skinny on lug nuts

Wheel and tire information and upgrade discussions

skinny on lug nuts

Postby bikeman1 » Thu Dec 03, 2009 1:43 pm

hey I have researched lug nuts for my new wheels for a 2009 vibe. looking back at earlier posts, I thought it would be good to summarize the details. Of course it will depend on exactly what wheels one buys... but here is what <> wheels had for lug nut specs.......

12mm x 1.5"
60 degree conical seat

here are the two nut sets I am looking at

http://www.calwheelaccessories...505ec

http://www.calwheelaccessories...505ec

One is open end (inside spline), one is capped (outside spline). Both cost about $25 a set plus shipping. Both are chrome over steel (I think). Mght be a concern that the inside spline may mud up...................

Anyone had any experience/bias (good/bad/indifferent) with these? Keithvibe, I know you were selling some lugs? Hmmm what were they............Of course the wheels one has will dictate what will work......

I'm not going to order either of these (or anything else) till wheels arrive and I see what's going on...any opinions out there would be welcome....seems like a subject that would benefit from the experience on this board............

BM1

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Re: skinny on lug nuts (bikeman1)

Postby tribalman » Thu Dec 03, 2009 5:19 pm

i have some similar to the 1st link for my summer rims. they are ok. 1st summer with them and i don't really have issues with them.
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Re: skinny on lug nuts (bikeman1)

Postby dragon64 » Thu Dec 03, 2009 9:29 pm

I would stay away from internal hex tuner nuts. The biggest problem is that the hex key only makes contact at 6 very small points to add to this the key itself is usually under sized and the corners that make contact with the nut are already made with a large radius. If you over torque one of these often what will happen is the key will round off the inside of the hex and can crack or break off the end of the hex on the nut becoming almost impossible to remove. Back when these were popular 12-15 years ago the only way to get these of was to drill out the stud past the seat of the nut or sometimes welding a bolt to what was left of the nut depending on the wheel.

A spline drive nut is the better choice. Not only are there more contact points on the nut but it is the drive key the splits and breaks not the nut.

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Re: skinny on lug nuts (dragon64)

Postby bikeman1 » Fri Dec 04, 2009 12:16 am

sounds believable. Add to that the potential dirt/crud problem.

The outside spline doesn't look like it would be any picnic to get off once stripped either, but it is larger and looks stronger. Thanks for the take


Quote, originally posted by dragon64 »
I would stay away from internal hex tuner nuts. The biggest problem is that the hex key only makes contact at 6 very small points to add to this the key itself is usually under sized and the corners that make contact with the nut are already made with a large radius. If you over torque one of these often what will happen is the key will round off the inside of the hex and can crack or break off the end of the hex on the nut becoming almost impossible to remove. Back when these were popular 12-15 years ago the only way to get these of was to drill out the stud past the seat of the nut or sometimes welding a bolt to what was left of the nut depending on the wheel.

A spline drive nut is the better choice. Not only are there more contact points on the nut but it is the drive key the splits and breaks not the nut.

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Re: skinny on lug nuts (bikeman1)

Postby vibolista » Fri Dec 04, 2009 4:23 am

Is there an aftermarket lug nut that would fit our steelies, other than those OEs that have that extra set of screws for wheel cap attachment. Would like to find set of plain chrome lugs to use with the steelies.

Any suggestions?

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Re: skinny on lug nuts (vibolista)

Postby keithvibe » Fri Dec 04, 2009 6:33 am

Quote, originally posted by vibolista »
Is there an aftermarket lug nut that would fit our steelies, other than those OEs that have that extra set of screws for wheel cap attachment. Would like to find set of plain chrome lugs to use with the steelies.

Any suggestions?


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Re: skinny on lug nuts (keithvibe)

Postby bikeman1 » Fri Dec 04, 2009 10:26 pm

There you go Vibo -- As usual, Keith to the rescue!

