessed on the AWD, since it has seven fewer HP than the FWD; thus, in theory the AT might have to work a wee bit more on the AWD. But we're still talking about a lot of car and a puny motor, regardless of whether it's AWD or FWD. Personally, the seven HP difference wasn't going to make a difference to me: If I wanted performance, I wouldn't have purchased a Vibe in the first place. As far as the other AWD components, it's still to early to determine long-term reliability. The AWD does have an independent rear suspension and a modified exhaust, and with the end of AWD Vibe and 4WD Matrix production, those items could become pricey. However, I still see a fair number of those mid-80's Corolla wagons with "Sportrak (sic?)," so I'll take my chances with Toyota's AWD/4WD reliability.5) Are the AWD replacement parts super expensive?Oh probably, but again it's too early to tell. Ending AWD production doesn't help things, but those sort of parts will be expensive for any newer AWD/4WD vehicle, regardless of manufacturer.When I bought my AWD Vibe, I got a REALLY good deal...probably not typical of the average buyer. It's was a combination of timing, trade-in leverage and silly incentives. One thing you'll find with Subaru is that they're really hot right now...they don't need to offer financing gimmicks and rebates and etc. Where I live, you can't get a Forester equipped with what my Vibe has for anywhere near the same price; and don't even think about an Outback. As far as Impreza wagons are concerned, they have a lot of value, but they can be hard to find. I really wanted one, but I think Subaru steers a lot of people who can't afford a Forester or Outback into that model and I never could find the right combination of features and color that I wanted. BTW: Have you considered a used Vibe AWD? A fair number of '03's and '04's should be showing up on dealer lots and the secondary market soon. You might be able to find some real value, especially with a redesigned Vibe/Matrix coming soon.

[Digger]

All I can say is I love mine for the piece of mind it gives me,since, work does not give me the option of saying the roads are to bad to go to work.

[tnpartsguy]

I got AWD (again) because I love the ride with the IRS. I don't need tons of tire-smoking power. I like a nice, stable ride, and with the AWD Vibe, I got exactly what I want. Plus, it's not just snow, the AWD does phenomally in rain!

[AKLGT]

Quote, originally posted by Cougar Vibe »1) How much better is it in the snow than the FWD version? Honestly, I don't think too many people here can answer that question. I mean, 99% of Genvibe owners have one Vibe, so it's a little difficult to make fair comparisons. And for those that have driven both, I don't know how much weight should be alotted for short test drives, etc.2) How does its AWD system compare to say the Subaru Impreza's?It's a completely different system. Contrary to what Pontiac calls "AWD" (and Toyota labels "4WD"), the AWD Vibe will never have all four wheels receiving drivetrain power at the same time. That said, I've been through two rough winters with my AWD Vibe and it's done everything I've asked it to do with relative ease. I can't see how the Impreza would have performed any better than my Vibe in those situations.3) How much worse gas mileage does it get compared the the FWD version? If you believe the EPA ratings, the AWD Vibe gets 6mpg less than the FWD version for both city & highway. I generally get about 24-26 in the city, 32+ on the highway. However, I watch the RPM's carefully and drive fairly conservatively.Note: Pontiac used to market the AWD Vibe as the most fuel-efficient AWD/4WD on the road. I don't know if that is still a valid claim...4) Is it as reliable as the FWD version? Does the tranny hold up as well? All of the tranny issues I've read about (and which are still rare), were AT's on FWD Vibes. I don't think that has anything to do with FWD vs. AWD, but rather that there are a lot more FWD Vibes out there. Power management is more finessed on the AWD, since it has seven fewer HP than the FWD; thus, in theory the AT might have to work a wee bit more on the AWD. But we're still talking about a lot of car and a puny motor, regardless of whether it's AWD or FWD. Personally, the seven HP difference wasn't going to make a difference to me: If I wanted performance, I wouldn't have purchased a Vibe in the first place. As far as the other AWD components, it's still to early to determine long-term reliability. The AWD does have an independent rear suspension and a modified exhaust, and with the end of AWD Vibe and 4WD Matrix production, those items could become pricey. However, I still see a fair number of those mid-80's Corolla wagons with "Sportrak (sic?)," so I'll take my chances with Toyota's AWD/4WD reliability.5) Are the AWD replacement parts super expensive?Oh probably, but again it's too early to tell. Ending AWD production doesn't help things, but those sort of parts will be expensive for any newer AWD/4WD vehicle, regardless of manufacturer.When I bought my AWD Vibe, I got a REALLY good deal...probably not typical of the average buyer. It's was a combination of timing, trade-in leverage and silly incentives. One thing you'll find with Subaru is that they're really hot right now...they don't need to offer financing gimmicks and rebates and etc. Where I live, you can't get a Forester equipped with what my Vibe has for anywhere near the same price; and don't even think about an Outback. As far as Impreza wagons are concerned, they have a lot of value, but they can be hard to find. I really wanted one, but I think Subaru steers a lot of people who can't afford a Forester or Outback into that model and I never could find the right combination of features and color that I wanted. BTW: Have you considered a used Vibe AWD? A fair number of '03's and '04's should be showing up on dealer lots and the secondary market soon. You might be able to find some real value, especially with a redesigned Vibe/Matrix coming soon.great write up!

