The "rightway" to Turbocharge the 2zz engine

andrewmva · Post by **andrewmva** » Sat Nov 16, 2002 3:10 am

I will start this off by saying that it is not an easy task.The major problems are the factory fuel system, and the sky high compression.To turbocharge this engine with stock internals is going to be suicide, you will be able to run very low boost, but will have the constant threat of detonation. The factory compression is 11.5:1 way too high for FI , most cars that run FI have a compression level of about 8.5:1. If you are not looking to do internals on the engine I would suggest going with a SC. You will be able to bolt it on and have trouble free motoring without as much threat of detonation. So step 1 for the 2zz is going to be to get yourself a nice set of low compression forged pistons and a nice set of rods. At this point you need to decide how far you are going to go. If you are looking for CRAZY numbers you will want to look into having the block sleeved or possibly Cryo treated. The entire factory fuel system will need to be replaced. Pump, regulator, all lines, filter, injectors, fuel rail, when I say everything I mean everything. Engine management is a must as well, I'm referring to a standalone unit, something that will control all fuel and timing events as well as monitor engine temps and pressures. I use a system called the Microtech MTX-8 it is new in the US and not many people have heard of it. I swear by it. As far as the main components go that will also depend on how far you want to go. The most important thing about a turbo system is that it runs efficently, that everything is sized to work together. Bigger does not always mean better. What makes big power is the ability to burn MORE fuel, and to burn the fuel you need Oxygen. The turbo supplies the Ox while your injectors and computer system will be responsible for the fuel. I could go on and on about this topic, my main point of this thread is to help people understand that turbocharging this engine is complicated, and will not be a easy or inexpensive task. I also want this to help people make better buying decisions, and to know what to look for in a "Turbo kit". If you are considering turbocharging your car ask the company 1000 questions, if they do not produce clear answers or do not great your intrest with enthusiasum then do not buy thier product. I have yet to see a "Turbo kit" that I would recommend, but I know some companies are developing them. IMHO turbcharging this engine is too complicated to sell a inexpenive "kit" so be smart before you go spend a few thousand $$$ know what you are getting yourself into. I hope people find this post useful --- I have already done the 1zz engine, I post the information here from hands on experience.

d_m_kolb · Post by **d_m_kolb** » Sat Nov 16, 2002 6:25 am

I have all ways wanted to know what the stock toyota tranys can handle.auto A343F 5 speed C596 speed C60What is each tranys max torque handling capability. Running force induction on either of these 2 engines will probably require some transmission mods. I planned on running a turbo on the 1ZZ. I was going to run a trany cooler with it's own fan and do a complete trany fluid change to synthetic. So the question is how much is to much before the trany will let go?Back to the 2ZZ will a stand alone ECM be able to make the lift still engage at 6,000 RPM. Can this RPM range be lower to say 5,000 RPM?If the Vibe and Matrix use a open diff. your only going to have one wheel spinning. Traction is going to also be a problem so a limited slip or posie diff is going to be needed. I think WCT carries one of these.You should post info on a crazy HP 2ZZ and 1ZZ and what would need to be done and then also post info on what would need to be done for someone not wanting to get into internal engine mods.Oh great info so far man!!!

andrewmva · Post by **andrewmva** » Sat Nov 16, 2002 7:11 am

we made over 300hp to the wheels on a stock 5sp tranny with the mr2, the tranny never broke, we did do a flywheel and clutch combo which is availible for our cars, both 5sp and 6sp. The LSD is availible as well. if you want to launch with the diff locked try backing the car up really slow in R then put it into 1st and stop the car, should launch with both tires then. As for making really SICK power.... I have to keep some things a secrect I posted the basics, a good platform for everyone to understand what has to go into a project like this. The key to making the big numbers is tuning.... As for the 1zz you canexpect to do the same list of mods that I posted above, the 1zz is actually a better base for FI because the compresesion is lower from the factory, going FI on stock internals will be OK as long as you run moderate boost about 7-10lbs on pump gas. When I say 7-10 lbs is ok that is with doing EVERYTHING that I listed about except internals. As for the lift control, I have not played around with that yet... I let the factory ECU control lift. When I get the time and energy I will be building a VVTI controller that will allow you to adjust your VVTI where ever you want it to engage, but that will be much later down the road. hope this provides some answers.

