The Battery Issue

Sub-Vibe-R · Post by **Sub-Vibe-R** » Fri Feb 28, 2003 5:04 am

As we know, some of us have trouble starting by cold weather.This trouble is due to a poor battery and GM should change it with a bigger oneYour dealer's service departement is not allowed to change it to another part then this one without a service bulletin or a recall.The only way to have it changed for free is to complain to GM.So I ask you to call the GM customer satisfaction line (GM Canada 800 263 3777 (english) or 800 263 7854 (french)) and complain about the lack of power of the stock battery. Alone, we cannot change the thing, but if we put ourself all together, we can do it.

Triton · Post by **Triton** » Fri Feb 28, 2003 5:09 am

Thank you for the post. I will be giving them a call as well.

biggdogg173 · Post by **biggdogg173** » Fri Feb 28, 2003 5:31 am

Power to the people!

Shadow Realm · Post by **Shadow Realm** » Fri Feb 28, 2003 5:56 am

I encourage everyone in the Northern regions to call GM and complain about this battery problem. I agree that if everyone calls you could start GM into issuing a recall notice. I wish I could help more about this subject but I haven't experienced this problem and don't have too much clout with GM. I've called them about the problem as a third party participant and I've told them I have been hearing lots of problems from fellow Vibe owners that live in cold climates.

VibeSalsa · Post by **VibeSalsa** » Fri Feb 28, 2003 12:02 pm

I will call them on Monday for sure like I said in another post.

MA-VIBE-FAN · Post by **MA-VIBE-FAN** » Fri Feb 28, 2003 1:02 pm

If you believe the battery is insufficent to start your car in the cold, why haven't you bought a new battery for your car?

Vibe Rater · Post by **Vibe Rater** » Fri Feb 28, 2003 2:07 pm

Cuz, when you spend $20,000 + on a car, you shouldn't have to run out and buy a new battery for it?

Flip-Side · Post by **Flip-Side** » Fri Feb 28, 2003 2:30 pm

quote:I will not contact them until I have a problem, I have been good so far.Thats what I said since I was living in South Carolina. My wife went up to Michigan 2 months ago, and the battery has died twice. It was fine after jumping, but it is one more design flaw that needs to be corrected....for free.

VibeSalsa · Post by **VibeSalsa** » Sat Mar 01, 2003 12:15 pm

quote:Cuz, when you spend $20,000 + on a car, you shouldn't have to run out and buy a new battery for it?Good answer Vibe Rater!! It's exactly what I think too...

Sub-Vibe-R · Post by **Sub-Vibe-R** » Sun Mar 02, 2003 7:51 am

quote:Cuz, when you spend $20,000 + on a car, you shouldn't have to run out and buy a new battery for it?Good answer Vibe Rater!! It's exactly what I think too...I vote for that too....

935684 · Post by **935684** » Sun Mar 02, 2003 7:54 am

I'm going to wait until tomorrow. I have an appointment at 1300 EST, during which my dealer is replacing my 310 CCA battery. I assume it's under warranty, as he said he was going to do it, without my asking him to do so. He also said he thinks the replacement is 560 CCA.I'll post the details tomorrow evening.

Vibe Rater · Post by **Vibe Rater** » Sun Mar 02, 2003 8:11 am

quote: I have an appointment at 1300 ESTAre you in the military?

935684 · Post by **935684** » Sun Mar 02, 2003 8:23 am

quote:Are you in the military?Long, long ago. I'm an old geezer now.

philndz · Post by **philndz** » Sun Mar 02, 2003 1:13 pm

im callin too...we had a couple of real real cold day here and the thing took like 8 turns before it rattled to a start....not cool....im callin!!-phil

robdog · Post by **robdog** » Mon Mar 03, 2003 12:39 am

Anyone know what the US GM phone # is. I would like to complain about the battery issue as well.