[CAN-AWD-VIBE]

Quote, originally posted by Contriver »In any case, I would like to know what the pros and cons are of the Vibes AWD system:1) How much better is it in the snow than the FWD version? 2) How does its AWD system compare to say the Subaru Impreza's? 3) How much worse gas mileage does it get compared the the FWD version? 4) Is it as reliable as the FWD version? Does the tranny hold up as well? 5) Are the AWD replacement parts super expensive?Thanks for your help guys!Whats crazy is I just got an email a couple days ago from someone wanting to know the same sort of stuff. It wasn't you (i think this guy was from BC) but he must of got my email from here. I will give you the same sort of run down.1) AWD is better the FWD in snow or ice. Any day any tires. It just gets better with winter tires and then its fantastic. De-badge it and start off from a ice covered intersection and look at the guys face as you just casually pull away. 2) Owning a Subaru Forester (same drivetrain as impreza) I can tell you I like the Subarus AWD better then the vibe. The Subaru is a full time system and when you hit it in the corners it really swings the back around and gets straight. The Vibe is much more likely to understeer at first and then sort of catch up and straighten out. The Vibe is great on the commute and through the mountains... but if its sideways fun the Subaru does it without the ebrake.3) I dont do gas milage. I know its better then a V6, but I have no numbers and I wont get them for you. I dont drive in a manner conducive to MPG. sorry 4) I have had a leak from the rear axle seals... no biggie, most 4wd cars/trucks have that happen. As far as the internals or major issues with the tranny or the AWD system there have been none (touch wood).5) Yes. If it breaks it will cost you. Find me an AWD that won't. There are none.Overall I really like my AWD Vibe. It needs more power for sure. Thats why my future mods list has a supercharger in it. But it is great as the daily commuter in all weather. It does get good milage, (you can still tell) and there is loads of room to store stuff. Ultimately it comes down to how bad do you want/need AWD. And is the lack of power ok for you or will you itch to go faster. I itch and I will prescribe myself boost but thats just me.

[BlueCrush]

Yeah, what they said!

[ColonelPanic]

Just watch out for odd noises in the rear, we've had a couple people here that have had the rear end go out on theirs... It doesn't seem to be a widespread problem but it's still rather expensive to fix. Make sure you keep up with the fluid in the rear diff., and if you buy used, make sure that the prior owner also took care of the fluid if it was time.