d_m_kolb · Post by **d_m_kolb** » Sat Nov 16, 2002 9:31 am

I could be wrong but I don't think the MR2 uses the same 5 speed trany the Vibe does. If they do then I'd say everyone will be more than ok with the stock manual trany.The trick to make both wheels lock on launch is great. Every manual owner that races should look at this post. It's a must for a great launch and low numbers. I'm curious about how the auto trany will handle 7 to 10 PSI. Your slowly starting to change my mind on what turbo kit I want to use. The West Covina system looks great but they will be only going with 6 to 6 1/2 psi on the 1ZZ-FE. If you can prove a stock 1ZZ can handle 10 PSI on a daily basis I'll probably end up going with your kit. At some point I'm gonna want scary high HP but that's in the future. At least we all know who to cantact when that time comes.

Sub-Zero · Post by **Sub-Zero** » Sun Nov 17, 2002 1:49 am

i dunno for sure about the auto in the 1ZZ model, but the U240E in the 2ZZ models can take about 260hp at the crank and that's pushing it for reliability if you have an ATF cooler. i've seen it take more, but the guy's car started to run like crap so he sold it before he figured out if it was something with the fuel system or the transmission the auto 1ZZ would most likely not handle as much. but you could disconnect the SLT solenoid in the transmission and get an ATF cooler and reduce the wear during the shifts which is the biggest issue.TRD had a specual ECU to cut boost to the engine when it shifted for the automatic camry and i think the trucks too, it might have that for the official S/C, and GM would probably include it in the kit for the auto base model.andrew: when you do that VVTL-i controller, you'd probably have to change all the other timing maps and VVT-i stuff as well....just changing the lift engagement point apparently doesn't do anything except the car bogs when it hits the big cam

Flip-Side · Post by **Flip-Side** » Sun Nov 17, 2002 2:01 pm

All this is kinda scaring me about wanting the SC. With a new intake, all new exhaust, and SC we will be looking at close to 200hp. I have a Base with automatic that I wish to run a long time, so what else should I be looking at to keep the tranny safe? Some say a new torque converter, but my knowledge of trannys is limited.

d_m_kolb · Post by **d_m_kolb** » Sun Nov 17, 2002 10:05 pm

Total fluid change to synthetic trany fluid. I'd personally only use Amsoil. A good trany cooler with it's own fan. You should be fine with 200WHP then. A torque converter will help to lower your 1/4 mile times but wont help save your trany from stress.

NovaResource · Post by **NovaResource** » Mon Nov 18, 2002 2:48 am

The 4-speed auto in the supercharged Pontiac Grand Prix GTP can handle the 240-hp and 280-tq without an external trans cooler. I'm sure the Toyota trans can handle 200-hp and 180-tq of a 1ZZ with a supercharger and a free flowing exhaust. Regular trans service with fluid changes is more than enough. You'll only need an external trans cooler if you get a higher stall torque converter. Higher stall means more slippage in the converter. More slippage means more heat. The factory lock-up converter will keep the heat down.

Sub-Zero · Post by **Sub-Zero** » Mon Nov 18, 2002 5:00 am

completely different car and transmission though. and that comes supercharged, doesn't it? the auto wasn't developed with power in mind...

NovaResource · Post by **NovaResource** » Mon Nov 18, 2002 5:12 am

First of all, the trans in the supercharged GTP is the same as the one in the base model.Second, my whole point is: don't you think the Toyota trans is more reliable than the GM trans?

andrewmva · Post by **andrewmva** » Mon Nov 18, 2002 5:27 am

The 6sp Trannys are know to break.... I know I'm going to break mine a few times -BUT I'm lucky enough to have our shop NEXT DOOR to the dealer that I bought the car from.... I know all the Techs, so warrenty should not be an issue.

Stang2Vibe · Post by **Stang2Vibe** » Mon Nov 18, 2002 9:34 am

What problems are known with the 6-speed, specifically? Being the owner of one, I am very curious about this. Also, I've now been sufficiently scared away from a turbocharger and leaning toward the factory supercharger kit.

andrewmva · Post by **andrewmva** » Tue Nov 19, 2002 12:00 am

the exact problems I do not know, I usually don't mess with the tranny, I'll just get a new one or warrenty it. I'll try to find out what the deal is though..

