GM may "kill" or sell Pontiac

The latest news on what's happening with the Pontiac Vibe & Toyota Matrix.
Firescooby
Posts: 35
Joined: Sat Oct 13, 2007 12:21 pm

GM may "kill" or sell Pontiac

Post by Firescooby »

Wondering how this will work out. Service at other GM dealerships or Toyota?http://www.egmcartech.com/2008...aturn/
2009 Vibe GT - Hot Red Metallic2006 Chevy 2500HD 4wd Duramax/ Allison2005 Toyota Sienna LE1998 Honda Civic DX - SOLD
keithvibe
Posts: 4953
Joined: Sat Sep 23, 2006 3:52 am
Contact:

Re: GM may "kill" or sell Pontiac (Firescooby)

Post by keithvibe »

repost my friend
2010 Vibe & member of the yeargarage Email me if you need to talk to me, click my siggy and send the email threw the contact page.
jake75
Posts: 4792
Joined: Sun Feb 09, 2003 1:33 pm
Location: Columbus, OH

Re: GM may "kill" or sell Pontiac (keithvibe)

Post by jake75 »

ARTICLE:According to a report by Bloomberg, GM is considering dropping Pontiac, Saab and Saturn as a way to cut costs and to increase the chance of the Detroit Big 3 getting $25 billion in federal loans. Bloomberg cited anonymous sources that said GM is considering eliminating or selling the brands to help it avoid running out of money - which it recently said could happen as soon as the second-quarter of 2009.No GM spokesperson has commented on the report as of yet but it is widely believed that the move could be included in the restructuring plan GM will submit to Congress on Tuesday. Congress had asked Mulally, Wagoner and Nardelli to come up with a plan that would display that the company’s would become profitable enough to repay the $25 billion in federal loans.GM has already announced that it is selling its Hummer brand. We’d love to hear what you think - so let us know what you think of this report and whether GM should sell the brands listed.Follow the jump and hug it out in the comments section.Source: Detorit News ----------------------------------------------------------------------The question - who in their right mind would buy Pontiac and/or Saturn?And isn't it Buick that is in worse shape?
2009 Vibe 1.8L Carbon Gray AT Power Pkg 1/12/092003 Vibe 1.8L Neptune AT Mono Power Pkg 1/27/03 [sold 2/2/09]2007 T&C SWB 7/31/07 "Broke people stay broke by living like they're rich. Rich people stay rich by living like they're broke."
Truckin1999
Posts: 116
Joined: Wed Jun 20, 2007 8:50 am

Post by Truckin1999 »

GM won't kill pontiac. Maybe Saab and Saturn, but not Pontiac.
-Sean Cummings--Crushed Blue Steel Motorsports-06' GT, Abyss, Leather, M&T, Tint, Roof Spoiler, Magnaflow Cat-Back, K&N Short Ram modified for ram-air, S-Tech's, 18" KV5 Wheels, SLP Ram-Air Hood, paint matched headlights, strut tower brace.Now Making Custom Vibe Sub Enclosures
jake75
Posts: 4792
Joined: Sun Feb 09, 2003 1:33 pm
Location: Columbus, OH

Re: (Truckin1999)

Post by jake75 »

Adv Age ArticleGM Bailout Plan Could Cut Pontiac, Saturn and SaabCash Crunch May Spell the End for Weaker BrandsBy Judann Pollack and Bradley JohnsonPublished: December 01, 2008NEW YORK (AdAge.com) -- It looks as if Pontiac, Saab and Saturn could be on the General Motors endangered-brand list -- and with them some $300 million in measured-media spending.According to a report from Bloomberg that cites unnamed sources, the country's largest automaker is weighing whether to jettison those brands to ease its tightening cash crunch. The company, which is leading the three U.S. automakers in seeking a $25 billion federal bailout, has until next week to present a business plan to Capitol Hill that will appease lawmakers.Pontiac, Saab and Saturn are among the weaker brands on the marketer's roster, which also includes Buick, Cadillac, Chevrolet, GMC and Hummer (the company is already seeking a buyer for the last). Indeed, handicapping the brands most likely to be axed by GM earlier this year, Ad Age said of Pontiac that it'd likely be the first to go. In the same July 14 story, we also said that experts would like to see Saab sold too. Those same experts said Saturn was a brand worth salvaging.Pontiac, Saab and Saturn account for 20.7% of GM's total measured-media spending and 16.5% of its sales, according to an Ad Age analysis of TNS Media Intelligence and Automotive News figures. The three brands together had $286 million in measured spending through August and $400 million for full-year 2007. According to Automotive News, Pontiac sales through October tallied about 239,000 units, down 20.9% from the same period in 2007. Its peak sales year was 1978, when it sold 896,980 units. The brand is handled by Publicis Groupe's Leo Burnett; Pontiac had measured spending of about $90 million through August.Saab sold 19,000 units through October, down 30.8%. Its agency is Interpublic's McCann Erickson, Birmingham, Mich. According to TNS Media Intelligence, measured spending was $22 million through August.While at first glance it may seem as if Buick should have made the list rather than Saturn, consider that while its U.S. sales are low, Buick is thriving in China. Saturn sales were 167,000 units through October, according to Automotive News. TNS Media Intelligence puts its spending at $174 million through August. Saturn is handled by Interpublics's Deutsch.
2009 Vibe 1.8L Carbon Gray AT Power Pkg 1/12/092003 Vibe 1.8L Neptune AT Mono Power Pkg 1/27/03 [sold 2/2/09]2007 T&C SWB 7/31/07 "Broke people stay broke by living like they're rich. Rich people stay rich by living like they're broke."
ou.grizzly
Posts: 2660
Joined: Sat Mar 01, 2008 5:26 pm