935684 · Post by **935684** » Mon Mar 03, 2003 5:44 am

Salsa, Triton GT et al, I now have a nice little AC Delco 560 CCA battery tucked under my hood. My 310 CCA Delphi was replac1ed free of charge.I also bought a battery blanket from the dealer. The installed cost for that was C$20 plus tax. It only consumes 20 watts, so I'm going to leave it on all night. The manufacturer claims that, at -29 C, your battery only has about 45% of the power it has at 27 C. They also say the blanket raises the temperature of the battery about 20 degrees above the ambient temperature, but I'm not certain whether they said degrees Celsius or degrees Farenheit.In any case, it was around -38 C this morning. Someone asked who my dealer was. It's Bray Motors in Sundridge, Ontario. They're located on Highway 11, about 60 km north of Huntsville, and about 80 km south of North Bay.I'm now a happy camper, at least for the time being.

Sputnik · Post by **Sputnik** » Mon Mar 03, 2003 6:13 am

quote:Yes, I would like to know what they did with this. Then I will take mine to the dealer and ask them to replace mine also.You said you weren't going to call GM unless you had a problem so why would you take it in to see if you can get the dealer to replace it since you have no problems with it?

VibeSalsa · Post by **VibeSalsa** » Mon Mar 03, 2003 7:13 am

Sputnik, you've got a point there... I called GM Canada and they said they will take my complain into consideration. They asked me if my dealer have reported this to GM. I said: " I don't think so... with the answer they gave me..." So, the representative said they will call my dealer about this point. I will call back in a few days to have a follow up about it...And I will repeat this famous sentence: Â« Alone, we cannot change the thing, but if we put ourself all together, we can do it. Â» LETS GO GENVIBE MEMBERS!!!

philndz · Post by **philndz** » Mon Mar 03, 2003 7:28 am

i called U.S. GM just now and they said as of now it doesnt seem to be a problem. i told them i hadnt asked my dealer about the battery yet but understood that there was nothing the dealer could do until they were given the go-ahead from GM. she said...oh so you havent seen your dealer....well we will take your comment into consideration but you should see you dealer to see what can be done to keep you as a satifyed customer.obviously she has never been to a dealer!!oh well...i tried.... it must really suck for you guys up northim in Missouri and many cold mornings it cranks like 8 times and barely starts-phil

Post by **NSimkins** » Tue Aug 26, 2003 12:11 pm

Battery Update:I was told GM is currently testing out some new higher CCA batteries with hopes to release a TSB for people who are having 'cold start' and other battery problems before this winter. They are hoping to replace the current battery with a 560 CCA model for those that this issue would affect.More updates to come...

Toasted7 · Post by **Toasted7** » Tue Aug 26, 2003 12:52 pm

I look forward to hearing what they come up with. I have to say that this past winter (it started snowing as I drove my Vibe home off the lot and snowed nonstop for a month after that at least) I had "issues" with getting my car to start on some of those rather chilly days that we had. I'm sure they will fix it somehow... and free of charge I can only hope.

AKLGT · Post by **AKLGT** » Tue Aug 26, 2003 12:59 pm

think that'll include those of us in cold climate areas like AK?

Pix Doc · Post by **Pix Doc** » Wed Sep 24, 2003 1:37 pm

I got my vibe in December I live just south of the windy city. I replaced my battery the second day I had my car. (I hate the dealerships)

ArcsVibe · Post by **ArcsVibe** » Wed Sep 24, 2003 1:42 pm

damn!I better check my battery then......

ragingfish · Post by **ragingfish** » Wed Sep 24, 2003 1:44 pm

I want like a 960 CCA...that baby would start up in a heartbeat!

ArcsVibe · Post by **ArcsVibe** » Wed Sep 24, 2003 1:50 pm

I have a funny feeling we will have a brutal winter this year since our summer SUCKED

ArcsVibe · Post by **ArcsVibe** » Wed Sep 24, 2003 1:54 pm

Rob I wanted to ask you a question about your Freedom strut bar, which one did you get? The one for the Matrix? Did you have to modify it ?

ArcsVibe · Post by **ArcsVibe** » Wed Sep 24, 2003 1:58 pm

Thank you Sir...As always I can count on you!