[drunkenmaxx]

Quote, originally posted by ColonelPanic »Just watch out for odd noises in the rear, we've had a couple people here that have had the rear end go out on theirs... It doesn't seem to be a widespread problem but it's still rather expensive to fix. Make sure you keep up with the fluid in the rear diff., and if you buy used, make sure that the prior owner also took care of the fluid if it was time.hell, if that happens, just do what i did and trade it to make it someone else's problem!

[Mavrik]

You also need to consider that Subaru is AWD. Its what they do, they have years of experience and design in their systems. GM/Toyota just dabs into it here and there.and no weird noises from the Subaru AWD system either. They are very quiet.

[AKLGT]

Quote, originally posted by drunkenmaxx »hell, if that happens, just do what i did and trade it to make it someone else's problem!i did that too.

[Whelan]

Quote, originally posted by AKLGT »GM/Toyota just dabs into it here and there.I cannot speak for GM, but I know Toyota has been using their AWD/4WD system in smaller cars for years, since the 80's. The Sienna comes with and AWD system as well now. And from what I have read and heard, the AWD system in a Toyota is as good as any other, with great reliability and it gets you through.I have an 05 Matrix XR AWD and I love it! I sacrificed big time moving from a 5spd. 2dr. 02 Civic EX Coupe modded, but I wasn't looking to go fast anymore, I wanted something practical, with awesome looks, tons of storage if need be, and AWD. It was either this or the Subaru 2.5 sportback thing. Well I drove both, the Subaru is nice but I can never get over the fact that the windows have nothing on the top to support them. i.e. when you open the door, there is nothing but glass on top, no metal or rubber. This to me spells out sealing problems in the future as the seals are pushed against and eventually will fade and wear.Another thing that irked me is that I have seen way to many older outbacks and sedans on the road with really awful sounds. The engines sound like rocks are in them and they get whiny, tinny, and just sound like they might fall out of the car. Not sure why but no matter what they all seem to sound like this. I even took an Outback LL Bean edition from 03 in at the dealer I worked at (Acura) as a trade. Only 70,000 miles on it. It felt like it was a 4cyl. not a 6 and had no power on the pedal, pedal was very loose and had to push it to the floor to get it to move. Not all power options worked, etc.So Subaru may make a good first impression but I am not sold on their reliability. Especially considering how they price their resale. A CPO Subaru is way overpriced. You should be able to get a 2.5 base for under 20k in the U.S. but I had not seen one under 21. I got my Matrix for 18K in August. It has put me through rain, huge puddles, snow, and some ice recently. As well as below freezing days (today 9 degrees). Not one hiccup, not one false startup, almost 41,000 miles on it and I will drive it until it literally falls apart.

[dianebrat]

I'm another one noob that's very interested in this thread.I'm less then a month into owning mine, and I still don't have a handle on MPG.I'm comparing both MPG and ride quality on my commute that I did with an '01 2DR Tracker 4WD with a stick.The city and highway ride quality is significantly higher, the pickup, while like molasses in January, is still gobs better then the anemic Tracker.I'm loving the fact that it feels like a car, not a cheap tin can.I too had considered the Subaru camp, but the fully optioned Vibe was the top of my budget, the Suburu's that were optioned as nice, were beyond me.So I'd love to see that I'd be getting 25 city, and 29ish highway since my Tracker was 23MPG *always*I knew I'd give up a few MPG by going AWD and AT over 2WD and MT.Diane

[CAN-AWD-VIBE]

just like any car it sounds like you drove a poorly maintained Subaru.At 200,000 kms my Forester make no funny noises, all power options work perfect and no leaks or wind noise from my "unsealed" doors or my 1/2 car length sunroof.Toyota make great reliable cars that hold value and rarely let you down. But if we are talking about all wheel drive. Subaru wins hands down every time in every aspect. Sorry... but when ALL of your line up is AWD then really you should be the best, and they are.I'm not saying that no one else makes an AWD that works well. I'm just saying I trust and enjoy the Subarus the most.The Vibe AWD is still a great car that wont get you stuck in some really deep stuff.... but its not my Subaru.