Is synthetic worth it?

[09vGT]

I've been having, I'm guessing, Mobile 1 Synthetic oil in my car for the past year maybe longer. The dealer is recommending changing it every 5000 miles, normally I push it to 6000. And the book calls to change the REGULAR oil every 5000. My cars has a little over 70,000 miles on it now, but will the synthetic really be better for my car, or am I just wasting money?

[silverbullet]

i THINK its worth it, my opinion tho. i give my car the best i can. i am still on my first oil change, and i am just over three thousand miles and i am waiting to hit six or seven and ill do a change and have the old stuff analyzed and find out when i should REALLY be changing it

[djkeev]

What a great question to mine opinions!!You might just as well asked which baseball team is the best!! It IS of course the Yankees, we all know that to be true.I'll state my opinion. For my Vibe, I've put in synthetic since the 2nd oil change. I run an average of 7000 in between but it's gone to 10,000 a time or two. I'm turning 90,000 on my 07 and I'm happy with my engine. I plan on keeping it for years to come.Why did I choose to run synthetic? Not because of "extended" oil change intervals but mainly for the cold start protection synthetic gives to your engine. It is a fact that a large portion of engine wear happens when you turn the key and engage the starter. Those initial revolutions in cold oil, thick, viscous, slow to flow "natural" oils that fail to lubricate well in frigid temperatures does an immense amount of damage over time. Synthetic does not thicken like the non synthetics do and hence flow much much better in cold weather and are able to maintain the film of protection on vital wear surfaces.Anyway, that's what I believe. In my older cars and trucks, I run "dino" oil without a 2nd thought. In my new stuff, I spring for the big $$ oil.Keep in mind that all oil is Dino oil, Synthetics are just more highly engineered. Dino is term of "endearment" for the non synthetic oils.Dave

[Salsa Guy]

They say you can run 15K miles on Syn? Here's how I do it, at 5K miles change filter add a bit of oil. Then at 10K miles change oil and filter. Running Mobil 1. Simple to keep track of! The last car I did this 2 was an mid 70's Olds Cutlass with a 262 V8 and it last well over 200K miles

[silverbullet]

There are filters that are meant to work with synthetics and last up to 15000 miles. No need to replace extra filtersEdit. Can't believe no one stopped me from saying this, not sure what I was thinking 15000. No way that's right, I think 7000 is more like it.

[jake75]

Yes - asking that question is like politics and religion. I only put about 6,000 miles a year on my Vibe - usually change every 6 months and use dino. If I drove 40,000 miles a year I might change every 3 months / 10,000 miles with synthetic. I am a bit more particular about gasoline. I drank the Kool-Aid and believe that top tier gas is worth paying a little more for and going out of my way to get. There is a website that explains top tier gasoline and lists the brands. BP is NOT one of them. I just looked at the list and it seem there are a lot more brands listed than a year or so ago.

[star_deceiver]

IMO yes! I use PP or M1... whatever happens to be on sale at the time. Change it out every 8000kms or so. Takes about half an hour from start to finish.

[Zimm]

for me, the switch to synthetic has been worth it. i'm not comfortable taking dino juice past 5,000mi per change because i do a lot of urban freeway driving and some stop and go local stuff as well. switching to synthetic (valvoline synpower so far) has allowed me to feel comfortable going as high as 7,500 mi between changes. since i put about 13,000 mi per year on my car, that works out to 2 changes at about 6,500 mi-one in the fall when the ground is still warm enough for me to want to get down under my car(end of October-ish). and then once in the spring when the ground has warmed up enough that i won't mind (end of April-ish).i have enough going on in my life and my most limited resources are time and $$. 2 changes worth of oil/filter costs me about $55 to DIY, plus about an hour each time.

