Are There TPMS Sensors in the Wheels?

Wheel and tire information and upgrade discussions
Post Reply
MrWhoopee
Posts: 35
Joined: Mon Dec 14, 2015 6:45 am

Are There TPMS Sensors in the Wheels?

Post by MrWhoopee » Sun Jan 10, 2016 11:38 am

I've been finding some conflicting answers to the question, so I thought I'd just ask it straight out. From reading the description of the TPMS, it would appear that there are no sensors in the wheels and all monitoring is done thru the drive-train/braking systems. Is this correct? When I replaced my summer tires on OEM rims with winter tires, the TPMS light never came on. If there were sensors in the wheels, the light should have come on and stayed on. I have not reset the system yet, but plan to do so. Just wanted to ask the question, since the system behaves differently from others I have seen. Sensors in the wheels, yes or no?
Craig
'06 Matrix Base AWD

User avatar
ColonelPanic
Posts: 8296
Joined: Sun Jan 05, 2003 8:48 am
Location: South Central Indiana

Re: Are There TPMS Sensors in the Wheels?

Post by ColonelPanic » Sun Jan 10, 2016 12:21 pm

Depends on the year... Starting in 2005, models equipped with ABS received TPMS but had no sensors in the wheel. Those relied on input from the ABS sensors. Later models transitioned to using a sensor in each wheel. I don't recall the exact year of when they went to that setup, Thinking ~2007-2008 maybe. I'm sure someone with a newer Vibe could chime in.
03 Vibe base. Born 10/14/2002 06:07 AM
Neptune. Auto, Moon & Tunes, power package. 134k mi.

Image

'13 Sonic LT - 1.4L ECOTEC turbo/6A. 111k mi.
'15 Escape SE - 1.6L EcoBoost, FWD. 56k mi. (hers)
ImageImage

MrWhoopee
Posts: 35
Joined: Mon Dec 14, 2015 6:45 am

Re: Are There TPMS Sensors in the Wheels?

Post by MrWhoopee » Sun Jan 10, 2016 1:39 pm

I forgot to state that mine is an '06 Base AWD.
Craig
'06 Matrix Base AWD

User avatar
vibenvy
Posts: 7120
Joined: Wed Apr 15, 2009 5:38 am
Location: Sandwich, IL

Re: Are There TPMS Sensors in the Wheels?

Post by vibenvy » Sun Jan 10, 2016 1:47 pm

Our 09s definitely had sensors in the wheels. They were part of the valve stem. I disabled the TPMS in 2013 and than last spring when we got new tires, I ditched the TPMS valve stems for plain old rubber ones.
Image
2009 Liquid Platinum Metallic Vibe GT - 5-Speed Auto – Garage
2009 Steel Blue Metallic Vibe GT - 5-Speed Auto – Garage

gtv237
Posts: 387
Joined: Fri May 23, 2014 6:21 pm

Re: Are There TPMS Sensors in the Wheels?

Post by gtv237 » Sun Jan 10, 2016 5:21 pm

I don't know about the earlier years but my TPMS uses solid aluminum valve stems. I guess you could take a look at yours if they're solid then you have TPMS sensors. If they're rubber, you may or may not have them as TPMS sensors are available with both solid and rubber stems.

MrWhoopee
Posts: 35
Joined: Mon Dec 14, 2015 6:45 am

Re: Are There TPMS Sensors in the Wheels?

Post by MrWhoopee » Sun Jan 10, 2016 7:58 pm

I attempted to reset my TPMS this evening. Nothing happened, no lights, no blinking, nothing. Further investigation will be necessary.
Craig
'06 Matrix Base AWD

ehoff121
Posts: 756
Joined: Mon Feb 26, 2007 12:19 am
Location: Conn.

Re: Are There TPMS Sensors in the Wheels?

Post by ehoff121 » Mon Jan 11, 2016 11:14 am

MrWhoopee wrote:I forgot to state that mine is an '06 Base AWD.
The TPMS system works off of the existing ABS sensors on the hub, thus there are are no separate sensors inside the wheel. (Don't let a tire shop charge you extra just because the vehicle has TPMS!)
MrWhoopee wrote:I attempted to reset my TPMS this evening. Nothing happened, no lights, no blinking, nothing. Further investigation will be necessary.
If you followed the process correctly (copied from the manual here viewtopic.php?f=31&t=44795&p=508827#p508827), you won't see any feedback.
2005 Pontiac Vibe AWD - Platinum

MrWhoopee
Posts: 35
Joined: Mon Dec 14, 2015 6:45 am

Re: Are There TPMS Sensors in the Wheels?