We now have the beginnings a pretty respectable post on lug nuts developing. Might even be a candidate for a sticky if we get some more useful links. I know we don't need too many stickies but lug nuts are on everyone's mind when they get new wheels, and their are a lot of options, from OEM to generic overseas stuff to name brands like Gorilla and McGard. Board ideas are really scattered around

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Re: skinny on lug nuts (keithvibe)

Postby vibolista » Sat Dec 05, 2009 9:11 am

Many thanks, Keith!
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Re: skinny on lug nuts (vibolista)

Postby keithvibe » Sat Dec 05, 2009 11:00 pm

Quote, originally posted by vibolista »
Many thanks, Keith!

i'm here to help.... well most days LOL
your welcome


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Re: skinny on lug nuts (bikeman1)

Postby dragon64 » Tue Dec 08, 2009 12:52 pm

Quote, originally posted by bikeman1 »
sounds believable. Add to that the potential dirt/crud problem.

The outside spline doesn't look like it would be any picnic to get off once stripped either, but it is larger and looks stronger. Thanks for the take


The spline drive nuts aren't that bad to remove. Not any harder than removing wheel lock. Usually just need a 12pt socket just slightly smaller, a large hammer to tap it on tightly over the lug and a breaker bar. Or just make sure that no one over torques them in the first place.

BTW there is a variation of the 12mm allen hex style tuner nut that is slightly better. This style has a T-72 internal Torks drive instead. Forgot to mention previously that if you do go with this style forget about getting the stamped steel drive key adapter. Get yourself a high quality (Snap-On, Craftsman, Mac, Etc) socket and breaker bar and only install and remove by hand.

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Postby B14CK_H4WK » Wed Dec 09, 2009 11:41 am

don't get open ended lug nuts for daily driving. just tried to get mine off.. very painfull... alot of pb blaster helped. the problem with the open ended lugs is that its more exposed to the weather and rust alot more then a closed end lug nut and really seized my lugs up. i would go with link 1
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Re: (B14CK_H4WK)

Postby bikeman1 » Sat Dec 12, 2009 12:08 am

Quote, originally posted by B14CK_H4WK »
don't get open ended lug nuts for daily driving. just tried to get mine off.. very painfull... alot of pb blaster helped. the problem with the open ended lugs is that its more exposed to the weather and rust alot more then a closed end lug nut and really seized my lugs up. i would go with link 1

especially where roads are oversalted...

B14CK BTW I really really like your ADR wheelset. I looked for them (not to copy...) for a long time but no one is stocking the ones with 42 mm offset, just the 48 mm offset, till next year. So I finally broke down and ordered a set of Velocity V910 rims, machined finish over black enamel. Still think I like yours a little better. I'll post the new wheels and tires soon.

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Re: skinny on lug nuts (keithvibe)

Postby bikeman1 » Sat Dec 12, 2009 12:21 am

Quote, originally posted by keithvibe »

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Question Keith. My new wheelset has deep deep lug sockets, over 1.5 inches to the seat and about 1 1/8" diameter. The long-style lugs with the spline would probably work best -- they will sit in there like a bug in a flower anyway. Could I also use these to replace my stock nuts on my steelies? Seems like they would stick out pretty far (1 3/8" from tip of seat to crown)

Beta Carotene ==> 1999 Military macaw native of Cleveland OH
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Re: (bikeman1)

Postby B14CK_H4WK » Sun Dec 13, 2009 5:47 am

Thank you. i love my ADR Wheels also, i have no issues with them, in a few years ill prob get them re painted though. i got mine off ebay for a steal. if you want any help looking for new wheels let me know, or if you already ordered them i really want to see some pictures, the vibe looks really benefit from after market rims. i cant stand the stock ones.

but back to the thread topic. i would never ever recommend open end lugs unless your never going to wash your car or drive in rain, or you think your car doesn't rust. its not too much fun spraying PB blaster in the lugs for an hour and trying to get them off. also the key for open ended lugs always seem to brake and twist for some off reason. I'm just using some wal mart lugs with a key right now im not too (removed) about my lugs and if their light weight or anything they only weight like 2 grams as it is.