Re: (Truckin1999)

Post by ou.grizzly »

Quote, originally posted by Truckin1999 »GM won't kill pontiac. Maybe Saab and Saturn, but not Pontiac. What makes you so sure of that, remember Oldsmobile?
2009 Jet Black 2.4L Auto / Fogs / 17" Alum / Clear Bra / Camry Leather Shift Knob / GT Rear Spoiler
2013 Polished Metallic Honda CR-V EX-L Navi
kunkstyle
Posts: 1236
Joined: Tue Sep 11, 2007 12:51 pm

Re: (ou.grizzly)

Post by kunkstyle »

Quote, originally posted by ou.grizzly »What makes you so sure of that, remember Oldsmobile? I was going to ask the very same question.
Kunkstyle's Garage:2006 AWD Pontiac VibeInfinity/Rockford/Kenwood Audio, CAI, Cupholder LED's, Keyless Entry Mod2000 Porsche 911 C2Kenwood Audio, Ultimate Cupholders, DRL's, 0-60 in 4.9 seconds.
micbarric
Posts: 190
Joined: Sat Apr 16, 2005 11:22 pm

Re: GM may "kill" or sell Pontiac (Firescooby)

Post by micbarric »

Looking at the latest sales numbers, it's not clear why GM would kill Pontiac.Calendar Year-to-Date Sales, January - November 2008:1. Chevrolet - 1,663,4402. GMC - 347,2133. Pontiac - 250,9024. Saturn - 175,4345. Cadillac - 147,9246. Buick - 128,2887. Hummer - 25,3158. Saab - 20,189Source: http://media.gm.com/servlet/Ga...50747
2005 Frosty
swampy2b
Posts: 1
Joined: Wed Nov 15, 2006 10:01 pm

Re: GM may "kill" or sell Pontiac (micbarric)

Post by swampy2b »

Indeed, GM is not killing Pontiac. According to the the Washington Post:In releasing its new business plan, GM said it would concentrate on four brands -- Chevrolet, GMC, Buick and Cadillac -- and would turn Pontiac into a niche brand that would complement Cadillac and GMC. The automaker said it plans to sell its Saab division and would begin discussions with Saturn dealers to fold or sell the brand.Besides, without Pontiac most, if not all GMC dealerships would have no cars to sell. Buick sells 3 cars - one is a crossover - they don't count. You couldn't give them Chevrolet because I have yet to see a GMC dealership in a market that didn't already have a Chevrolet dealership. Saturn dealerships only sell Saturns, so one way or another a dealership would have to close to sell Saturn with GMC, or vice versa.
User avatar
ColonelPanic
Posts: 8419
Joined: Sun Jan 05, 2003 8:48 am
Location: South Central Indiana

Re: GM may "kill" or sell Pontiac (micbarric)

Post by ColonelPanic »

Quote, originally posted by micbarric »2. GMC - 347,213What the? I didn't realize they sold that many rebadged Chevrolets.I still have yet to figure out the reason behind GMC's continued existance... If a "premium" truck is what they want, why not just put the extra chrome on a Chevy and call it a day? It's the same thing!
03 Vibe base. Born 10/14/2002 06:07 AM
Auto, Moon & Tunes, power package. 143k
Neptune/dying clearcoat/primer grey. :lol:

Image

'21 Elantra Limited - 2.0L/IVT
'15 Escape SE - 1.6L EcoBoost (hers)
Image Image
AKLGT
Posts: 11694
Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2003 2:57 pm

Re: GM may "kill" or sell Pontiac (ColonelPanic)

Post by AKLGT »

Quote, originally posted by ColonelPanic »What the? I didn't realize they sold that many rebadged Chevrolets.I still have yet to figure out the reason behind GMC's continued existance... If a "premium" truck is what they want, why not just put the extra chrome on a Chevy and call it a day? It's the same thing!agreed.
AKLGT1998 Subaru 2.5RS
SeattleJeremy
Posts: 1170
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2006 4:02 pm
Location: Tacoma, WA

Re: GM may "kill" or sell Pontiac (AKLGT)

Post by SeattleJeremy »

According to Autoblog Pontiac will become a "niche" brand. http://www.autoblog.com/2008/1...-plan/Likely only selling cool cars like the G8 and other re-branded Holdins. Maybe they'll keep the Astra as a Pontiac, it's already kind of a niche car.
*Sold* 06' Vibe Base - Mono Platinum - Manual
Turo'ing 15' BMW 328i Sport - Jet Black - Auto
Daily 19' Toyota Camry SE Hybrid - Galactic Aqua Mica - eCVT
scherry2
Posts: 4073
Joined: Wed Mar 26, 2003 8:02 am

Re: GM may "kill" or sell Pontiac (ColonelPanic)

Post by scherry2 »