MYKIDSGT · Post by **MYKIDSGT** » Tue Nov 19, 2002 5:01 am

{The factory compression is 11.5:1 way too high for FI , most cars that run FI have a compression level of about 8.5:1. }Hello Andrew,Please help me with my curiosity ; why would the mfg. buid the motor this way if it was dangerous? I suppose they engineered it to work well and or efficient just the way it is......right??Thanks-Marcos-

NovaResource · Post by **NovaResource** » Tue Nov 19, 2002 5:14 am

11.5:1 isn't dangerous in factory, non-turbo or supercharger trim.Adding an aftermarket turbo or supercharger to an engine with 11.5:1 is dangerous.

MYKIDSGT · Post by **MYKIDSGT** » Tue Nov 19, 2002 5:24 am

O.K.......duhh Thanks Scott, I got the FI, forced induction confused with the FI, fuel injection................oh boy, where are my glasses?Hey thats right, they broke this morning Actually, I read that part completly friggin wrong.Muchos Gracias a todos.-Marcos-

NovaResource · Post by **NovaResource** » Tue Nov 19, 2002 9:33 am

Oh, you thought it was fuel injection. Yeah, reading it that way does make it confusing.

korax123 · Post by **korax123** » Sat Nov 23, 2002 8:23 am

Um, u actually can run FI easily on a 11.5:1 compression u just need a stand alone fuel management system to tune the engine so it doesn't detonate...yea it is more dangerous to run high compression with FI but it is actually better..with low compression u just don't got to tune the engine to a T to make it not detonate.

andrewmva · Post by **andrewmva** » Sat Nov 23, 2002 8:41 am

ask any racer that runs fast if they run high compression with a turbo... boost raises your static compression... that is why you make more power... go ahead though... build your 11.5:1 compression engine.. I will run low compression....we will see who goes 10's 1st... ask JE for turbo pistons and see what compression ratio they give you -can you do it??? yes... will you make good power??? NO

QUIKAG · Post by **QUIKAG** » Fri Jan 10, 2003 7:33 am

With high compression and forced induction, it's only a matter of time before your motor goes BOOM!!

DABEAR95 · Post by **DABEAR95** » Thu Jan 23, 2003 10:24 pm

Also consider static compression and dynamic compression. With a big enough cam, alot of that compression will be "bled" off. Although so would the boost so I don't know what my point is .Jason

r1ceburner · Post by **r1ceburner** » Sat Jun 21, 2003 5:09 am

So is anyone actually building a Supercharger for the 2zz engnie? I know that I could by the base Vibe and have a much better turbo platorm, but dammit, I just like the GT better. How do I go about supercharging it?

ragingfish · Post by **ragingfish** » Sat Jun 21, 2003 6:45 am

quote:So is anyone actually building a Supercharger for the 2zz engnie? I know that I could by the base Vibe and have a much better turbo platorm, but dammit, I just like the GT better. How do I go about supercharging it?My understanding is that because of the high compression of the 2ZZ, it CANNOT be supercharge.

millster · Post by **millster** » Sat Jun 21, 2003 7:44 am

quote:S...but dammit, I just like the GT better. How do I go about supercharging it?Very carefully! Ragingfish is basically right. The 2ZZ cannot be easily blown. The compression is too high to run any reasonable amount of boost on the stock internals. Given the cost of a supercharger or turbo kit, <5 PSI of boost is kind of a waste. The horsepower gain per dollar spent just doesn't make sense. If you wanted to lower the compression of the engine, you could, but by the time you spent the money and with the horsepower you'd gain why not just start with the 1ZZ.

r1ceburner · Post by **r1ceburner** » Sat Jun 21, 2003 7:45 am

If that's the case, then why are the guys in England selling supercharger kits for the UK version of the celica GTS (or they call it the Celica 190). It uses the same 2zz engine that we have with 11.5:1 compression ratio. The high compression ratio doesn't make it a good candidate for forced induction, but it doesn't make it impossible. Several guys on this forum are already turboing their 2zz's. If you can turbo an engine, you can certainly supercharge it.We just need somebody to make a manifold that will adapt an Eaton M45 (or similar) the intake on our 2zz's and we're in business.

ragingfish · Post by **ragingfish** » Sat Jun 21, 2003 8:49 am

So, the majority agrees that it's not likely (but not impossible apparantly) to supercharge the 2ZZ. But, can you still, say, give it a NOS boost, or is it still too high a compression ratio for even that?Just curious...