[beemerphile1]

Synthetic is a waste of money in my opinion. Put the correctly rated viscosity oil in your engine and change at 5,000 miles. That is all that is needed.Regarding longer change intervals; The primary reason for changing the oil is to clear out the acids, condensation, and dirt that is suspended in the oil. It doesn't matter what oil you use it will still accumulate the same contaminates. Do you really want all that stuff circulating through the engine?Keep in mind also that oil filters are a compromise. The manufacturers balance cost, filtration ability, and life span. The better they filter the shorter the life span. Filters can be made to remove virtually all contaminates but they will plug up in a short time. Once a filter removes enough dirt to be restricted a bypass valve will open allowing the oil to bypass the filter. Here is my train of thought;1. If you are going to stretch the oil change interval you at least need to change the filter. 2. If you are going to change the filter you may as well change the oil also.3. If you change the oil at recommended intervals plain old dino is just fine.

[Salsa Guy]

X2 on what you said up to a waste of money. Synthetics are better. They don't break down as easy under, heat and stress, and lube better. Which is what I need with a boosted engine and extreme weather in this area. Also I stated that the filter gets changed at 5K miles and oil and filter at 10K with the Syn. A Dino oil is fine and as long as you change it on a regular basis (3K-5K miles) your engine should have a long life.

[djkeev]

Quote, originally posted by rmckinjr ».......... A Dino oil is fine and as long as you change it on a regular basis (3K-5K miles) your engine should have a long life.Until you factor in start up wear in cold climates then Dino oil falls flat on it's face.Dave

[jake75]

Even if the Dino is 0w-20? Also - how cold is "cold"? I would think that if you live where is rarely gets into single digits F you ought to be o.k. from that standpoint. My dealer adds something called "Krex" - I think it is micro-particles of graphite that is supposed to enhance lubrication. Not counting on the warranty - just reporting what is going on."Krex, Inc. may guarantee the lubricated parts of the vehicle’s engine for up to 10 years or 200,000 miles, whichever occurs first. To maintain this warranty, simply return to the servicing dealer for recommended Krex maintenance services at least every 6 months or 5,000 miles, whichever occurs first."

[Cougar Vibe]

If you're a smart shopper and watch the ads for all of the chain automotive stores, you can probably score synthetic for the price of dino. As a former BITOG "oil hoarder," I can attest to how rebates & sales can make the decision easy for you.That said, there are a lot of examples on BITOG and in various Toyo/Corolla forums which demonstrate that a regular, steady diet of name-brand dino will suit your engine well. I've run M1, PP and various other synthetics since new; however, once my stash empties, I'm going to move on to Chevron SN 5w20 (which is $1.79/qt around here). Having seen many dino UOA's of 1ZZFE engines with far higher mileage than mine, it's becoming less reasonable to shell out for the synthetic premium. BTW: Start up wear isn't a problem w/these engines; other parts of your car are going to fail far before the engine. If one is really concerned about cold climate oil starvation, it would be wiser to invest in a pan heater ($50-100) and 5w20 oil versus shelling out for synthetics. Ask a Canadian...Cougar Vibe

[Cougar Vibe]

Oh, one other thing: I've never read an example here of someone suffering from an oil-related engine failure in their Vibe where they used dino (with regular oil changes). If you factor in the Corolla...which is a good benchmark for 1ZZFE engine reliability...it's evident that it's a pretty rare occurrence.Honestly, you might be smarter to save the money you'd put into synthetics and instead invest it in oil company stocks. Let synthetic marketing make money for you...

[Water boy]

Yep, the great debate continues. Kinda like opinions about socks and underwear and toothpaste ... no rights or wrongs just person preference.Got 70K on the '08. Using Walmart full synthetic since the first oil change along with their filter. Run about 5K intervals.As eluded to, you must visit Bob Is The Oil Guy if you want to get more detailed opinions. Oil analysis is the holy grail to oil-vs-interval-vs-engine that you can trust.My 5 cents worth.

[Salsa Guy]

X2. Whatever floats your boat! Just that you change it at regular intervals.