Quote, originally posted by ColonelPanic »I still have yet to figure out the reason behind GMC's continued existance... If a "premium" truck is what they want, why not just put the extra chrome on a Chevy and call it a day? It's the same thing!your kind of close. GMC 1/2 ton pick-ups are the premium editions with better suspension parts nicer interior, ect... and different sheet metal than the Chevy. which is classed as the every man's truck. come on up to Fort Wayne and I'll give you a tour. and did you notice on the sales sheet that GM's highest seller in November was the (get this) Chevy Silverado-C/K Pickup 29,534 Chevrolet Fullsize Pickups 31,530 GMC Sierra Pickups10,497I thought the great PR machine said the truck market was dead. gm 1/2 ton extended cab 2 wheel drive and 1/2 ton extended cab 4x4 days on hand 50/60 respectively. GM likes a 100 days on hand cushion. we can't build enough. someone's buying them.
jake75
Posts: 4792
Joined: Sun Feb 09, 2003 1:33 pm
Location: Columbus, OH

Re: GM may "kill" or sell Pontiac (scherry2)

Post by jake75 »

You already see a lot of "Pontiac-Buick-GMC" Dealers.When was the first Saturn? Early 90's?
2009 Vibe 1.8L Carbon Gray AT Power Pkg 1/12/092003 Vibe 1.8L Neptune AT Mono Power Pkg 1/27/03 [sold 2/2/09]2007 T&C SWB 7/31/07 "Broke people stay broke by living like they're rich. Rich people stay rich by living like they're broke."
jake75
Posts: 4792
Joined: Sun Feb 09, 2003 1:33 pm
Location: Columbus, OH

Re: GM may "kill" or sell Pontiac (jake75)

Post by jake75 »

45,000 Vibes out of 251,000 Pontiacs sold through NovemberThat's almost 1 out of 5.
2009 Vibe 1.8L Carbon Gray AT Power Pkg 1/12/092003 Vibe 1.8L Neptune AT Mono Power Pkg 1/27/03 [sold 2/2/09]2007 T&C SWB 7/31/07 "Broke people stay broke by living like they're rich. Rich people stay rich by living like they're broke."
jake75
Posts: 4792
Joined: Sun Feb 09, 2003 1:33 pm
Location: Columbus, OH

Re: GM may "kill" or sell Pontiac (jake75)

Post by jake75 »

From WikipediaPrevious ModelsThe company's products used a dedicated platform called the Z-body and a dedicated engine, the 1.9 L Saturn I4 engine, and a dedicated plant in Spring Hill, Tennessee. All of the original Saturns featured dent-resistant plastic body panels which were also touted as allowing the company to change the look of the vehicles readily. However, in practice, the company did not take advantage of this capability often.Saturn S-Series cars were produced from 1991-2002. There were 3 Generations of S-Series Cars. First Generation S-Series cars were produced from 1991-1994. For the 1995 Model year, Saturn implemented a "First Generation" exterior, and "Second Generation" interior. The exterior of the 1995 model year looked the same as the first generation cars, but exhibited larger gauge faces on the instrument cluster, and a redesigned middle console. First Generation engines were rated at 85 Horsepower for the Single Overhead Cam Engines, while the Dual Overhead Cam Engines were rated at 124 Horsepower for the entire run of S-Series cars (1991-2002). In 1996, the Second Generation S-Series Sedan was introduced and remained virtually unchanged for the rest of the vehicle's production run. In 1997, the Second Generation of the Sport Coupe model was introduced with a more "scooped" headlight front. The S-Series was produced in three variations: Coupe (SC), Sedan (SL), and Wagon (SW). The Wagon was introduced for the 1993 Model year and was produced until 2001.The first real change came with the 2000 Saturn L-Series mid-size car. It shared the GM2900 platform with the Opel Vectra, along with its engine, and was built at a GM factory in Wilmington, Delaware. The Saturn Sky is now being produced in the Wilmington factory along with the essentially identical Opel GT and the closely-related Pontiac Solstice.In recent years, sales had been in decline. Ion production lines were halted for two weeks in 2003 to allow dealer inventory to reduce. The L-Series was canceled after production of the 2005 models, and the Ion was canceled after 2007.[edit] TodayToday, the company shares GM's Delta, Epsilon, Lambda and Theta platforms, and the company's Ecotec engines - including the new 2.4L LE5 I4, Turbo 2.0L LNF I4, and DCVCP 1.8L I4 - with the V6's being the High Feature LY7 3.6L V6 and High Value LZ4 3.5L V6 engines. Saturn cars are built at GM plants throughout the world. The Saturn Vue used a Honda engine in the past, and the plastic body panels have been discontinued on most current vehicles.The current Saturn models are the Sky roadster, the Aura sedan, the Astra hatchback, the Vue small crossover SUV and the Outlook large crossover SUV built off of the GM Lambda platform (replacing the Relay minivan).Saturns are now virtually identical to certain Opel models. For example, the 2008 Saturn Vue is a rebadged Opel Antara, while the Opel GT is based on the Saturn Sky. The Opel Astra is imported as the Saturn Astra (replacing the Ion as the entry-level car), and the Saturn Aura is similar to the Opel Vectra. The Saturn Astra is built in Antwerp, Belgium.The company offers two sub-lines of vehicles: "Red Line" Saturns are performance-oriented, while "Green Line" cars are more environmentally friendly hybrids. The Vue and Ion Red Line models, launched in 2004, have been joined by Vue and AURA Green Lines for the 2007 model year and a Sky Red Line the same model year. Saturn's Green Line vehicles utilize mild hybrid technology.
2009 Vibe 1.8L Carbon Gray AT Power Pkg 1/12/092003 Vibe 1.8L Neptune AT Mono Power Pkg 1/27/03 [sold 2/2/09]2007 T&C SWB 7/31/07 "Broke people stay broke by living like they're rich. Rich people stay rich by living like they're broke."
NascarXprt
Posts: 4797
Joined: Fri Nov 12, 2004 12:38 pm
Location: San Antonio, TX