Post by MrWhoopee » Mon Jan 11, 2016 12:51 pm

ehoff121 wrote:If you followed the process correctly (copied from the manual here viewtopic.php?f=31&t=44795&p=508827#p508827), you won't see any feedback.
I followed that procedure. It states:

4. Press and hold the SET (reset) button until the low-tire warning light comes on and
flashes on/off three times. The tire pressure warning reset button starts the reset
(initialization) process.
If the low-tire pressure warning light does not flash when you hold the reset button,
the system may be malfunctioning and needs service. See a GM dealer for service.


The light on the button never lit at all. Wonder if the fuse is blown or removed.
Craig
'06 Matrix Base AWD

ehoff121
Posts: 756
Joined: Mon Feb 26, 2007 12:19 am
Location: Conn.

Re: Are There TPMS Sensors in the Wheels?

Post by ehoff121 » Tue Jan 12, 2016 11:34 am

MrWhoopee wrote:The light on the button never lit at all. Wonder if the fuse is blown or removed.
Does the indicator light go on when you first turn the key to on (not starting engine, though)?
2005 Pontiac Vibe AWD - Platinum

MrWhoopee
Posts: 35
Joined: Mon Dec 14, 2015 6:45 am

Re: Are There TPMS Sensors in the Wheels?

Post by MrWhoopee » Tue Jan 12, 2016 4:28 pm

ehoff121 wrote: Does the indicator light go on when you first turn the key to on (not starting engine, though)?
No, it never lights.
Craig
'06 Matrix Base AWD

jolt
Posts: 693
Joined: Sun Mar 02, 2014 2:07 am
Location: Twin Cities, Minnesota

Re: Are There TPMS Sensors in the Wheels?

Post by jolt » Sun Feb 07, 2016 6:04 pm

This is from Wikipedia: "The Firestone recall in the late 1990s (which was linked to more than 100 deaths from rollovers following tire tread-separation), pushed the United States Congress to legislate the TREAD Act. The Act mandated the use of a suitable TPMS technology in all light motor vehicles (under 10,000 pounds), to help alert drivers of under-inflation events. This act affects all light motor vehicles sold after September 1, 2007. Phase-in started in October 2005 at 20%, and reached 100% for models produced after September 2007."

So your 2006 may or may not have TPMS, as your vehicle is in the phase in period. My 2009 does have the pressure sensors in the rims. The sensors have batteries in them to transmit the data to a receiver. The receiver is located behind the upper quarter trim panel on the drivers side on the 2009. As stated above, any car sold after September 1, 2007 in the U.S. has TPMS by law. Again; Your 2006 may or may not have TPMS, as your vehicle is in the phase in period. Check in your owners manual and see what it says in there, the marking on the dash panel may just be there getting ready for TPMS as it was phased in.

ehoff121
Posts: 756
Joined: Mon Feb 26, 2007 12:19 am
Location: Conn.

Re: Are There TPMS Sensors in the Wheels?

Post by ehoff121 » Wed Feb 17, 2016 6:10 pm

MrWhoopee wrote:
ehoff121 wrote: Does the indicator light go on when you first turn the key to on (not starting engine, though)?
No, it never lights.
Just wanted to make sure you were looking in the right place because the light doesn't stay on long. The indicator is next to the fuel gauge, about 1/2" to the left of the "F". It's orange and looks like a cross section of a tire's sidewall and tread ("U" shaped).
2005 Pontiac Vibe AWD - Platinum

MrWhoopee
Posts: 35
Joined: Mon Dec 14, 2015 6:45 am

Re: Are There TPMS Sensors in the Wheels?

Post by MrWhoopee » Wed Feb 17, 2016 7:30 pm

ehoff121 wrote:
MrWhoopee wrote:
ehoff121 wrote: Does the indicator light go on when you first turn the key to on (not starting engine, though)?
No, it never lights.
Just wanted to make sure you were looking in the right place because the light doesn't stay on long. The indicator is next to the fuel gauge, about 1/2" to the left of the "F". It's orange and looks like a cross section of a tire's sidewall and tread ("U" shaped).
Sorry, I misunderstood. The TPMS indicator light on the dash does light up when I turn on the key, then goes out. The light on the reset button never lights.
Craig
'06 Matrix Base AWD

jolt
Posts: 693
Joined: Sun Mar 02, 2014 2:07 am
Location: Twin Cities, Minnesota

Re: Are There TPMS Sensors in the Wheels?