Vibe Rater · Post by **Vibe Rater** » Wed Sep 24, 2003 4:07 pm

quote:Rob I wanted to ask you a question about your Freedom strut bar, which one did you get? The one for the Matrix? Did you have to modify it ?Ahem... should have started a new thread for this.

ArcsVibe · Post by **ArcsVibe** » Thu Sep 25, 2003 1:05 am

Ah well shoot me bro!lol

vibe owner · Post by **vibe owner** » Mon Sep 29, 2003 1:02 pm

My GT spent most of its first year in moderate climate, nights in the garage. But I just spent two weeks on the road, mostly in Telluride Colorado. Elevation there is almost 9000 feet so you get huge temperature swings, 70+ in the day, teens overnight. Twice the battery went dead. It was NOT a problem with inadequate CCA -- it was still very dead after the sun warmed the car. I suspect I encountered the faulty headlights switch that turns itself on when cold. Toyota's TSB about this is EL001-03, and I've read conflicting information about if the stalk switch or a relay is at fault. Does anyone know if Pontiac has a TSB?My experience went like this: Call 800-ROADSIDE, they tell me to wait 5 minutes and try the key again (electronic key problem). I do as suggested. Call again, new woman says wait 10 minutes. I tell her Vibe doesn't have an electronic key. She insists it does. No troubleshooting (Map light on?) or anything. Their only other recourse is to tow the car 80 miles to the nearest dealer, which I do after the second drained battery. Paid for by Pontiac, but an inconvenience. Of course the dealer can't find anything wrong. They have never heard of the headlights switch issue and pretty much ignore the suggestion.I plan to use the Vibe as my skiing car this year -- sure would like this fixed.

Post by **NSimkins** » Thu Dec 04, 2003 11:09 am

UpdateFrom what I have heard, the battery issue is finally almost to a point where affected owners will be able to have their dealer replace with a higher CCA model. The bulk of the tests have been performed and paperwork and dispursement need to be finalized before it can be official. It sounds like this should be available for replacement before the end of December.Updates will follow.

ragingfish · Post by **ragingfish** » Thu Dec 04, 2003 11:15 am

I was gonna ask you about that...I had a LOT of trouble starting today, and it was only about 30 degrees...about -1 C...hardly THAT cold...Glad to hear there's a light at the end of the tunnel!

VibeSalsa · Post by **VibeSalsa** » Thu Dec 04, 2003 11:16 am

Thanks a lot Nick! It will be nice to have my battery changed because these days, it's cold (-10Â°C) and the poor battery don't like it...

AKLGT · Post by **AKLGT** » Thu Dec 04, 2003 2:26 pm

excellent! on thanksgiving, my vibe wouldn't start so i had to plug it in for half hour and it finally did.

Sub-Vibe-R · Post by **Sub-Vibe-R** » Thu Dec 04, 2003 10:21 pm

Quote, originally posted by NSimkins Â»UpdateFrom what I have heard, the battery issue is finally almost to a point where affected owners will be able to have their dealer replace with a higher CCA model. The bulk of the tests have been performed and paperwork and dispursement need to be finalized before it can be official. It sounds like this should be available for replacement before the end of December.Updates will follow.Woo Hoo!!!! Finally a good news.Thanks a lot Nick an keep us updated about the future TSB

935684 · Post by **935684** » Thu Dec 04, 2003 10:22 pm

My dealer installed the larger CCA capacity battery last winter, and it's a lot better than the original. I guess it was replaced on a goodwill basis.One suggestion - He also sold me a 20 W battery blanket, which I plug in instead of using my block heater. I also use 0W30 semi-synthetic oil. Nowadays, I only bother with my block heater if the temperature drops below -20 C.

SCTM · Post by **SCTM** » Thu Dec 04, 2003 11:06 pm

Quote, originally posted by NSimkins Â»UpdateFrom what I have heard, ...My hope is that this will also affect Canadians Vibers...So far it's hard to get some good news from GM Canada, (battery - cladding and what else to come) Dont't want to be pessimist and keep my fingers crossed, may be SantaClaus is on his way for us!!!

Sub-Vibe-R · Post by **Sub-Vibe-R** » Fri Dec 05, 2003 12:26 am

Quote, originally posted by SCTM Â»may be SantaClaus is on his way for us!!! Let's hope he won't crash with his sleigh.....