[DressedInBlack]

i use soul glo but that is because i live in the ghett-ro.i just started using synthetic and like it so far. it makes me feel good and im sure it isnt hurting the car at all. personal preference it seems.

[lovemyraffe]

I don't want to get too deep in the debate, so here is my opinion and I'm not checking this tread again.Yes, synthetic is worth it for my car. I don't think that synthetic is appropriate for all vehicles.

[star_deceiver]

Quote, originally posted by lovemyraffe »Yes, synthetic is worth it for my car. I don't think that synthetic is appropriate for all vehicles.I couldn't agree more! While the car get's synth, the bike gets good ol' dino castrol 10w40 motorcycle oil and an oil change every 1200kms or so.

[10vibe]

Jake,Interesting article on engine additives:http://www.ford-trucks.com/art....htmlI remember reading somewhere that while showing an initial decrease in wear, graphite would cause an increase in wear with more scoring in parts. I will have to look for that. There might of been an increase of clogging of passages and oil filters too.There are few cleaners or additives that I trust. Chevron Techron, Seafoam, and Stabil being the only few for mostly fuel systems and maybe for cleaning pvc systems and vacuum lines. Protective additives, not so much, being snake oil compared to a well engineered oil. With an older unknown engine with a previous owner, marvel mystery oil or some other solvent/kerosene might be good for a very short run before a drain and fill of fresh oil for a couple short intervals. This would be primarily done to unstick lifters, rings, etc. and hopefully get rid of some sludge from the additives and long oil change intervals of the previous owner. I shutter even using those as I see increased blue smoke, oil usage, leaking gaskets, and lower compression do to increased wear in the future of an engine that has been "treated" a lot with these things. In other words, the things you are trying to cure, might just get worse. None of it is good for the health of catalytic converters and oxygen sensors.Just my 2 cents, and adjusted for inflation, take it for what it is worth, cause I'm not a bright man. At least that is what mamma always told me. She never did get over me eating her box of chocolates.

[Vibe_dude]

2 words......."hell yes".

[10vibe]

Quote, originally posted by star_deceiver »I couldn't agree more! While the car get's synth, the bike gets good ol' dino castrol 10w40 motorcycle oil and an oil change every 1200kms or so. I have been using Rotella 5w-40 T6 synthetic in my bike the last few years. The only thing I worry about is possibly not enough anti-foaming additive package since it is a diesel engine motor oil and possibly designed for less rpm's than my bike will do. The older version worried me a little by having a little more ash content than the Japanese JASO MA standard required, but the latest version is fine and meets Jaso MA specs. Besides with all the detergents in it, there would not be a problem anyway. The price advantage of using it is not as good as in the past though. Especially considering that the jug is a gallon, 3.78l (4 QT.), versus Mobil 1 and other oil jugs that are 5 QT.'s. But then again, my bike only takes 3.78L completely bone dry. http://www.calsci.com/motorcycleinfo/Oi ... rXRef.html

[jake75]

Quote, originally posted by 10vibe1.8auto »Jake,Interesting article on engine additives:http://www.ford-trucks.com/art....htmlI remember reading somewhere that while showing an initial decrease in wear, graphite would cause an increase in wear with more scoring in parts. I will have to look for that. There might of been an increase of clogging of passages and oil filters too.Just my 2 cents, and adjusted for inflation, take it for what it is worth, cause I'm not a bright man. At least that is what mamma always told me. She never did get over me eating her box of chocolates.I checked out "Krex Complaints" and the only bad news was that some dealers was charging $5 for it. This on anther forum - "Krex Graphite is a non chemical lubricant used exclusively by new cardealers. The graphite is less than 1 micron in size and only 6 oz areadded to your oil change. The dealer adds this to your oil change to give you Roadside Assistance and Road Hazard Tire Protection for 120 days from the date of the oil change. The product is nothing more than 10 weight oil with a little bit of graphite added. It was developed at Packard Motor Car back in the 40's."Had my Chrysler dealer been using that I would have had a tire paid for.