Post by jolt » Thu Feb 18, 2016 11:47 am

I don't know if this will help you but you may want to check this out, keeping in mind that the Vibe is a Toyota Matrix.

http://www.brakeandfrontend.com/tpms-up ... systems/2/

As little information as I could find about this, what I have seen is that 2007 and up have wheel sensors. 2005 and 2006 have some type of indirect sensing system. The link above talks about the 2005 and 2006 system a little but it is different then the 2007 and above.

http://www.brakeandfrontend.com/indirec ... -the-road/

And here may be a better description of how the indirect system works.

http://www.tomorrowstechnician.com/indi ... -comeback/

From reading this it looks like you do not have sensors in your wheels. Changes in tire diameter is what sets off the system instead of direct tire pressure readings, which is why it needs to driven around for an hour to learn the reset.

ehoff121
Posts: 756
Joined: Mon Feb 26, 2007 12:19 am
Location: Conn.

Re: Are There TPMS Sensors in the Wheels?

Post by ehoff121 » Thu Feb 18, 2016 12:46 pm

MrWhoopee wrote:Sorry, I misunderstood. The TPMS indicator light on the dash does light up when I turn on the key, then goes out. The light on the reset button never lights.
The SET button doesn't light up. The only TPMS light is the indicator on the dashboard.

To start the TPMS reset:

1. Press and hold the SET (reset) button
2. Turn the ignition to ON, but do not start the engine.
3. Once the low-tire warning light comes on and flashes three times, release the SET button.

The initialization process can take up to approximately one hour of driving under the following conditions:
The vehicle speed is between 31 mph and 62 mph.
The roads are dry, smooth and straight.
The number of passengers is one or two (including the driver).
2005 Pontiac Vibe AWD - Platinum

motohockey
Posts: 12
Joined: Mon Nov 02, 2009 9:28 am

Re: Are There TPMS Sensors in the Wheels?

Post by motohockey » Sun Jan 20, 2019 8:56 am

where is the TPMS reset in a 2009 Vibw 2.4 AWD? Thanks

jolt
Posts: 693
Joined: Sun Mar 02, 2014 2:07 am
Location: Twin Cities, Minnesota

Re: Are There TPMS Sensors in the Wheels?

Post by jolt » Wed Jan 23, 2019 11:30 pm

2009 reset button is mounted to the instrument panel lower trim panel, above the throttle pedal.

Transylvania
Posts: 40
Joined: Sun Sep 23, 2018 3:21 pm
Location: Fort Worth, TX

Re: Are There TPMS Sensors in the Wheels?

Post by Transylvania » Mon Aug 12, 2019 10:46 am

vibenvy wrote:
Sun Jan 10, 2016 1:47 pm
Our 09s definitely had sensors in the wheels. They were part of the valve stem. I disabled the TPMS in 2013 and than last spring when we got new tires, I ditched the TPMS valve stems for plain old rubber ones.
My TPMS light came on and I am wondering how did you disable TPMS on your 2009? I have a 2010 base version with the 2.4L engine.

Thanks.

User avatar
Caretaker
Posts: 1714
Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2003 4:11 am

Re: Are There TPMS Sensors in the Wheels?

Post by Caretaker » Thu Dec 05, 2019 10:48 am

What a PITA. I put air in all the tires, which needed only a few sips, and now my TPMS light is flashing indicating one or more of the sensors has gone bad. The tires are all new and fine; non are leaking. I then pulled the spare and raised the pressure up to 60 from 50 psi. I don't think spares have monitors in them. Anyway, I tried the reset procedure but I cannot get the light to flash 3 times, further indicating one of the sensors has gone bad after 10 years. Is a code stored somewhere that will determine which sensor has gone bad or do mechanics have sensor tricorders?
Live it up: There will be plenty of time to be old when you die.
** 2009 Vibe: 1.8 liter automatic **
** 2010 Hyundai Elantra Touring **
** 2007 Honda Fit Sport **

zbyers
Posts: 934
Joined: Thu Apr 03, 2014 6:12 pm
Location: Sheffield, Pennsylvania

Re: Are There TPMS Sensors in the Wheels?

Post by zbyers » Thu Dec 05, 2019 12:33 pm

Caretaker wrote:
Thu Dec 05, 2019 10:48 am
What a PITA. I put air in all the tires, which needed only a few sips, and now my TPMS light is flashing indicating one or more of the sensors has gone bad. The tires are all new and fine; non are leaking. I then pulled the spare and raised the pressure up to 60 from 50 psi. I don't think spares have monitors in them. Anyway, I tried the reset procedure but I cannot get the light to flash 3 times, further indicating one of the sensors has gone bad after 10 years. Is a code stored somewhere that will determine which sensor has gone bad or do mechanics have sensor tricorders?
As far as I know, the spare does not have a sensor. If it did, the value stem should also (usually) be aluminum.