VibeSalsa · Post by **VibeSalsa** » Fri Dec 05, 2003 2:27 am

Quote, originally posted by Sub-Vibe-R Â»Let's hope he won't crash with his sleigh.....Ha Ha Ha! or Ho Ho Ho! Good one Ben!

Sputnik · Post by **Sputnik** » Fri Dec 05, 2003 2:52 am

My god Sputnik complained this morning when I went Christmas shopping. It was -10.

Stang2Vibe · Post by **Stang2Vibe** » Fri Dec 05, 2003 2:40 pm

Yeah, mine is slowing down now too with the cold weather we've been having around here. I was going to replace mine, but now I'll wait a little while to see if GM will actually step up to the plate and put a proper battery in this car. What the hell do they plan to start in cold northern weather with a 310 CCA battery anyway? Maybe a moped or something? Come on, it couldn't have cost them that much more. It will cost them more in customer complaints and having to replace all these batteries than what they saved by sticking us with an underpowered battery.

Vibe Rater · Post by **Vibe Rater** » Sat Dec 06, 2003 12:25 am

The sky's the limit, as long as it will fit in the tray and not interfere with lowering the hood.

Vibe Rater · Post by **Vibe Rater** » Sat Dec 06, 2003 12:30 am

Just a suggestion for the moderator. Maybe we should shift all of these service related threads, like the battery issue, the paint issue and any other longstanding issue threads that GM says they are addressing to the 'Humor' section.

Post by **NSimkins** » Sat Dec 06, 2003 1:22 am

I believe the thing that people need to remember is that the Vibe is not a pure GM vehicle, so to speak. Every mechanical-based update or change that GM may feel needs to be changed on the Vibe has to go through Toyota as part of their overall agreement for this particular vehicle.GM recognized the issue with the battery early but is not directly authorized to globally update the battery with a more sufficient model unless it goes through Toyota first. This is the case with most mechanical problems that may be problematic. From what I have personally observed through the past year and a half is that GM has to push to convince Toyota that there may be a problem when they (Toyota) might flat out deny a problem exists. This is where our complaints, concerns, and feedback really help in our favor, regardless of the time it takes to accomplish. What really helps is when the same problem is discussed on the Toyota Matrix sites - this helps to convince Toyota that a problem really does exist and needs to be addressed.I can understand the overall dissatisfaction people have towards GM and they have every right to have such an opinion, based on their personal experiences. I'm stating mine. To attempt to keep this thread on topic, if there is any battery-related information that can be added to this post, please do so. If not, start a new thread.

SCTM · Post by **SCTM** » Sat Dec 06, 2003 9:53 am

Quote, originally posted by NSimkins Â»I believe the thing that people need to remember is that the Vibe is not a pure GM vehicle, so to speak. Every mechanical-based update or change that GM may feel needs to be changed on the Vibe has to go through Toyota as part of their overall agreement for this particular vehicle.GM recognized the issue with the battery early but is not directly authorized to globally update the battery with a more sufficient model unless it goes through Toyota first.... From what I have personally observed through the past year and a half is that GM has to push to convince Toyota ...If all of this is true (and I believe you NSimkins) I'm afraid that we wont get anything from GM in the near future in regards of this subject. I feel bad, cause we've paid GM for a product and if there is something wrong they can't resolve it without the Toyota benediction! Don't tell GM but they got THE easiest ANSWER to our problems now : "It's not our fault, it's Toyota's..". I don't like that at all.

