Very poor mileage, help needed!

[Mitch]

HiI bought my Pointic Vibe (base model, 1.8 engine) about half a year ago, used. It was brought here to Canada from the US where it was a daily rental vehicle for about a year, so I got it with 43000 km.I am driving mostly in the city so I've had some winter driving as well as spring.During winter the milage was really pathetic, I was lucky if I got 400km per tank. Now, as it got much warmer I get around 500km per tank which is around 10 liters per 100km (or 23 mpg).I took the car to the dealership as it's still on warranty, of course, they didn't find any problem with it.Guys, I'd really appreciate any ideas about why instead of promised 8.3 liters per 100 km I got 10?Also the car vibrates at idle speed, it's really annoying but I am not sure if it's related to the problem.Thank you,Mitch

[kevera]

Part of the problem is the cold weather and the winter gas here in Canada,so that is normal.The idle is also a normal occurrence,mine also vibrates a little.I just learned to live with it.

[prathman]

Mitch,How are determining your gas mileage? 500 km/fillup is equal to 10l/100km only if your fillups are each 50 l or just over 13.1 US gallons. That's the nominal capacity of the gas tank, but I've never come near that amount when getting a fillup since a) I don't run the car until it's totally out of gas before getting it refilled and b) I don't work hard to get in every last bit of gas that'll fit - instead I rely on the automatic shut-off valve on the gas pumps. So my fillups are rarely more than 11 - 12 gallons which would correspond to 26 - 28 mpg if the distance per fillup is 500 km (311 miles). If the driving is mainly city then that doesn't seem so bad. Have you taken any extended highway trips at fairly constant speed? The mileage in that case would be more directly comparable to others since city mileage is so dependent on varying conditions and driving styles.

[ProtonXX]

had the same problem for a year(22-25mpg). I had a CEL + Base 03 Vibe & This is what I didShort Ram intake Weapon Dragon Intake-Great Mileage at cruising spead (stock box will work too) +3mpgFront O2 Sensor-not much help but could help you 0-1 mpgSeafoam Cleaning-wooow +2mpg im sureSynthetic Oil-Power +1 MPGFilter Mag -Dont pay $50 for one get a $5 Rare earth 5 lbs magnetic hook-Cleaned up alot of engine whine during startScan gauge 2-Subtitle Movements can be the difference between +3 mpg. The sweet spot is at about 2.5k RPMIn the end I got 45mpg at 45 mph35-38 mpg at 5530 mpg at 65-80According to the scan gaugeAccording to the fuel meterI get over 100 Miles at the first quarter tank & go pass 300 miles before the fuel light. Before I was stopping to fill up at 280-300 miles, fuel light came on around 240 ish. The extra 60-80 miles per take make my life much easier

[Mitch]

Thank you for the suggestions!Prathman, when the light comes on, I have 450 km on the odometer, so I assume that I have more or less enought gas for another 50km. That's how I came up with 500km per tank.ProtonXX, I am going to try some of the things that you listed. Is seafoam clining something that any mechanic can do or it's something specialized?

[prathman]

I've driven over 100 km after the low fuel light came on and I still didn't come close to getting 13 gallons into the tank. So I think you're underestimating your mileage.Take the actual mileage you drove before filling up and divide by the number of gallons it takes to fill the tank to get mpg. Or, for l/100km, take the number of liters needed for the fillup and divide by how many hundred km you drove. Keep track of the mileage over a few fillups since there may be some variations just due to how full the tank gets before the pump shuts off.

[ProtonXX]

Quote, originally posted by Mitch »Thank you for the suggestions!Prathman, when the light comes on, I have 450 km on the odometer, so I assume that I have more or less enought gas for another 50km. That's how I came up with 500km per tank.ProtonXX, I am going to try some of the things that you listed. Is seafoam clining something that any mechanic can do or it's something specialized?You can do it yourself for $7, Looks scary tho but I loved the results after. Did it in my 2k grand am also but the only thing I noticed was the tires screaming from launch again

[Mitch]

Prathman, last time I came to the gas station I had 450km on the odometer and I put 45 liters in the tank. I guessed, the 5 liters would give me extra 50km. But I got your point.ProtonXX, Sounds good, but I am not a hand-on guy when it comes to cars, so please bear with me. Could you suggest where I can buy the stuff (and what stuff) and how the procedure looks like?Thank you!Andrew

[kevera]

OK,I'm sort of confused here.Your saying that you get crappy gas mileage in the cold weather and it's gets better when it warms up,right.If that's the case,we have cold weather here in Canada.That drops your fuel mileage.Don't want to flame anyone but the other guys that posted live in warmer climates,I don't think Nevada or Cali get way below freezing.It's normal for fuel mileage to drop in winter and our winter gas does not help.The seafoam is a good idea,it cleans the carbon out and when put in the gas tank cleans the injectors too.Just like the dealer said,I don't think you have a problem.