As for the codes, there should be a way to trip the TPMS light and have it flash a certain pattern, which would tell you what wheel it is. I haven't a clue what the process is to do that, though.
(2) '03 Bases, '04 GT, '04 AWD, '06 AWD, '07 Base, '17 Frontier CCLB
Byerscrew Garage, GenVibe Facebook, How-To Index
Everything You Need To Know About the Pontiac Vibe

User avatar
Caretaker
Posts: 1714
Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2003 4:11 am

Re: Are There TPMS Sensors in the Wheels?

Post by Caretaker » Thu Dec 05, 2019 5:12 pm

Thanks, but the mystery deepens. Despite my pushing the reset button for many minutes this afternoon to get the light to flash rapidly 3 times, alas, my TPMS light was off when I went to see some holiday lights tonight. I can't say what made the light turn on today and I can't say what made it turn off tonight. Since we lived with the light on for over 3 years on our HET, I guess I can live with it for the duration of the Vibe's life should it come back again and all my tires consistently measure around 34 PSI.
Live it up: There will be plenty of time to be old when you die.
** 2009 Vibe: 1.8 liter automatic **
** 2010 Hyundai Elantra Touring **
** 2007 Honda Fit Sport **

jolt
Posts: 693
Joined: Sun Mar 02, 2014 2:07 am
Location: Twin Cities, Minnesota

Re: Are There TPMS Sensors in the Wheels?

Post by jolt » Thu Dec 05, 2019 10:36 pm

A battery may be going dead in the TPM so the receiver was not seeing the information. You said that the thing started working again; the temperature of the wheel will effect the TPM battery and maybe it got warm enough so that it got enough power to get a signal out. As it gets colder the light may come on again. The TPM battery is said to be good for 10 years but that can vary. Here is the info I have for the Vibe 2009 TPM. I do have more info but this will get you started and you can see how much money you want to spend. Once one TPM battery goes, the others are not far behind and if you do one at a time, the programming will cost more then the sensors.

Tire Pressure Monitor System Configuration
It is necessary to initialize the system when any of the following conditions occur:
1. If necessary, perform Tire Pressure Sensor Learn .
2. Adjust all tire pressures to the proper specification.
3. With the ignition On, push and hold the tire pressure warning reset switch until the warning light blinks 3 times. Turn the ignition Off, then turn the ignition On again.
4. Using a scan tool, verify the tire pressures are properly displayed. If tire pressures are not displayed, initialization was not completed.

Tire Pressure Indicator Sensor Learn
It is necessary to register the sensor IDs in the tire pressure control module, when replacing any of the sensors and/or the control module.
Prepare all sensor ID data before starting registration procedure.
1. Read and record the sensor IDs that are stored in the control module. If sensor IDs cannot be read due to component malfunctions, remove the tires from the wheels and record the IDs located on the sensors.
Important: When replacing a sensor, record the 7-digit ID number on the sensor.
2. With the scan tool, input the sensor IDs and transmit them to the control module.
3. Confirm that the tire pressure data is displayed for all tires.
4. Confirm that the tire pressure warning light is Off

The Toyota Techstream software can read each wheels tire pressure and can program the sensors to the controller. So if you check Ebay, you may find a cable that will let you hook a lap top up with the Techstream software and see if all the wheels are being seen by the controller. The spare tire should not be on the TPM system. If the spare has a rubber stem in the rim, it does not have a sensor. A older lap top with Windows XP is the easiest to work with to setup the Techstream software. Off brand sensors might require that their programmer has to used to register their sensors in the controller so which out for this if you go to replace the sensor. Also make sure you get the right frequency sensors, this is not a GM product.

andrewclaus
Posts: 201
Joined: Tue Oct 03, 2017 6:38 pm
Location: Golden, CO

Re: Are There TPMS Sensors in the Wheels?

Post by andrewclaus » Fri Dec 06, 2019 6:42 am

Ditto the above. My old Techstream Mini V cable (got on eBay years ago, under $20) was able to read individual tire sensors. It won't tell you which wheel, just a code number. I had to change pressure in tires to identify wheel position. I suppose you could remove a wheel to get it out of range, too.

I believe only full size spares have sensors. Techstream does have lines for five sensors, and I helped a friend who had five sensors.

Techstream is a powerful tool, but at that cost you won't get support or a manual. Menus are pretty good though. I keep an old Win7 laptop in the garage just for it. It may not be plug-and-play, requiring a little PC savvy to set up. But again, about what you'd expect at that cost.

Post Reply