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2005 Base 5-speed to 6-speed

Posted: Thu Sep 14, 2017 9:16 am
by DenverVibe
My girlfriends 2005 Vibe Base 5 speed with 165,000 mi. (1zz & C59) has a failed transmission (4th gear grinds/pops out). She inherited this car from her brother about 4-5 years ago. When he first purchased the car, he had a used 5-speed and clutch installed because of similar issues. I think it had about 100K at that time.

On Monday night I purchased a JDM Corolla/Matrix XRS C60 6-Speed imported from Japan, for $900. It has between 50-60K on it and is from a reputable seller. The ad stated that it is for a Corolla/Matrix XRS but does not specify which of the two it is actually from. It will be delivered to the loading dock at my place of work later today, or tomorrow. http://www.ebay.com/itm/253141124450

I have a few questions:

1. Did I make a huge mistake? Will a Japanese spec. 6 speed work with an US spec. base vibe?
Everything I have read leads me to believe I will be fine and it will work the same as if I pulled a 6-speed from a vibe GT or matrix/corolla XRS here in the US. Fingers crossed.

2. New flywheel: What do you guys recommend? It doesn't seem like there are many options for an OEM flywheel for the 1ZZ, or at least that say they fit the vibe. Most of the flywheels I have seen for the base vibe look like they don't have the ring gear attached. I'm not sure if that's just the stock photos? and they really do have a ring gear attached? I don't really want to swap over the ring gear if I don't have to. I've also seen flywheel for the 1ZZ (not the 2zz) Celica, Corolla/Matrix that say they don't fit the vibe. is this true? Can anyone recommend a reasonably priced (<$100 shipped) complete OEM flywheel for a 1ZZ base vibe?

I had planned on getting the current flywheel machined to save a few bucks, but since I'm hoping to get the vibe back on the road within a day or two and plan on doing this on the weekend, I don't know if I will be able to get it machined in time, and I don't want it holding things up.

3. Engine hoist point: Can I just remove the rear hoist point on the engine and move it to the unused hoist point location of the front of the engine? I have seen write ups where this is mentioned, but then it was stated that they used one from a miata in the front? Will I need both points to hoist the engine, or can I just move the rear hoist forward and not get any additional hardware/hook?

I have also ordered a new Exedy clutch kit KTY014, new ARP flywheel bolts, 2 new axle nuts, and I will be picking up both axle seals from Napa. Other than a couple of quarts of MT-90 can anyone think of anything else I possibly need?

I have been doing a lot of research, but as I have learned from other big projects, you can never do enough research. There is always something you miss or is left out of write ups. I will post picture of the C60 when It arrives and I will continue to post questions in this thread. I am excited to get going on this project! I'm planning on starting a week from Saturday Sept. 23rd. so I have a bit of time to continue reading/gathering supplies and parts.

Cheers and thanks in advance!
-Tim

Re: 2005 Base 5-speed to 6-speed

Posted: Thu Sep 14, 2017 9:57 am
by petervivian
Though I don't have any experience in such a project. Thank you for sharing pictures and information.

Re: 2005 Base 5-speed to 6-speed

Posted: Thu Sep 14, 2017 4:22 pm
by jolt
I know nothing about this swap other then what I have see here. I thought I seen that the axle shafts are different in length and that you need shafts for the six speed to fit correctly. Also, what are you doing for a six speed shiftier and cables?

viewtopic.php?f=17&t=46220

It is all the little things that will mess you up on a project like this. That is why pulling stuff like this from a donor car is the way to go. You can get all the little items like the shiftier, shift cables, shift lever arms for the transmission that was working all together as a unit before you take the parts off.

Re: 2005 Base 5-speed to 6-speed

Posted: Thu Sep 14, 2017 4:41 pm
by jayoldschool
I have done this swap. The C60 is a straight bolt in. You reuse everything from your car: shifter, cables, axles. Use your stock flywheel. Mine was in such good shape, I just left it in place, gave it a quick non-directional finish with a Roloc disc, then bolted up the almost new clutch that was included with my used trans. I used Amsoil for the first fill, I'm trying Lucas this time.