[ProtonXX]

My mileage dropped when I moved to Vegas. In Ohio I got much better mileage. But the difference could of been air moisture, O2, slow speed limits, gas quality(ohio has 93 octane, vegas dont) ect. One funny thing is when driving form Cali to Vegas on I-15 I get the worst mileage ever(15-25mpg on the scan gauge. AS SOON AS I SEE VEGAS LIGHTS the mileage jumps to 30-35 & I have the same driving patern as I did the previous 300 miles. I havent made that trip with all the new mods yet but it will this weekend or next week.http://www.trackdogracing.com/...s.jpgSeafoam comes in a white bottle with white cap, its in the engine additives section, costs about $8. You will put 1/3 of it in your engine oil near a oil change, 1/3 in the gas tank when near empty, and the last 1/3 in the throttle body. The throttle body is the hard part but there is a vacuum hose you can disconnect and pour the seafoam down. Do this while the car running & the engine will rev like crazy, once you finish turn the car off and wait 15-30 min. Start your car and prepare for a smoke show.If you have a stock box Ill take pics of how you can find the vacuum

[Vibe_dude]

so far with mine this year(03 auto).PurchaseDate Price(c/L) LitresPurchased TotalCost Odometer(km) Station FilledTank? L/100km * Notes 3/25/2007 111.8 40.250 $45.00 113,094 Irving Y - 3/22/2007 103.8 26.007 $27.00 112,629 SuperStore Y 8.7 3/16/2007 101.5 30.543 $31.00 112,404 SuperStore Y 11.6 3/8/2007 101.5 39.408 $40.00 112,130 SuperStore Y 11.1 2/28/2007 92.9 24.762 $23.00 111,813 SuperStore Y 12.4 2/22/2007 92.9 33.364 $31.00 111,591 SuperStore Y 11.1 2/15/2007 89.2 33.628 $30.00 111,324 SuperStore Y 12.5 2/7/2007 84.5 40.282 $34.04 111,052 SuperStore Y 12.4 1/31/2007 84.5 36.092 $30.50 110,736 SuperStore Y 12.8 1/24/2007 87.5 32.572 $28.50 110,465 SuperStore Y 13.3 1/18/2007 88.9 38.246 $34.00 110,207 SuperStore Y 12.6 1/11/2007 90.8 34.806 $31.60 109,924 SuperStore Y 13.5 1/3/2007 95.5 29.319 $28.00 109,604 SuperStore Y 10.9 total so far this year 11.751l/100kmsso it comes down to the fact that toyotas #'s for mpgs are way off.its a proven fact.

[Vibe_dude]

so far with mine this year(03 auto).PurchaseDate Price(c/L) LitresPurchased TotalCost Odometer(km) Station FilledTank? L/100km * Notes 3/25/2007 111.8 40.250 $45.00 113,094 Irving Y - [Edit] [ Delete] 3/22/2007 103.8 26.007 $27.00 112,629 SuperStore Y 8.7 [Edit] [ Delete] 3/16/2007 101.5 30.543 $31.00 112,404 SuperStore Y 11.6 [Edit] [ Delete] 3/8/2007 101.5 39.408 $40.00 112,130 SuperStore Y 11.1 [Edit] [ Delete] 2/28/2007 92.9 24.762 $23.00 111,813 SuperStore Y 12.4 [Edit] [ Delete] 2/22/2007 92.9 33.364 $31.00 111,591 SuperStore Y 11.1 [Edit] [ Delete] 2/15/2007 89.2 33.628 $30.00 111,324 SuperStore Y 12.5 [Edit] [ Delete] 2/7/2007 84.5 40.282 $34.04 111,052 SuperStore Y 12.4 [Edit] [ Delete] 1/31/2007 84.5 36.092 $30.50 110,736 SuperStore Y 12.8 [Edit] [ Delete] 1/24/2007 87.5 32.572 $28.50 110,465 SuperStore Y 13.3 [Edit] [ Delete] 1/18/2007 88.9 38.246 $34.00 110,207 SuperStore Y 12.6 [Edit] [ Delete] 1/11/2007 90.8 34.806 $31.60 109,924 SuperStore Y 13.5 [Edit] [ Delete] 1/3/2007 95.5 29.319 $28.00 109,604 SuperStore Y 10.9 so it comes down to the fact that toyotas #'s for mpgs are way off.its a proven fact.