Faultline · Post by **Faultline** » Sat Jun 21, 2003 2:00 pm

I know that xs engineering has one for the celica, but it costs around 5k...ouch...I think it is well tuned and runs around 7psi... but turbo performance has a kit to run 5 psi on the celica, and runs 3500.00....5psi on a high compresion motor , I believe does pretty well!

dmitri · Post by **dmitri** » Sun Jun 22, 2003 8:59 am

yea, those kits for the celica gts come with new pistons etc that lower compression so it can handle the boost.

Herb · Post by **Herb** » Sun Jun 22, 2003 11:05 am

quote:And those new pistons are forged I bet. Most likely. Probably forged rods as well. I wonder if there's a forged crank available too? $_$

Herb · Post by **Herb** » Sun Jun 22, 2003 11:51 am

quote:Big money.....Ofcourse, time will tell. To be sure. Of course those types of mods probably would be idea for a good turbo. However it's not something I want to do to a new engine. Perhaps years down the line when I decide to have the engine rebuilt I might consider these type of mods.The only problem I could potentially see is the MMC liner. If the cylinder walls have to be bored, it would likely cut into the liner.I'm using synthetic oil now in my engine and plan on for the rest of it's operating life. So I'm hoping that there won't be much wear on the cylinder walls.

r1ceburner · Post by **r1ceburner** » Sun Jun 22, 2003 3:54 pm

If I remember correctly, the turbo kit @ 5psi was putting down nearly 260hp at the wheels. I think that torque was in the 230 ft/lbs. area. I'll dig the website up and post it as proof. 70 horsepower for $3500 isn't really that bad of a price. Considering that it would cost over $6,000 plus a compelte engine rebuild for my past car (1998 Pontiac Sunfire, 2.2L I4), $3500 for 70 hp doesn't sound bad at all.Now the question is: Will the stock internals take the extra 70 hp? I dunno. I do think that it would be possible to build a turbo setup with highly granular tuning capability (by using external waste gates). Then you could dial-up the boost a pound at a time until we know what the true potential of the 2zz is. Maybe we should all pitch in $25 bucks and have the community buy a 2zz engine to beat on. Set it up in a test lab, hire a tuner that knows what he/she are doing and let them do the experimentation for us!

satur9 · Post by **satur9** » Mon Jun 23, 2003 5:58 am

actually nitrous like high compression but that doesnt mean you can run more on a 2zz.usually as long as you have enough fuel, you'll break something from the torque it produces(rods,trannies,axles)than something actually burning or blowing up. that being said its plenty of people on new celica running nitrous most 50 shot some 75 on stock internals on 2zz's with i/h/e thats close to 250 whp.

dmitri · Post by **dmitri** » Mon Jun 23, 2003 9:50 am

lol for the prices of the turbos why not go get a beater with a v-8 race built engine?I bought my malibu for 4500, and its got a 327 pushing 460 hp. Of coarse i had to do alot of work to fix it up, but it was mostly just adjusting etc, not replacing.