The only extra thing you do is to take the speed sensor from your C59 and swap it over to the C60, there's a dummy plug to take out where the sensor goes in.

The swap is easy. Support the engine (top or bottom, I did mine on a lift and supported from the bottom. Disconnect everthing up top. Mounts out, axles out, drain trans, drop trans. Remove clutch. Evaluate flywheel. Do everything backwards. Enjoy your new gear.

Re: 2005 Base 5-speed to 6-speed

Posted: Sat Sep 23, 2017 3:35 pm
by DenverVibe
jayoldschool wrote:I have done this swap. The C60 is a straight bolt in. You reuse everything from your car: shifter, cables, axles. Use your stock flywheel. Mine was in such good shape, I just left it in place, gave it a quick non-directional finish with a Roloc disc, then bolted up the almost new clutch that was included with my used trans. I used Amsoil for the first fill, I'm trying Lucas this time.

The only extra thing you do is to take the speed sensor from your C59 and swap it over to the C60, there's a dummy plug to take out where the sensor goes in.

The swap is easy. Support the engine (top or bottom, I did mine on a lift and supported from the bottom. Disconnect everthing up top. Mounts out, axles out, drain trans, drop trans. Remove clutch. Evaluate flywheel. Do everything backwards. Enjoy your new gear.


Thanks for the reassurance!

Re: 2005 Base 5-speed to 6-speed

Posted: Sat Sep 23, 2017 3:41 pm
by DenverVibe
I got started on the swap earlier today, and everything is going smoothly as of yet. The 6-speed arrived on Monday, and I think I have everything else I need except the fluid. I picked up both axle seals, rear main seal, and a new flywheel from Napa this morning, and I had already received the axle nuts, flywheel bolts, and clutch kit. I cant seem to find Redline MT-90 anywhere locally, I regret not ordering it from amazon with the rest of my order. I may see if I can find a Toyota dealership that is open on Sundays to get fluid from. Any other recommendations?

Re: 2005 Base 5-speed to 6-speed

Posted: Sun Sep 24, 2017 7:10 am
by jayoldschool
See if you have a local Amsoil dealer. Or, try the Lucas I'm trying on this fill. Or, check other dealers for GL4. GM carries it, Honda, Hyundai, probably others.

Re: 2005 Base 5-speed to 6-speed

Posted: Mon Sep 25, 2017 8:45 am
by DenverVibe
Made good progress on the vibe this weekend, but because of rain I was only able to get as far as removing the 5-speed itself, the pressure plate/clutch, and flywheel. I was also able to replace the rear main seal, and both axle seals on the 6 speed.

I also ran in to a couple issues, one being that I snapped one of the shift cables, see attached. The small white tube on the rear cable broke off right where I have the solid red arrow in the photo. I don't think I can repair it since it broke off flush.

Does anyone know where to source a a replacement cable or have a repair recommendation?

Re: 2005 Base 5-speed to 6-speed

Posted: Mon Sep 25, 2017 2:56 pm
by jayoldschool
Pop that spring clip up and off to see what the damage is and to think about possible fixes. It might be obvious when it is in your hand. The clip is one like the brake line clips, it's next to your hollow red arrow.

Re: 2005 Base 5-speed to 6-speed

Posted: Tue Sep 26, 2017 9:16 am
by DenverVibe
Update, the rain continued last night, but I was able to get the new flywheel, clutch, and pressure plate installed on the engine after work. Man, those flywheel bolts really need to be cranked on to get that 90* turn after the 36 ft. lbs. I thought I was going to twist the whole engine block 90*! I am also fairly certain the clutch is not centered. The centering tool in the excedy kit is worthless. Any tips on that?