[prathman]

Quote, originally posted by ProtonXX »One funny thing is when driving form Cali to Vegas on I-15 I get the worst mileage ever(15-25mpg on the scan gauge. AS SOON AS I SEE VEGAS LIGHTS the mileage jumps to 30-35 & I have the same driving patern as I did the previous 300 miles.Might have something to do with the little mountain range you have to climb up and over before dropping down into the Las Vegas valley. Much of it is gradual enough that you don't really notice the climb but it does take its toll on your mileage.

[Mitch]

I came across the STP or Bardahl gas additives somewhere in the forum. The producs are supposed to clean your injectors. Is it similar to Seafoam? Would you recomment using it?

[kevera]

You can pick up seafoam at partsource,and maybe Canadian tire,I think.You can also go to Wal-Mart and get the Chevron Techron fuel system cleaner.You can also hit any GM dealer parts and pick up GM Top Engine Clean,which is the same thing.All are relatively cheap.

[ProtonXX]

techron does the same thing as seaform when pured into the intake? O_o

[pacerman]

I just did a fill up today on my 2005 AWD, filled to the top of the neck, I did 560 km or 348 miles on 49 litres or 10.7 imp gallons, that works out to 32.5 imp MPG. As a note I was a hair under 1/4 tank left and the low level light had not come on. This is city -hwy combined.Also the specs say my tank holds 45 l and 9.9 imp gallons, obviously something is wrong there, or its got one geezus big neck........ I think neck fills are the most accurate way of determining the amount of gas used fill to fill. The auto clik nozzles are not all the same , if you get a higher or lower GPM flow or less or more sensitive nozzle you can't be sure if you get the same load every time, because of sloshing and bubbles, and gurgling. Other than fuel and ambient temperature, if you neck fill everytime its gotta be really close and more accurate, it just takes a little longer to fill. my .02

[Mavrik]

I love it when I get 500KM per tank on my Vibe... I usually get about 450 in town...

[VivaVibe]

Quote, originally posted by pacerman »I think neck fills are the most accurate way of determining the amount of gas used fill to fill. The auto clik nozzles are not all the same , if you get a higher or lower GPM flow or less or more sensitive nozzle you can't be sure if you get the same load every time, because of sloshing and bubbles, and gurgling.I'm not sure what this does for you. The meter on the pump tells you how much fuel you've pumped; fast or slow doesn't matter. That divided by miles travelled gives you the MPG. Multiple the MPG by the size of the tank (13.2 USG) and that gives you most miles per full tank. What would matter is whether the pump is accurately calibrated. Over several fills, any variation will be averaged in. Running the tank down to one or two gallons to max the miles is just asking for trouble. You risk clogging the fuel pump which will have to be replaced at a very high cost.

[pacerman]

well.... if I fill it to the top of the neck -everytime- then I know almost -exactly- how much fuel i've used on that fuel run. If one relies on when the nozzle klicks off, that can vary from nozzle to nozzle and pump to pump. Thats what I was getting at. So if I fill exactly to the same level each time, I know I'm more accurate in my gas useage. The main reason not to run low on fuel is so that the pump remains cool, as it uses fuel as a coolant and lubricant. I believe the intank fuel filter has a 10 micron rating.My maxima has 145,000 miles on the original fuel pump, my Neon ACR needed one at 60,000 miles....The gas station pumps are government certified and checked yearly, although innaccuracies probably can and do occur............ the end result is that I am fairly satisfied with mt AWD mileage

[jamesmetairie]

2003 base model with 17 inch factory wheels. only gets 17mpg in the city with the a/c on.