Re: GM may "kill" or sell Pontiac (ColonelPanic)

Post by NascarXprt »

Quote, originally posted by ColonelPanic »What the? I didn't realize they sold that many rebadged Chevrolets.I still have yet to figure out the reason behind GMC's continued existance... If a "premium" truck is what they want, why not just put the extra chrome on a Chevy and call it a day? It's the same thing!Quote, originally posted by AKLGT »agreed. +2im actually kinda tired of seeing all those dam GMCs there exact copies of chevys but with stuff like wood grain dash kits and leather heated seats.or the "Denali" versions. GM just needs to merge GMC into Chevy and Caddys. or maybe move the Sierra into the Cadillac name plate now caddy has a truck, suv, and cars like chevy.
Image
My '04 Garage - My '06 Garage - My '09 GT Garage
November 2006 MOTM / February 2007 VOTM / April 2010 VOTM / June 2011 VOTM
scherry2
Posts: 4073
Joined: Wed Mar 26, 2003 8:02 am

Re: GM may "kill" or sell Pontiac (NascarXprt)

Post by scherry2 »

Quote, originally posted by NascarXprt »im actually kinda tired of seeing all those dam GMCs there exact copies of chevys but with stuff like wood grain dash kits and leather heated seats.or the "Denali" versions. really? wow when we build them they have different formed sheet metal and different interiors. when the 2 are side by side there is quite a difference. and GM is going to have GMC the premium truck and Chevy the every day worker truck. in 2011 they are going to bring out a Hybrid pick-up "not" based on the old version of the Hybrid from 4 years ago.
silvrhawk7
Posts: 266
Joined: Wed Jan 17, 2007 10:19 am

Re: GM may "kill" or sell Pontiac (micbarric)

Post by silvrhawk7 »

Quote, originally posted by micbarric »Looking at the latest sales numbers, it's not clear why GM would kill Pontiac.Calendar Year-to-Date Sales, January - November 2008:1. Chevrolet - 1,663,4402. GMC - 347,2133. Pontiac - 250,9024. Saturn - 175,4345. Cadillac - 147,9246. Buick - 128,2887. Hummer - 25,3158. Saab - 20,189Source: http://media.gm.com/servlet/Ga...50747Get rid of buick, hummer and saab, and here is why....From what i see, Buick is mainly goaled at the 70-90 year old range, they are not a big seller, and way overpriced, GM tries to make it the lower end Cadillac. And there is a major price difference at the dealers when it comes to a Buick enclave and GMC acadia that are loaded with the same features. i guess woodgrain has gone up in price over the years.Hummer should have stayed as a military vehicle and nothing more, lets be reasonable here, these vehicles premired right before gas climbed to $3-4 a gallon, and all i see are H2 and H3s that have about $30,000 worth of bling on them with a soccer mom (on the cell phone) and 4 kids and the lapdog on the moms lap and dont get me started on their driving habits.And lately Saab's have been on the decline, i remember seeing a lot of them 5 years ago, now i only see one once a month if that on the road.
In Memory, taken too early in a rear end collision
Sunrise: June 2006, Sunset: Jan 2015 :cry:
Miles 129,000
2006 Silver Mono, Base 4-Speed auto.
In Memory of Pontiac Motor Division 1926-2010
In Memory of the Pontiac Vibe 2002-2009
NascarXprt
Posts: 4797
Joined: Fri Nov 12, 2004 12:38 pm
Location: San Antonio, TX

Re: GM may "kill" or sell Pontiac (silvrhawk7)

Post by NascarXprt »

well the thing is GM wont get rid of buick, even though they arent sellint well here they are selling buicks like crazy in china.Quote, originally posted by scherry2 »really? wow when we build them they have different formed sheet metal and different interiors. when the 2 are side by side there is quite a difference. and GM is going to have GMC the premium truck and Chevy the every day worker truck. in 2011 they are going to bring out a Hybrid pick-up "not" based on the old version of the Hybrid from 4 years ago. to me it seems that you can swap out the whole front end like you could with the old chevy pick-ups and same with the old 99 fords and lincoln navi's. but yea side-by-side you can tell a diff. in the two. but i do think they use almost the same frame, chassis, body. with the excepiton of the front sheet metal. yea the new hybrid is going to be a big step forward from the last hybrid model they made.
Image
My '04 Garage - My '06 Garage - My '09 GT Garage
November 2006 MOTM / February 2007 VOTM / April 2010 VOTM / June 2011 VOTM
User avatar
ColonelPanic
Posts: 8419
Joined: Sun Jan 05, 2003 8:48 am
Location: South Central Indiana

Re: GM may "kill" or sell Pontiac (NascarXprt)

Post by ColonelPanic »

China does like Buicks... but some aren't even Buicks, they're models built in Korea by GMDAT.. Buick has a version of that Daewoo they sold here as the Suzuki Forenza, for instance.
03 Vibe base. Born 10/14/2002 06:07 AM
Auto, Moon & Tunes, power package. 143k
Neptune/dying clearcoat/primer grey. :lol:

Image

'21 Elantra Limited - 2.0L/IVT
'15 Escape SE - 1.6L EcoBoost (hers)
Image Image
NascarXprt
Posts: 4797
Joined: Fri Nov 12, 2004 12:38 pm
Location: San Antonio, TX

Re: GM may "kill" or sell Pontiac (ColonelPanic)

Post by NascarXprt »

i never knew that. very interesting.
Image
My '04 Garage - My '06 Garage - My '09 GT Garage
November 2006 MOTM / February 2007 VOTM / April 2010 VOTM / June 2011 VOTM
scherry2
Posts: 4073
Joined: Wed Mar 26, 2003 8:02 am

Re: GM may "kill" or sell Pontiac (NascarXprt)

Post by scherry2 »

Quote, originally posted by NascarXprt »to me it seems that you can swap out the whole front end like you could with the old chevy pick-ups and same with the old 99 fords and lincoln navi's.its kind of like the vibe matrix relationship, you could change front clips but you would have problems with wire harnesses, different hose routings, ect. it could be done though.
silvrhawk7
Posts: 266
Joined: Wed Jan 17, 2007 10:19 am

Post by silvrhawk7 »

Isn't the Chevy Aveo a Rebadged Daewoo as well??
In Memory, taken too early in a rear end collision
Sunrise: June 2006, Sunset: Jan 2015 :cry:
Miles 129,000
2006 Silver Mono, Base 4-Speed auto.
In Memory of Pontiac Motor Division 1926-2010
In Memory of the Pontiac Vibe 2002-2009
User avatar
ColonelPanic
Posts: 8419
Joined: Sun Jan 05, 2003 8:48 am
Location: South Central Indiana

Re: (silvrhawk7)

Post by ColonelPanic »

yes
03 Vibe base. Born 10/14/2002 06:07 AM
Auto, Moon & Tunes, power package. 143k
Neptune/dying clearcoat/primer grey. :lol:

Image

'21 Elantra Limited - 2.0L/IVT
'15 Escape SE - 1.6L EcoBoost (hers)
Image Image
lorne
Posts: 6
Joined: Sat Sep 15, 2007 5:17 am

Re: (ColonelPanic)

Post by lorne »

so is the Pontiac G3
ragingfish
Posts: 11022
Joined: Tue Oct 15, 2002 8:23 am

Post by ragingfish »

On a side note, GM will never sell Pontiac or Saturn, as they are no good to anyone aside from a name and a logo. Because neither brand can be manufactured or engineered as a standalone unit outside GM (unlike HUMMER or SAAB), GM can't give a potential buyer much more than really the name, logo and dealership contracts. And because anyone who bought only a name and logo would have to be a FOOL to think they can build a new car from the ground up and have it at least somewhat represent a pontiac or saturn and manage to satisfy an existing customer base to the point where it becomes profitable, I don't forsee it ever happening. Pontiac can be killed (and sadly, with the idea having been brought up twice already in the last few years, I fear that the death of our beloved brand is inevitable - the only question would be "when"), but not sold.
YES!I still visit GenVibe periodically. I have not forgotten about my "original" family over here!

2009 PONTIAC G8
3.6L V6 (256 HP @ 6300 rpm, 248 ft-lbs. @ 2100 rpm)
vibolista
Posts: 1519
Joined: Fri Jan 11, 2008 6:34 am
Location: "Glacial", Maine!

Re: (ragingfish)

Post by vibolista »

Quote, originally posted by scherry2 »really? wow when we build them they have different formed sheet metal and different interiors. when the 2 are side by side there is quite a difference. and GM is going to have GMC the premium truck and Chevy the every day worker truck. in 2011 they are going to bring out a Hybrid pick-up "not" based on the old version of the Hybrid from 4 years ago. Not to belabor a point here, GM and all the other larger auto makers seem to do a lot of 'badge' engineering. A Chevy truck and a GMC truck are nearly the same, other than some sheet metal stamps and interiors bits. I'm sure that there are other differences go way deep, like maybe softer bushings for the fancy pants GMCs! Might look at it like a Vibe and a Matrix. Same starting point... but a few different wrinkles here and there and you have two 'different' cars. One turns up as a Toyota and one as a Pontiac. Amazing. Hope the new Hybrid system is a good one!
'08 Manual, Sun&Sound, 17" Borbet Type CA wheels, 215/50 Summer Tires... 16" OE steel, 215/55 Snow Tires
file014
Posts: 94
Joined: Sun Jan 11, 2009 11:30 am

Post by file014 »

I wish GM rebadged less GMs and more toyotas. Id love to use my GM rebate on a bigger toyota vehicle (sienna, highlander, Tacoma, etc) or hybrid.
kunkstyle
Posts: 1236
Joined: Tue Sep 11, 2007 12:51 pm

Re: (file014)

Post by kunkstyle »

Hahaha. I'd totally buy a Pontaic Rav4 with my GM points.
Kunkstyle's Garage:2006 AWD Pontiac VibeInfinity/Rockford/Kenwood Audio, CAI, Cupholder LED's, Keyless Entry Mod2000 Porsche 911 C2Kenwood Audio, Ultimate Cupholders, DRL's, 0-60 in 4.9 seconds.
NascarXprt
Posts: 4797
Joined: Fri Nov 12, 2004 12:38 pm
Location: San Antonio, TX