[djkeev]

Too funny this Krex stuff! Here we are all knocking it down, this guy who runs this company is a genius!!Not only is he selling it by the casefull he has somehow convinced dealers to keep buying it for 200,000 mile of service! On the average car driven what 16,000 a year that's over twelve years of sales!!! Ok, they'll fix your flat, hmmmm... I've been driving for over 40 years and I FAR exceed 16,000 miles a year and I've had TWO, count them... TWO flat tires! My 07 Vibe has almost 90,000 on it and it is but one of two cars, just to show how far I travel and I live next door to work!Pure and simple, it's snake oil. Smart snake oil though! Designed in the 40's huh? My antique VW's were designed in the 40's my Mr Porsche. There is little technology on these cars that I'd want on a new car! Oil is so much better today than it was in 1940, so much so that you can barely comprehend how different it is if you weren't alive back then!Today's oils need no additives, none, zero zip, nada. Don't waste you money. Purchase some quality synthetic oil instead that really does protect your engine better.Dave

[vibenvy]

I've said it in other threads on oil and I'll say it again here...For as long as I can remember my dad has used nothing but plain old regular Penzoil in all our vehicles. We had an '89 Pontiac Sunbird LE Sedan that was bought brand new by my parents in 1988. My dad was in an accident in 1997 and it was totaled. It had approximately 315,000 miles on it at the time of the accident. The guy at the body shop it was towed to couldn't believe how it started right up and ran so well for the mileage it had.We have a '94 Pontiac Sunbird LE Sedan that my parents bought brand new in 1994. It currently has 257,xxx miles on it and still runs great. It had to have the head gasket replaced around 2xx,xxx miles. Our mechanic always gave my dad a hard time about using Penzoil until he got the engine opened up and saw how clean it was. Needless to say he never said anything bad about us using Penzoil again .My mom had a '98 Pontiac Sunfire SE Sedan she bought brand new in 1998. When she traded it in on her Vibe in 2009, it had approximately 200,000 miles on it and still ran great. It too had had no major engine problems.My dad bought a brand new 2001 S10 in 2000. It currently has approximately 253,000 miles on it. Again, no major engine problems.Both Vibes get plain old Penzoil 5W-20 and a new Toyota oil filter every 2500 miles. I don't feel comfortable going the full 5000 miles since I do it myself and it's so cheap and easy, so I change it every 2500. I figure that way I am still adhering to the 5000 mile rule listed in the owner's manual for warranty purposes.In short... it is my opinion, and experience, that regular oil is just fine .

[frankiemenz]

Synthetic is better, use what you want as long as you maintain your vehicle. No Kool-Aid here, it really is better oil in the long run, you can run it longer intervals and have better protection, period.-----Frank

[vibolista]

Mob1 is great oil. I've used it for quite some time. Right now I don't have any super high mileage vehicles, but one thing I did notice when the Vibe had been running Mob1 after break in period. Late last Spring my favorite discount store didn't have Mob1, so I got a box of Shell synthetic instead. Synthetic oil is synthetic oil, right? MPGs went down from 38 and 40 to 35-36. I checked my tire pressure, air filter, plugs, even turned off A/C when I could and really took it easy. 35-36 was it. I went back to Mob1 next oil change, and like magic, MPG went up to 37-39 (it was getting colder in the Fall). If you live in the cold north country, Synthetic will coat the metal and keep wear down at start up in Winter, especially when temperatures head down below zero. It also doesn't thicken up at those sub-zero temperatures, so the starter and battery don't have to work as hard. MPG is better too. I don't use anything else. Change the oil yourself and the extra cost of synthetic goes down a bit. And it saves gas. So the cost of that Mob1 goes down again. Other oils, Dino, blends and full sythetic, any brand, will do just fine. If you change your oil at reasonable intervals, your engine will run perfectly for a long time.