Also, I think I may have sourced a new unused shifter cable for $30 on craigslist. He is getting the part number tonight so I can verify, but in the picture it looks like the correct cable (rear )from diagrams I've been looking at. Hopefully it will be installed on the vibe by Thursday. Just a bit of a trek to Colo. Springs from Denver. https://cosprings.craigslist.org/pts/d/matrix-vibe-shifter-cable/6246620652.html

Re: 2005 Base 5-speed to 6-speed

Posted: Tue Sep 26, 2017 2:06 pm
by ImUrOBGYN
Glad you're able to still make some progress. I wish I could help but all I have is "good luck". :)

Re: 2005 Base 5-speed to 6-speed

Posted: Fri Sep 29, 2017 11:40 am
by DenverVibe
I am 95%+ done with the swap. I plan on updating this tread with pictures when I get a chance.

I installed the replacement shifter cable last night, and all I can say is what a PITA!! It took me over 3 hours to complete the installation. I spent about 2 of those hours messing with the grommet where the shift cables enter the cabin. Whoever designed it needs to be taken out back to the woodshed! My advice, is to NOT BREAK a shifter cable in the first place!

I also picked up 608Z skate bearings to use in place of the stock rubber bushings on the shifter ends. They are a direct fit, and should firm up the shifting.

I was able to find MT-90 locally and picked up 3 quarts.

All I need to do is reattach the battery bracket/tray, reinstall the air filter housing, put the wheels back on, then fill her up with 2.3 quarts of MT 90, and DRIVE!

Re: 2005 Base 5-speed to 6-speed

Posted: Fri Sep 29, 2017 1:24 pm
by jayoldschool
You swapped over the speedo gear housing, right?

Re: 2005 Base 5-speed to 6-speed

Posted: Fri Sep 29, 2017 1:37 pm
by DenverVibe
Yes, I took out the plug in the C60 and installed the C59's speedo gear in its place.

Re: 2005 Base 5-speed to 6-speed

Posted: Fri Sep 29, 2017 3:33 pm
by jayoldschool
Good work! You're almost done.

One more thing. On your next tire change, up your size by one to 205 60 16 (from 55 series). This will bring your highway revs back down a bit, and should put your speedo right on the money. It did for me. The 60s just look better as well (and improve the ride quality).

Those are 2015 Corolla wheels (IIRC)

Image

Re: 2005 Base 5-speed to 6-speed

Posted: Sat Sep 30, 2017 9:52 am
by petervivian
jayoldschool wrote:Good work! You're almost done.


Those corolla wheels look so good on the vibe.

Re: 2005 Base 5-speed to 6-speed

Posted: Mon Oct 02, 2017 1:25 pm
by DenverVibe
Alright, so I am officially done with the swap! We took the Vibe up to Boulder (~60 mile round trip) for the day on Saturday, and the 6-speed shifted and drove perfectly. The only complaint we have is that the clutch pedal needs to be depressed pretty far down. Not a huge deal, and its exactly the same as it was before the swap, but I'm hoping there is an adjustment I can do to it.

After I got everything installed back in the engine bay I ran in to some starting issues. It initially started no problem first try, but since I had been messing with the shift cable/shifter I had it in gear, not neutral, and it died when I let up on the clutch. I went to start it again, and nothing. Not even clicking/cranking. I was stumped for a while, but after tapping on the starter with the handle of a hammer it started! But would only start when tapped, bad solenoid. Swapped it out with a parts store reman unit, and all is well now! It had the OEM Denso starter, no doubt the original, so not a huge surprise, but still frustrating at the time.


I have a bunch of pictures, but they are too large to upload. When I have more time I will reduce them and upload them to this thread.

A huge thanks to everyone who helped me on this project!

Cheers!

Re: 2005 Base 5-speed to 6-speed

Posted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 1:15 pm
by ImUrOBGYN
Flippin' sweet, man. Glad you got it all done. Always a good feeling and it looks good for the lady. ;)

Re: 2005 Base 5-speed to 6-speed

Posted: Wed Nov 08, 2017 10:14 am
by gatewayvibe
I also did this swap but I used a Celica GTS C60 6 speed transmission. I had to buy a Matrix XRS shifter shaft becaues the Celica C60's was in the front.