Re: (kunkstyle)

Post by NascarXprt »

well it looks like Pontiac will only be the Vibe, G5, Solstice and coupe, and G8 to make it a niche brand. heres a quote from autoblog:Quote, originally posted by autoblog.com »....only four models: the G8, G5, Vibe and Solstice. Or five models if you count the Solstice coupe separately ....link: http://www.autoblog.com/2009/0...odels/
Image
My '04 Garage - My '06 Garage - My '09 GT Garage
November 2006 MOTM / February 2007 VOTM / April 2010 VOTM / June 2011 VOTM
User avatar
ColonelPanic
Posts: 8419
Joined: Sun Jan 05, 2003 8:48 am
Location: South Central Indiana

Re: (NascarXprt)

Post by ColonelPanic »

Whacking the G6 eh? That sucks. Surprised the G5 is still there, it was a stop-gap measure all along. No more Aveo G3's either I guess? Maybe not much of a loss there. Great news to see the Vibe carries on.I'm confused though, the first part of the article says only Chevrolet/Buick/GMC/Cadillac will survive with no mention of Pontiac. Then in the second part it mentions what Pontiac has. *shrug* Is Pontiac dead or what?Kinda surprised to see Saturn go as GM's invested a lot in getting their lineup to be halfway decent these days. But really, aside from the Astra it's just a few redundant products that can be found in other GM divisions available in the US. I couldn't be happier to see Hummer go, to me they represent all that is wrong and evil. Saab never really seemed to fit in anyway, and I'm sure the Sabbies won't mind. A friend has a 9-3 and complains about it being too much GM and not the real deal.
03 Vibe base. Born 10/14/2002 06:07 AM
Auto, Moon & Tunes, power package. 143k
Neptune/dying clearcoat/primer grey. :lol:

Image

'21 Elantra Limited - 2.0L/IVT
'15 Escape SE - 1.6L EcoBoost (hers)
Image Image
vibolista
Posts: 1519
Joined: Fri Jan 11, 2008 6:34 am
Location: "Glacial", Maine!

Re: (ColonelPanic)

Post by vibolista »

Saab 9-3 = Pontiac G6. Don't know who did the development on that, Saab or GM... maybe both? Neither is a bad car... I've driven both, but that was a while back. Liked the 9-3 much more with the manual and 'light' turbo 4 banger. Reasonable performance and efficiency. The light turbo is not offered here in the States anymore from what I gather. The Saab 9-3 made it to market before the G6 so maybe Saab did the development?
'08 Manual, Sun&Sound, 17" Borbet Type CA wheels, 215/50 Summer Tires... 16" OE steel, 215/55 Snow Tires
ou.grizzly
Posts: 2660
Joined: Sat Mar 01, 2008 5:26 pm

Post by ou.grizzly »

In the back of my mind I thought Saturn was going to be amputated. How many Saturn vehicles are re badged/different skin to be honest?1. Astra - Opel - unique to the NA2. Vue - Opel - unique to the NA3. Outlook - GMC Acadia - Buick Enclave - Chevy Traverse4. Aura - Chevy Malibu5. Sky - Pontiac Solstice
2009 Jet Black 2.4L Auto / Fogs / 17" Alum / Clear Bra / Camry Leather Shift Knob / GT Rear Spoiler
2013 Polished Metallic Honda CR-V EX-L Navi
kunkstyle
Posts: 1236
Joined: Tue Sep 11, 2007 12:51 pm

Re: (ou.grizzly)

Post by kunkstyle »

^^^I'd say only the unique to north america ones count.
Kunkstyle's Garage:2006 AWD Pontiac VibeInfinity/Rockford/Kenwood Audio, CAI, Cupholder LED's, Keyless Entry Mod2000 Porsche 911 C2Kenwood Audio, Ultimate Cupholders, DRL's, 0-60 in 4.9 seconds.
NascarXprt
Posts: 4797
Joined: Fri Nov 12, 2004 12:38 pm
Location: San Antonio, TX

Re: (ou.grizzly)

Post by NascarXprt »

Quote, originally posted by ou.grizzly »In the back of my mind I thought Saturn was going to be amputated. How many Saturn vehicles are re badged/different skin to be honest?1. Astra - Opel - unique to the NA2. Vue - and the 2010 chevy Equinox - Opel - unique to the NA3. Outlook - GMC Acadia - Buick Enclave - Chevy Traverse4. Aura - Chevy Malibu5. Sky - Pontiac Solstice
Image
My '04 Garage - My '06 Garage - My '09 GT Garage
November 2006 MOTM / February 2007 VOTM / April 2010 VOTM / June 2011 VOTM
ou.grizzly
Posts: 2660
Joined: Sat Mar 01, 2008 5:26 pm

Re: (NascarXprt)

Post by ou.grizzly »

Makes sense. Wonder if the Astra will be shifted to a different brand, say Chevy or Pontiac.
2009 Jet Black 2.4L Auto / Fogs / 17" Alum / Clear Bra / Camry Leather Shift Knob / GT Rear Spoiler
2013 Polished Metallic Honda CR-V EX-L Navi
NascarXprt
Posts: 4797
Joined: Fri Nov 12, 2004 12:38 pm
Location: San Antonio, TX

Re: (ou.grizzly)