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Re: (B14CK_H4WK)

Postby bikeman1 » Sun Dec 13, 2009 8:05 am

I agree with you on the open nut. Also, the thing about some of the "keyed" lugs out there is I can really see the key nut stripping out if any force at all needs to be applied. That goofy post found by TonyT was a warning! Think I'll take my chances on wheel theft (we're not a big crime area and it stays in a garage) and get some regular outer-hex nuts that look solid and have a 3/4 or 19mm head. Here are the ones I am looking at - similar to one of the ones Keith dug up. May work on my steelies too. One could get a spline head but if their are wheel thieves out there, they'll have all the common adaptors anyway.

I did order wheels already and they look great (off the ride) -- also a good deal purchased with tires. The machined-face, like the Venomous, should be easy to mask and paint with black clearcoat as will the red bead which sits in a groove. Here's the manufacturer photo. Will roll them out of the garage (where they'll stay till March) on a sunny day and post some pics.

Kinda sorry not to have gotten the ADRs but this way we'll know which one of us it is if we pass on the interstate

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Re: (bikeman1)

Postby keithvibe » Sun Dec 13, 2009 8:43 am

just so you know you only need 20.. lol not 24 Your going to have spair nuts laying around like I did lol


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Re: (keithvibe)

Postby bikeman1 » Sun Dec 13, 2009 8:10 pm

Quote, originally posted by keithvibe »
just so you know you only need 20.. lol not 24 Your going to have spair nuts laying around like I did lol

yes and after all the hassle I gave you about too many nuts!

Well a man can never have too many lug nuts. Maybe i can sell them individually to guys who are cutting open their wheels with a grinder. Although if you look carefully the nuts in the photo have "1/2 20" stamped on them so there may be other problems yet! Ebay....

Beta Carotene ==> 1999 Military macaw native of Cleveland OH
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Delta Vibe ==> 2009 Base 2.4L 5-speed, Red Hot Metallic
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nuts!

Postby bikeman1 » Mon Apr 05, 2010 8:58 am

I got a set of the acorn 3/4" conical seat nuts (new) and a spline set (came with my used rims) -- both capped-end. Both work OK, but I like the 3/4" nuts much better, and they are a bit beefier. A deep-socket 3/4" tool works fine with those.

Here's a good site I found in looking for a set of angle valve stems - they seem to have an excellent choice of lug nuts, cost reasonable (I did not get mine there)

http://www.ezaccessory.com/Acorn_Lug_Nuts_s/1.htm

Thanks again for the help keith....

Beta Carotene ==> 1999 Military macaw native of Cleveland OH
Gamma Vibe ==> 2007 Base 5-speed, Neptune
Delta Vibe ==> 2009 Base 2.4L 5-speed, Red Hot Metallic
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Re: nuts! (bikeman1)

Postby vibolista » Mon Apr 05, 2010 10:57 pm

Now that you have all your nuts in order, are we going to get to see the finished product? We saw the wheel... but, you're gonna drive us "nuts" if we don't get to see the wheel on the car.

So, howzzabout a picture of wheels, nuts and car, all together??

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Re: nuts! (vibolista)

Postby bikeman1 » Tue Apr 06, 2010 8:13 pm

I stand correctly admonished! Now that I finally have all my nuts in a row, I actually have 2 new wheelsets to put up.....ran into a snag on the second -- the wheelset came with inner-wheel valve holes -- set up for angle valves on a lot of vehicles due to clearance issues - but the vendor put on conventional valves, which only missed clearing the brakes on the 2009 by about half an inch (wop wop wop wop.....). Fortunately they had a fitment guarantee and were good about letting me get the right valves and have them reinstalled locally. As of Monday the new wheels are on. Not a day too soon (well maybe a day too late) - I was driving the General Arctics on a 90 degree day last Friday and out on the highway it was a bit like roller skating on melted oleo....

I'll see if I can get the wheel pix up this weekend. I still have some projects to do before i do a complete upload to the garage however...

Thanks for the friendly nag, Vibo !

BM1

Beta Carotene ==> 1999 Military macaw native of Cleveland OH
Gamma Vibe ==> 2007 Base 5-speed, Neptune
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