Post by **NSimkins** » Sat Dec 06, 2003 9:59 am

Quote, originally posted by SCTM Â»If all of this is true (and I believe you NSimkins) I'm afraid that we wont get anything from GM in the near future in regards of this subject. I feel bad, cause we've paid GM for a product and if there is something wrong they can't resolve it without the Toyota benediction! Don't tell GM but they got THE easiest ANSWER to our problems now : "It's not our fault, it's Toyota's..". I don't like that at all. I understand your point. Fortunately for us, in regards to the Vibe, is we have some excellent support as far as putting pressure on the right people to get things done. In regards to the battery issue, it has been through Toyota and approved - GM is now working out the distribution aspect of this issue.As long as I'm able, I'll continue to push for issues brought up here on GenVibe. As a fellow Vibe owner, it's in my interests as well!

joatmon · Post by **joatmon** » Sat Dec 06, 2003 10:14 am

I would sure hate to have to read all of the legal agreements and contracts that had to be put in place between GM and Toyota for this joint Matrix/Vibe venture. I guess I can understand the need to have Toyota OK changes that GM wants to make. The point I think is important is that it apparently is a change that GM wants to make, which has positive implications for GM's willingness to support the customers and resolve recurring problems. But, I'm no expert.I am glad the battery issue is being addressed. maybe not fast enough for some owners. For me, the cost of lost time at work to take my vibe in for a free dealer battery replacement is about what I'd spend buying the biggest battery at Walmart, so if I do have a serious battery issue, I'll probably just go buy a new one and drop it in. The Vibe is the fourth vehicle I have bought new, and in the other three, the OEM battery was poor quality. I guess I expect to have to replace the OEM battery out of pocket anyway. This does not mean that I am saying that people should stop complaining and demanding satisfaction from the manufacturer. If you're having battery problems try to get the dealer to replace it for free under warranty. If they won't replace it, and you can afford the time, call 800-ROADSID whenever the car fails to start. That will get expensive for GM pretty quick, and will crank up the priority to get you a replacement battery.

Post by **NSimkins** » Sat Dec 06, 2003 10:28 am

Quote, originally posted by silverawd26 Â»I have a odd question. How does a TSB come to life? Does it have to be approved by certain people or such?Yes, that's correct. It's not just a quick and simple process from what I have observed.Quote, originally posted by silverawd26 Â»I mean, if we are having trouble starting our vehicles in cold weather and the Battery is the problem since it is only 310 CCA, couldn't anyone send out a memo to the dealer stating a problem and maybe a new battery would be a fix. Not a legit TSB, but a memo through email to the Service Managers to some dealers. This way, they can warranty the work and after GM does see there is enough of these problems, then they can create an actual TSB.That's possible, but it depends on having the necessary stock of appropriate and tested batteries available to fulfill the demand. Some complaints about the battery were fulfilled with a higher CCA by some dealers own discretion but that was after they had communication with GM to verify the issue. A voicemail or memo is usually only used to communicate changes, reiterate specifications on certain models, give a heads-up on changes to products, etc. When replacement of actual products due to problems or complaints is issued, it's usually by TSB or recall.Quote, originally posted by silverawd26 Â»Could Jeff Strausser call some of our dealers and have us come in and give them the OK or persuade them into replacing the OEM Battery with a higher CAA if the TSB is not out yet?I believe he has already done that on several occasions, none that I'm immediately aware of, but including responses gathered from online forums, like ours.Quote, originally posted by silverawd26 Â»I mean, something has to be done about it and it is taking a very long time. It should of been done 2 months ago for the month of October. I am expressing my concerns because I do not feel I should go out and purchase another battery that I have to pay for. Unless GM or a Dealer will reinburse me, then I will do that and take the time to fill out the paper work and go through the right channels.I've said awhile back that the issue was being addressed and re-reading my above posts would also lead you to be aware that other parties were involved here delaying the problem. I'm not sticking up for anyone in particular, just stating facts.Yes, I agree this should have been fixed over a year ago (GM was aware of it then), and I'm also saying that the fix is not far off. I'm telling you this directly from the source. Hang in there.

AKLGT · Post by **AKLGT** » Sat Dec 06, 2003 1:12 pm

at this point, dealing with the dealerships and gm, i'm probably just going to go get a die hard gold from sears and be done with it! i MUST have a reliable vehicle per my contract for work. no car, no job. simple as that. last winter when the other account rep had his car out for 2 weeks, the boss came in and said fix it by the end of the week or find another job! so, waiting for gm to pull its head out from its (removed) is not an option for me. and i highly doubt that my dealership here will give me a better battery on good will.