r1ceburner · Post by **r1ceburner** » Mon Jun 23, 2003 4:52 pm

While I admit that pumping a ton of power out of a V-8 is alot cheaper than turboing a 1.8L 4-banger, that isn't the point, now is it?Are you going to squeeze a 327 V-8 into a Vibe? If so, I'll be the first to sign up for that kit. If someone could figure out a way to squeeze the 3.0L V-6 from the Toyota Carolla, I'd sign up for that, too. Both are going to be a helluva lot of work, but you would wind up with about the same amount of power as if you force fed the 2zz.On second thought, maybe putting a bigger engine in the vibe isn't such a good idea after all. Think of how that extra weight in the front would affect the Vibe somewhat neutral handling.... Once you've altered the front-to-back weight ratio, you've opened up a whole new can of worms.Back to topic: How can we squeeze more power out of the 2zz?(These were copied from a post on Newcelica.org)Manufacturer XS EngineeringEngine 2zzwhp 256boost 7 psiTurbo IHI BB AX-1price US-$ 4,995 (6,000 installed)release date 03/03last update 03/01/03Parts List:Walbro Fuel Pump, forced induction 255lr/hrDenso 525 CC InjectorsK/N FilterTitanium Color Turbo & Intercooler PipingTubular exhaust manifold with High-temp ceramic coatingXS Power IC Skyline GT-R intercooler coreIHI Ball Bearing turbochargerApexi Twin chamber BOVApexi Power FC (commander is optional)Earl's turbocharger plumbingAll silicone hoses, transistions, and couplingsKit Name EIP TurboManufacturer EIP TuningEngine 2zzwhp 255 boost ?Turboprice US-$ 6/8/12,000.00 (Stage I/II/III)release date Jan '03last update 10/29/02Kit Name WCT 1zz Kit TurboManufacturer West Covina ToyotaEngine 1zzwhp ?boost 6 psiTurbo BorgWarner KKK K04 Turbo @ 1,500-2,000 rpmprice US-$ 3,500release date 05/01/03last update 03/03/03Kit Name Blitz SuperchargerManufacturer BlitzEngine 2zzwhp 193boost 4-7 psiTurbo SC with variable magnetic clutchprice US-$ 5,000release date ?last update 10/15/02Kit Name Aqua-cooled Turbo (CARB approved)Manufacturer Alpine Developments Engine 1-zz whp +70boost 11 psiTurbo aqua-cooled turboprice US-$ 3,100release date May '03last update 03/03/03Kit Name Aqua-cooled Supercharger (CARB approved)Manufacturer Alpine Developments Engine 2-zz whp +50boost 5 psiTurbo aqua-cooled super chargerprice US-$ 3,100release date June '03last update 03/03/03Kit Name TurboManufacturer Turbo Performance Engine 1zz / 2zzwhp ?boost 5 psiTurbo T3price US-$ 3,400release date available nowlast update 10/11/02Kit Name Japspeed SCManufacturer Japspeed-RacingEngine 1zzwhp ?boost ?Turbo ?price ?release date ?last update 10/21/02Kit Name Stafford Fabrication Turbo KitManufacturer Stafford FabricationEngine 1zzwhp ? will be dynoed on 5/5boost currently limited to 7-10 psi (easily adjustable)Turbo T3 hybrid AR 60price US-$ 3,200release date ?last update 04/30/03

r1ceburner · Post by **r1ceburner** » Mon Jun 23, 2003 4:55 pm

CORRECTION: The Biltz supercharger listed is actually the one for the 1zz engine. A 13HP increase for $5K is hardly worth the effort, is it?

r1ceburner · Post by **r1ceburner** » Mon Jun 23, 2003 6:57 pm

Just FYI... After some more digging on Newcelica.org, another person posted that the actually HP number for the blitz kit on a 2zz was 250 whp.

satur9 · Post by **satur9** » Tue Jun 24, 2003 5:34 am

i posted info direct from the dyno sheet of import tuner there, its 196 to the wheels which is about a 30 hp increase. gotta look a the big picture sure its expensive but what else is gonnna give a 2zz 30hp plus 30 ftlb torque as simply and as reliably as a supercharger.

satur9 · Post by **satur9** » Tue Jun 24, 2003 6:00 am

also superstreet put a camry (i believe)v-6 into a mr2 then slapped trd supercharger on top of that.so i dont think that engine swap would be to far fetched.we have plenty of room in our engine bay.

r1ceburner · Post by **r1ceburner** » Tue Jun 24, 2003 3:27 pm

Isn't the HP increase more than 30HP? I mean the stock Vibe GT is only putting down about 156 hp to the wheels, so 196 would be an improvement of 40hp, right?

satur9 · Post by **satur9** » Wed Jun 25, 2003 5:31 am

the celica baselined at 165 with intake and exhaust so yeah a little more.

r1ceburner · Post by **r1ceburner** » Wed Jun 25, 2003 4:41 pm

So that means that the celica was pushing 223 hp at the flywheel (assuming 14% driveline losses). Not bad for 1.8 liters!

r1ceburner · Post by **r1ceburner** » Fri Jun 27, 2003 4:42 am

Something just occured to me: Is it a good idea to use the big cam life AND turbo boost at the same time? Think of it like this: Excessive torque is what usually kills clutch packs and transmissions. If you are spooling up at 2500 rpm, hitting full boost at 3800-4000 rpm, what happenes when the big cam engages? An almost instant torque spike at 6000 rpm. Add the torque spike caused by the turbo + the increased torque by the high-life cam.... you have a transmission with its' days numbered. Just my $0.02.

satur9 · Post by **satur9** » Fri Jun 27, 2003 5:34 am

scc's turbo xrs didnt really spike. it steadily rose although more power was made after 6,000 rpm but thats true of almost any turbo.max power gain of 75hp acurred at 7,400 rpm.blitz supercharger on the other hand goes to low boost at lift.any good boost controller should allow you to turn it down at lift if you want

r1ceburner · Post by **r1ceburner** » Fri Jun 27, 2003 2:56 pm

That's true. You know, I just read that article recently... I shoulda kept that in mind. I hear what you're saying about the BOV. How does the Blitz S/C "go low boost" at lift? How does it know that you've gone into lift?