Post by NascarXprt »

id say chevy, since pontiac has the vibe. and the hhr isnt really in the vibe class i think.
Image
My '04 Garage - My '06 Garage - My '09 GT Garage
November 2006 MOTM / February 2007 VOTM / April 2010 VOTM / June 2011 VOTM
djkeev
Posts: 1357
Joined: Sat Mar 14, 2009 8:51 pm

Post by djkeev »

Hey all, Seems our Pontiacs are on the proverbial chopping block now.http://usnews.rankingsandrevie...rands/I really don't get why Buick is safe?? When I drive around my area of the USA (New Jersey) I stumble over Pontiacs all over the place, Buicks? one or two I see rumbling along. Do other areas have a strong Buick population?Dave
(o ! /o) (o)=I=(o)
18stars
Posts: 103
Joined: Sat Oct 04, 2003 10:23 am

Post by 18stars »

I believe that Buick is the leading GM brand in China...which is a potentially huge market. GM will probably save the Buick nameplate for the sake of its worldwide recognition and sales. I would imagine also that the Buick brand demographics in the USA (i.e. older people) may be looked at as a more stable group of buyers in these times. That said, I'd hate to see Pontiac go.
__________________________________Current Vibe: 2007 Stealth
BlueCrush
Posts: 8272
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 9:47 am
Location: Twin Cities, MN

Re: (18stars)

Post by BlueCrush »

Looks like Monday is D-Day for Pontiac. It's getting the AX!http://money.cnn.com/2009/04/2...42414
My Fleet:
'15 Ford Fusion AWD Titanium 2.0 Tutbo
'14 Lincoln MXZ AWD 2.0 Turbo
'14 Nissan Pathfinder AWD SL
'05 Pontiac Vibe AWD
Kari
Posts: 3259
Joined: Sat Sep 06, 2003 3:01 am

Re: (BlueCrush)

Post by Kari »

This sucks. Plain and simple.Why not cut the completely redundant GMC instead of a brand that actually has some unique products?
GenVibe Global Moderator
User avatar
ColonelPanic
Posts: 8419
Joined: Sun Jan 05, 2003 8:48 am
Location: South Central Indiana

Re: (BlueCrush)

Post by ColonelPanic »

Booooo! Read that earlier. First they take Oldsmobile away from me, now this... suck!In a way, I suppose it wasn't really surprising considering how Pontiac has increasingly been given the shaft while Chevrolet has become GM's can't-do-anything-wrong golden child. It was sorely evident at the NY auto show comparing the large Chevrolet display with the tiny, practically empty Pontiac that had the tumbleweeds rolling around. It was sad, almost like a funeral - I guess in hindsight it was.Pontiac's always going to have a special place in my heart, it's sad to see them go.
03 Vibe base. Born 10/14/2002 06:07 AM
Auto, Moon & Tunes, power package. 143k
Neptune/dying clearcoat/primer grey. :lol:

Image

'21 Elantra Limited - 2.0L/IVT
'15 Escape SE - 1.6L EcoBoost (hers)
Image Image
Ol' Timer
Posts: 112
Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2006 10:17 am

Re: (ColonelPanic)

Post by Ol' Timer »

Quote, originally posted by ColonelPanic » First they take Oldsmobile away from me, now this... suck!In a way, I suppose it wasn't really surprising considering how Pontiac has increasingly been given the shaft while Chevrolet has become GM's can't-do-anything-wrong golden child. It was sorely evident at the NY auto show comparing the large Chevrolet display with the tiny, practically empty Pontiac that had the tumbleweeds rolling around. It was sad, almost like a funeral - I guess in hindsight it was.Pontiac's always going to have a special place in my heart, it's sad to see them go. Yeah, it was a sad sight this year @ the NY Auto Show to see Pontiac share this "alcove" with Hummer and Saab. The writing was literally on the Shows Floor!!!So will any remnants of Pontiac remain after the last vestiges of the Arrow Head are finally sold? Maybe Buick will absorb Vibe??? It's a sad day indeed!
2006 Salsa Vibe - Auto - Side Curtain Air Bags - ABS - Vehicle Stability Control - Tunes No Moon - Monotone - Preferred Package - Slate Cyper Cloth - Steelie Wheels2002 Snap Orange Beetle - Auto - Turbo
User avatar
ZubenElGenubi
Posts: 2197
Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2004 6:22 am

Re: (Ol' Timer)

Post by ZubenElGenubi »

Guess I better hurry up and get that maintenance and warranty work done!Really sad..I've owned my Vibe five years on Sunday (paid off earlier this month). Wouldn't have imagined this.
kostby
Posts: 2422
Joined: Thu Jan 22, 2004 2:52 pm

Post by kostby »

