I Need to Replace My Radiator,Which is The Best Replacement?

[Reaccion]

I was changing a front fog light bulb today on my 2003 Vibe AWD automatic transmission. That was when I noticed that there was a little leak on my radiator. I tried finding an original radiator but the description information does not seem to be clear. I understand that 03-08 Vibe original radiator part number for automatic transmission is 88969096 ($405.40). 03-08 Vibe OEM radiator part number for manual transmission is 88969094 ($247.75).I also noticed that the OEM radiator part number for the 03-08 Matrix with auto tranny is 16400-0D250 ($501.19). I checked online and I noticed that there is a bunch of them. But there is not any specific one which indicates originality except the expensive ones on the dealer. I even checked on the aftermarket fully aluminum 2 row radiator ($128 on eBay) and the DENSO 221-0514 ($58.50 on eBay) one as well. The original radiator directly from the dealer is a little out of my budget. However, I am trying on getting a cheap original or the best (Denso, Toyo, AC Delco…) aftermarket one. My cousin recommended to me not to install the fully aluminum 2 row radiator because it could cause the Vibe to burn more gas. He said that since the 2 row fully aluminum radiator is a little bigger. The Vibe would be trying to reach the original standard temperature all the time causing more fuel burning.... I do not know… Please let me know what you think about all this!

[joatmon]

I am not sure that installing a double radiator would affect the car much, the thermostat is used to control the coolant flow to the radiator. It will open or close to adjust the flow as needed to keep the coolant at the desired temperature. That's the theory, anyway

However, I'd probably get one that was close to or the same as what came with the car.

If I needed a radiator I might first check with a junkyard to find an OEM part at a price I could afford, but then again, I am always looking for an excuse to go to a junkyard. Other than that, I'd probably buy one from ebay, taking my best guess at which one might be close to OEM (and one that comes with a warranty)

[Reaccion]

I am not sure that installing a double radiator would affect the car much, the thermostat is used to control the coolant flow to the radiator. It will open or close to adjust the flow as needed to keep the coolant at the desired temperature. That's the theory, anyway

However, I'd probably get one that was close to or the same as what came with the car.

If I needed a radiator I might first check with a junkyard to find an OEM part at a price I could afford, but then again, I am always looking for an excuse to go to a junkyard. Other than that, I'd probably buy one from ebay, taking my best guess at which one might be close to OEM (and one that comes with a warranty)

Great Joatmon. Thank you for the piece of advice. I am going for the DENSO 221-0514 ($58.50 on eBay). Denso makes radiators for Honda. I think that is a good choice. I will keep you updated!

[Reaccion]

I got my radiator in the mail today. I can not wait to put it on already.

IMG-20130701-00265.jpg (76.28 KiB) Viewed 5049 times

[triz]

Grab a bottle of Amsoil coolant boost to add to your system.

[Reaccion]

Grab a bottle of Amsoil coolant boost to add to your system.

Nice! Thanks for the piece of advice!


The Denso radiator is installed and properly working. I had to use my old radiator cap and the two rubber supports which go under the radiator to hold it.

[TerribleTim]

Reaccion-
You sure asked the right question. The Denso is a double row for sure?? I used to replace the oem radiators in my Hondas with all metal (metal tanks), but can't find them for the wife's Vibe. I replaced her radiator with a cheap Autozone (need to look up make) during a valve job, along with new water pump, tstat, cap, belt, drain/flush and new 50-50 Dexcool.

I'm in Phoenix where it regularly hits 115F. Plastic tanks don't last long here. I did a valve job / head gasket replacement on this Vibe last Feb and it ran great per the wife around town. We took it on a road trip to Reno a week ago. As soon as I hit the first grade leaving Phx, the temp gage started to climb. I have never seen it budge before now with the oem radiator in, on the highway or stop-go rush hour traffic, no matter how high the outside temp.

The temp gage starts to climb now when its above 90F and I climb a hill, especially if it kicks down out of od to 3rd gear. It will even start to overheat on a flat road at 105F if I'm cruising between 80-85mph or higher. This definitely won't cut it at all on the highway at 115F and I'm pi$$ed that Autozone sold something like this in Phoenix.