r1ceburner · Post by **r1ceburner** » Fri Jun 27, 2003 11:12 pm

Well kiddies, I'm not sure if someone has already posted a link to this, but a forum post over at matrixvibe.net has the scoop on the XS engineering Turbo kit for the 2zz-ge engine. Check out the link HERE 250 whp on stock internals is incredible. Although, I'm a little suprised that they did not include a boost gauge with the kit. Cheers.

satur9 · Post by **satur9** » Sat Jun 28, 2003 5:44 am

there is a "electronic clutch" that must switch gears or something from 7psi to 4

Faultline · Post by **Faultline** » Sat Jun 28, 2003 6:18 am

I dont get this ..turn dow the boost at lift thing....??????????why???I have decided that boost at the lower revs is irelavent and not as fun and not that desirabele....imo of course..to each his own...Isnt lift just letting mor air in ...for more power?...and just when you think you have learned how to drive a 2zz car...driveing in "lift" for the most power...now add f/i in the 6k revs + and some sooner of course...but lets make the most power!! Lets multiply wht the engeine is doing right already...not try to offset it w low rev torque....why....???I vote for DR jeckyl and Mr hyde...effect of boosted lift...and then God help us all!!!

r1ceburner · Post by **r1ceburner** » Sat Jun 28, 2003 4:48 pm

I don't quite understand why the Blitz kit would go low boost at lift, unless it has something to do with applying too much air to the engine, possibly causing a super-lean condition. A few holes in the tops of your pistons can really screw your day up!On the other hand, a good reason from running the supercharger below the lift range is to get to 6000 rpm sooner than without boost. Once you're in lift, life is good... let's just try to get there sooner. Still, applying 4psi of boost at lift will still make an incredible difference in the power and torque output.Something else to consider.... How does the supercharger "know" when the engine is in lift? The big cam is controlled by a electronic solenoid, which is controlled by the ECU. So maybe they are taking a feed off of the ECU to catch this logic signal, because I doubt they are mechanically sensing that the big cam is running. What I am getting at is this: Why couldn't you just disable the logic signal that tells the supercharger the big cam is running? Now I'm sure that Blitz designed this feature for a good reason, but in the interest of more power you could probably easily disable it.

Faultline · Post by **Faultline** » Sun Jun 29, 2003 9:32 am

quote:On the other hand, a good reason from running the supercharger below the lift range is to get to 6000 rpm sooner than without boost. Once you're in lift, life is good... let's just try to get there sooner. Still, applying 4psi of boost at lift will still make an incredible difference in the power and torque output.These 2 points are good...getting into boost sooner is something I endeaver, as I am puuling hard usually from 3500rpm to 6500rpm on the 1zz, which makes it my own dr jeckle ,mr hyde..effect...I like being able to short shift, well just befor 3k,and stay out of boost, when I want.......Mike Stafford ,my turbo guy, told me once that engines with wider bores and shorter strokes, are much more prone to detonation...which the 2zz is...+ the super high compression, it is not a good thing...he still may do one, but has been reluctant...Blitz sc kit comes with its own ecu....they can program any thing into it I suppose....if you have an external wastgate w/an electronc boost controler,you could tell it to lower the boost at diferent rev ranges....If I am not mistaken,the David draper kit for tthe 1zz celica, can do this sort of thing , w/ a piggy back sys...not even a complete stand alone...I believe just a small turbo could effect lower boost at the high end...as they flatten out at the high end anyway...xs engineerings turbo kit has a small turbo, and a huge 11"x22" IC core for their 2zz...they also use the power fc for their kit I believe..

r1ceburner · Post by **r1ceburner** » Sun Jun 29, 2003 11:11 pm

True, true. I haven't heard that about short stroke / wide bore being more prone to detonation. I would think that the 11.5:1 compression ratio would be the biggest detonation attractor... But what do I know.. until age 10, I thought girls had thingies just like me.... Yup, the Power FC units seems to get the job done. Although, SCC used a TecII in their project matrix. The only problem with that is that the TecII disabled the VVT and lift... which sort of makes me question of doing that to the 2zz in the first place. Once you've disabled both of those, you're probably make less base power than the 1zz! Do'h!