Signs that Pontiac/GM management didn't know what the heck they were doing YEARS ago... Exhibit 1: Badge engineering. Worst Example: the J-body Cadillac Cimarron, a Chevy Cavalier/Pontiac Sunbird dressed in chrome and leather at double the price.Exhibit 1a: GM dealerships fighting other GM brands on price for the (primarily GM employee) customers' business because they all basically the same cars in the same colors and the same options.Exhibit 2: Ending production of high-volume rental fleet cars (6000, Grand Am) because they were low profit margin vehicles. Then customers were forced 'upscale' into much more expensive cars that didn't sell as well (no Pontiac replacement for 6000, G6).In fact, customers went elsewhere and offshore (Toyota, Honda, Mazda, Hyundai, Kia...) to get vehicles in the size and price range they wanted. And they never came back!Besides, all that volume kept thousands of workers employed and helped pay legacy costs for the tens of thousands of retirees. When the volume-sellers were dropped, the legacy-cost-per-car skyrocketed to double or triple what it had been.Exhibit 3: Spending money in the early 2000's to build and advertise 'image' vehicles (Solstice, Holden GTO) that only 5% of buyers would actually ever purchase, taking the focus and advertising dollars away from the 'bread-and-butter' cars that kept Pontiac dealerships in business.Exhibit 4: Building the Vibe, a highly fuel-efficient, highly space-efficient hatchback in a joint-venture with small-car EXPERT Toyota, and then spending virtually ZERO to advertise it when gas hit $2.50, $3, $3.50, and $4. a gallon. (The red-headed-stepchild syndrome?)Exhibit 5: Spending money to re-engineer the Vibe just in time to kill it off. (See also: Chevy Corvair, Pontiac Fiero, Oldsmobile Aurora, et al.) Yeah, you can blame Toyota, too, who put the same 2.4 into the Scion xB and also made it much bigger and heavier.Exhibit 6: Putting an optional 2.4 liter engine in the Vibe and increasing the size and weight of the vehicle, then introducing it just when gas hit $4 a gallon.Exhibit 6a: Making many desirable option packages available ONLY on the 2.4 Vibe.RIP Pontiac.
Image

My 2003 Vibe Base Auto 2-tone Salsa "SalsaWagon" was built in May 2002. I acquired it in Feb 2004/Traded it in on a 2016 Honda HR-V in Feb 2018.
User avatar
ColonelPanic
Posts: 8419
Joined: Sun Jan 05, 2003 8:48 am
Location: South Central Indiana

Re: (kostby)

Post by ColonelPanic »

I bet Pontiac ONLY redesigned the Vibe because they had no choice since Toyota gave the platform a refresh. Otherwise, GM would be content just to keep it the way it was. Kinda like they're doing with the G6, it should have had some sort of refresh by now to remain competitive with the foreign midsizers. Those guys get a facelift every couple of years and a dramatic redo a not long after that.
03 Vibe base. Born 10/14/2002 06:07 AM
Auto, Moon & Tunes, power package. 143k
Neptune/dying clearcoat/primer grey. :lol:

Image

'21 Elantra Limited - 2.0L/IVT
'15 Escape SE - 1.6L EcoBoost (hers)
Image Image
bodhi_tree777
Posts: 1222
Joined: Sun May 11, 2008 2:05 am

Re: (ColonelPanic)

Post by bodhi_tree777 »

Hey, cool, the forum's back Sad news, I guess. I love this car, but I can't say that I love Pontiac. This is my first, bought used from a Toyota dealership. Out of warranty, so my first contact with Pontiac was for recall work. That was okay, but since then they've always been no help in the service or parts department. I always price parts there just for a comparison and man, they are pricey. I once needed to replace my rear wiper blade. Pontiac wouldn't sell me just the blade and insisted on replacing the whole arm to the tune of $30+ for the part. I went down the street and bought the blade from Toyota for $3. Just yesterday I had to do a front brake job (of course, while the site was down, but I did my best to remember the pics in SW's diy). Anyway, had to replace one caliper (seized), brakes and rotors. Local Pontiac dealership wanted close to $200 for a new caliper ("they don't deal with re-built items"), and told me it would take "several days" to get the part anyway, unless I wanted to drive to NY myself to pick it up from another dealership. I drove down the street and found a re-build at Advanced Auto for $79. I will never understand their (or any dealer's) massive mark-ups. In this day and age, of the internet and aftermarket parts all over the place, why would they not attempt to be a little bit more competitive. Instead, dealerships are content to have this stigma attatched to them where the mantra of "don't go to the dealer, they'll rip you off" is so common.. Ahwell, I still love my car, and I'll drive it until the wheels fall off, but I guess I'll never buy another Pontiac unless I find another low-mileage Vibe down the line.
james / bodhi tree studio / tattoos & illustration / http://www.bodhitreestudio.comebay store : vintage clothing & toys---03 Satellite Vibe GT // 04 Neptune base // 1986 VW Golf // 1990 VW Golf GL---
BlueCrush
Posts: 8272
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 9:47 am
Location: Twin Cities, MN

Re: (bodhi_tree777)

Post by BlueCrush »

21,000 jobs and Pontiac are history!
My Fleet:
'15 Ford Fusion AWD Titanium 2.0 Tutbo
'14 Lincoln MXZ AWD 2.0 Turbo
'14 Nissan Pathfinder AWD SL
'05 Pontiac Vibe AWD
kostby
Posts: 2422
Joined: Thu Jan 22, 2004 2:52 pm

Re: (bodhi_tree777)

Post by kostby »

re: Massive markups on Vibe parts...The problem is that Toyota is apparently selling GM the Toyota-common parts at Toyota list prices. Then GM adds another 40% markup on top of that. For many dealers, Vibe parts are such a small portion of their sales, that they didn't inventory anything. Thus, Vibe parts also became 'special order', meaning that most dealers would not discount them, and wanted a deposit (or full payment up front) before ordering items.
Image

My 2003 Vibe Base Auto 2-tone Salsa "SalsaWagon" was built in May 2002. I acquired it in Feb 2004/Traded it in on a 2016 Honda HR-V in Feb 2018.
Post Reply