I'm fairly certain its the radiator, which I suspect is undersized because the system only took about 5.5qts of coolant instead of the spec 6.9qts. Also, I think there's a separate temp sender for the dash gage and the ecu on this motor and I was running with an obd scanner and the temps correlated, so thats not the problem.

So I'm looking for a good quality not $400 not oem radiator. Most boneyard cars I see got hit in front so the radiators are shot. When I was shopping for this radiator I found it hard to find any specs either online or in stores. Before I take this back to Autozone, anyone got any suggestions??

If I can get a Denso double row that works as well as the original, I'll jump on it, since I had no trouble with that one. Btw where did you find it on ebay? Tnx

[Reaccion]

Reaccion-
You sure asked the right question. The Denso is a double row for sure?? I used to replace the oem radiators in my Hondas with all metal (metal tanks), but can't find them for the wife's Vibe. I replaced her radiator with a cheap Autozone (need to look up make) during a valve job, along with new water pump, tstat, cap, belt, drain/flush and new 50-50 Dexcool.

I'm in Phoenix where it regularly hits 115F. Plastic tanks don't last long here. I did a valve job / head gasket replacement on this Vibe last Feb and it ran great per the wife around town. We took it on a road trip to Reno a week ago. As soon as I hit the first grade leaving Phx, the temp gage started to climb. I have never seen it budge before now with the oem radiator in, on the highway or stop-go rush hour traffic, no matter how high the outside temp.

The temp gage starts to climb now when its above 90F and I climb a hill, especially if it kicks down out of od to 3rd gear. It will even start to overheat on a flat road at 105F if I'm cruising between 80-85mph or higher. This definitely won't cut it at all on the highway at 115F and I'm pi$$ed that Autozone sold something like this in Phoenix.

I'm fairly certain its the radiator, which I suspect is undersized because the system only took about 5.5qts of coolant instead of the spec 6.9qts. Also, I think there's a separate temp sender for the dash gage and the ecu on this motor and I was running with an obd scanner and the temps correlated, so thats not the problem.

So I'm looking for a good quality not $400 not oem radiator. Most boneyard cars I see got hit in front so the radiators are shot. When I was shopping for this radiator I found it hard to find any specs either online or in stores. Before I take this back to Autozone, anyone got any suggestions??

If I can get a Denso double row that works as well as the original, I'll jump on it, since I had no trouble with that one. Btw where did you find it on ebay? Tnx

Hello there! I actually went for the Denso radiator. It is plastic with OEM specs. Here in New York, the temperature has increased up to 105F (A/C turned on) and so far the radiator is good as long with my Vibe normal temperature. I am very happy with this radiator. Here is the link where I got it on eBay: http://www.ebay.com/itm/DENSO-221-0514- ... 1095wt_930" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; .

I think that any OEM replacement should be just fine unless there is another mechanical issue with your car. But seems you have to deal with high temperatures all the time, you may need to think about the 2rd row fully aluminum radiator (You could also find a cheap one online as well: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Aluminum-Radiat ... 690wt_1121" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;). Again, I am very happy with the Denso radiator. I really trust Denso in anything they make as well as many import makers for their OEM replacements. Plus, I think that the price is unbeatable.

As far as AutoZone, I really do not buy anything there unless is an emergency or I need brake pads (Ceramics are about $40.00 for the front ones with full life warranty). Keep us posted!

[TerribleTim]

Hey!
Thanks for the info. $58 is great for a Denso. I'll probably go for it when I get back home.
I use Autozone on parts where they offer lifetime warranty because I keep my cars forever.
I also have ceramic brakes on the front from them, second free pair. Work OK so far. The Vibe has good brakes which must be all front cause my rears are only half worn original shoes at 135K miles. The water pump is lifetime also.

The main reason I bought the AZone radiator is the lifetime warranty with the plastic tanks. I think I paid $85 plus tax. Radiators and head gaskets blow all the time in Phx summers cause it hits 115-120F. I NEVER would have bought this radiator if I realized it wasn't OEM specs. Like I said, I suspect it has a smaller volume which is causing the car to overheat or run hot at high load and high temp. Don't know what else it could be. The cooling system parts are all new and flushed / clean. Timing is correct. Mpg is great. The tstat holds at the correct temp and warms up quick under regular conditions. I will compare the Autozone waterpump with the stock one again for pulley and impellor size, but they were very close when I put it in.

The all metal (brass) Modine radiators I used on my Hondas had top-bottom tanks instead of side-to-side like this Vibe. Don't think they make these anymore in this type, only plastic. The all aluminum radiators you pointed out on ebay I've used for performance Honda engines without auto trans, but they're kind of overkill for my wife's Vibe.

I think the fix is a quality Denso with the correct oem volume like you got. I just give up the lifetime warranty.

[Reaccion]

Hey!
Thanks for the info. $58 is great for a Denso. I'll probably go for it when I get back home.
I use Autozone on parts where they offer lifetime warranty because I keep my cars forever.
I also have ceramic brakes on the front from them, second free pair. Work OK so far. The Vibe has good brakes which must be all front cause my rears are only half worn original shoes at 135K miles. The water pump is lifetime also.

The main reason I bought the AZone radiator is the lifetime warranty with the plastic tanks. I think I paid $85 plus tax. Radiators and head gaskets blow all the time in Phx summers cause it hits 115-120F. I NEVER would have bought this radiator if I realized it wasn't OEM specs. Like I said, I suspect it has a smaller volume which is causing the car to overheat or run hot at high load and high temp. Don't know what else it could be. The cooling system parts are all new and flushed / clean. Timing is correct. Mpg is great. The tstat holds at the correct temp and warms up quick under regular conditions. I will compare the Autozone waterpump with the stock one again for pulley and impellor size, but they were very close when I put it in.

The all metal (brass) Modine radiators I used on my Hondas had top-bottom tanks instead of side-to-side like this Vibe. Don't think they make these anymore in this type, only plastic. The all aluminum radiators you pointed out on ebay I've used for performance Honda engines without auto trans, but they're kind of overkill for my wife's Vibe.

I think the fix is a quality Denso with the correct oem volume like you got. I just give up the lifetime warranty.

The AutoZone life time warranty is great. However, some people would probably sell their cars before having to change some parts again. As far as the radiator, before you go ahead and change it, double check if there is air in the coolant system and radiator. Air in the line causes the vehicle to overheat. This happens frequently when the coolant system is opened in any way.

I am not sure, but I think that if you return the radiator back to AutoZone, they would give you your money back. You can always tell them that this radiator is not OEM specs so it is making your vehicle to overheat. I hope that you solve your problem like I did. Keep us posted!

[TerribleTim]

I think I could get my money back from Autozone if I had to based on the overheating. I know those guys.

Great point on the air in the system. This block has a small petcock in the back on the driver side to completely drain the system which I used when I cleaned and flushed, so I was concerned about air. Hondas have a vent screw on the top of the tstat housing to 'burp' the system. When I get back to Phx, I will make sure there is no air when it overheats. Otherwise, its a new Denso. Will report back.

[TerribleTim]

Update---
I called a local place that just sells radiators and described the problem. They said it sounds like a bunch of tubes in the radiator are plugged and replace or flush it. Apparently it doesn't take much with these tiny tubes.
I took it back to Autozone last summer and they gave me a new one. It was the same brand, but this one came in a sealed box and had a new cap included, so I suspect the original was a return and maybe got messed with. I did find some crud in it.

This new one solved the problem for a while. I was pulling a trailer a few months ago and the temp needle moved, but not much. Just on a road trip and I noticed its starting to run hot on hills like before. I may take it back to Autozone and exchange it as it seems to be getting plugged.

I'm wondering why the second one plugged? I just did a valve job on this motor 18 mos ago and use a lot of Permatex Black silicone on the timing cover and water pump. Toyota has incredibly high tolerance specs for the bead on this stuff during reassy. I'm wondering if some silicone is on the inside cooling passages and is flaking off and getting into the radiator tubes. I may replace the radiator again but back flush it first to see what comes out. My bad??

[lannvouivre]

Did you use the Toyota coolant? Just curious.

[TerribleTim]

No.
I used Prestone GM Dexcool from the local Autozone.
I think it's called out in the owners manual.
Mixed 50-50 with distilled water.

[trb]

No.
I used Prestone GM Dexcool from the local Autozone.
I think it's called out in the owners manual.
Mixed 50-50 with distilled water.

That is one of the several places where the owners manual is wrong. Vibes all used the Toyota coolant since they were assembled on the same assembly line as Corollas and Tacomas.

Did you do a complete drain & refill? If so, it is probably OK, but I would not run it in my Vibes.

Oh, and that Lifetime Autozone warranty means you will be replacing parts for a lifetime! I've done the water pump on my 87 Mustang at least 5 or 6 times. They start leaking through the weep hole after a few years without fail. And these are supposedly new water pumps! At least I only paid $35 for the first one!

Good luck on it!

[TerribleTim]

Yes. I did a complete flush and drain and reflush when I had the head off for the valve job. There's even a little drain plug in the back on the driver side to completely drain the block.
There was no mixing of different types of coolants here.

Frankly, I didn't even know Toyota had their own coolant.
The manual just calls for a 50-50 mix of clean water and EG antifreeze meeting GM spec 1825. It discusses the need for an additive pkg for aluminum engines. The Prestone cites that same spec. This may be old by now, but I did some research and coolants are color coded according to additives. My Vibe came new with orange-red stuff which is what the Prestone is. Wouldn't be surprised if the Toyota is also, which means its a slightly different formulation of the same base additives. They could be putting in some other stuff on top of the basics.

Ever notice car parts stores have a whole wall of "wonder chemicals" for fixing your car. A few friends buy this stuff regularly and I call them the Liquid Mechanics.

I just went by the old NUMMI car plant in Fremont on a road trip last week. I know Toyota did a lot of Corollas there. Wasn't aware of the Tacoma. Ironically, its now Tesla.

Water pumps and AC compressors are notoriously unreliable rebuilds. Don't know if its bad cores or what. Funny since Cardone does most of the volume rebuilding of car parts for everyone. When I did my valve job, I went for a new OEM Toyota water pump from the dealer even though there was nothing wrong with the original. Learned this lesson, got a tee shirt, too. Also, there's a lot of lifetime Autozone parts that aren't rebuilds, like brake pads / shoes and I believe radiators.

[lannvouivre]

Alternators are also terrible rebuilds, usually. The only good rebuilt alternator that went on the Mazda6 I worked on was one done by Mitsubishi...after 2 or 3 Autozone rebuilds.

[TerribleTim]

Check.
Alternators, too.
That leaves only pwr steering pumps as far as complex rebuilds. Fortunately, they don't fail much, plus new cars use electric assist for fuel economy. The ps fluid (Dexron) on my Vibe was looking pretty dirty and I flushed it, cleaned the reservoir and the fluid still looks dirty??

When the alternator on my Civic went out, I bought a new pair of brushes from Honda and it went for another 150K miles. Must have good bearings.

[Flip-Side]

Denso and koyo both make great radiators for these cars. There is a performance difference in aftermarket radiators, though I used a duralast for a few years without a problem. Also, if the thermostat needs replacing, only use a toyota branded part. The autozone/advanced auto/large chains carry inferior thermostats, way worse flow and reliability...by a lot. Compared side by side the toyota thermostat is nearly twice the length with larger spring.

Molybdenum is what makes toyota sllc coolant so special. It is a lubricant. Pretty much the only area I have found that needs to be kept like a Toyota is the cooling system. Dexcool did not come in the cars from factory.

[TerribleTim]

Good radiators are precious in Phoenix in the summer, especially since everyone started using plastic tanks.
A lot of blown head gaskets around here. Modine used to make an all metal USA lifetime radiator for "Asian" cars.

Tnx for the info on Toyo tstats. I only use OEM tstats and waterpumps. Learned that from Hondas, where the waterpump is more difficult to replace because it runs off the timing belt. Did not realize the aftermkt ones were so poor.

Moly in Toyo coolant. That's good to know. I can probably find some to add in the water pump lube wonder chemical aisle at AZ or OReilly. Otherwise, just dump the Prestone and replace with Toyo. If the Toyo was original, it's orange like the Prestone, so the basic formulation is the same.