Newbie trying to pick a Vibe

[Muse]

Hey everyone!

Hope this is kosher -- I'm not a Vibe owner *yet*, but I'm a Missouri-based college grad on the prowl for my first car and it's gonna be a Vibe. I set out looking for an affordable daily driver with a little personality and pep, and all of the research told me it was a Vibe or bust. I'm in the midst of agonizing over what to gun after, so I was hoping some experts might have some opinions on the matter!

I have my eye on two little base automatics with similar options:

2003
147k miles
New engine going in with under 120k miles
Dent in the door
Good condition otherwise
$3k

2005
110k miles
Near-excellent condition
$6k

It turns out film graduates don't make bank their first year out, so I'm wringing my hands over the whole thing. Do I go fewer miles, or do I save a little money and trust a more mature car to go the distance? Is there a double-the-price difference between a 2003 and 2005?

To make things more complicated, an 88k little 2003 base showed up for sale on the drive to work today -- but it's even pricier, probably out of my budget. But an awfully nice car!

Seeing people here hitting 250k and beyond quells my fears a bit -- seems like any well cared for Vibe is a lasting Vibe! Dad's a mechanic, so I know how to look after a car, and I'm a bit too green to drive it like I stole it. Still, I'd like my Vibe to last me *at least* 3-5 years and to take me to Los Angeles, so I'm trying to be savvy about my purchase.

Thanks for any help ya got, guys. Can't wait to hang around here and, oh yeah, to buy my car!

[trb]

Welcome and good choice looking for a used Vibe. And congrats on the degree. I know film jobs are hard to find; my son has a RTF degree from the University of Texas, and he is looking for a local job currently too. He'd love to be in LA, but he will have to stay at home and hopefully find something here first, then maybe get a job in LA after he has some real time experience. He did a semester internship in LA and loved it, except for the traffic! But at least his Vibe got good gas mileage and made the trip there and back without a problem.

I would not be too worried about a higher mileage Vibe, especially if it has maintenance records. I just bought a 2003 for myself, and at 209K, it runs very well, but it was well maintained by the prior owner. With the 03 you are looking at getting a new motor, do you know why it failed? Was it maintenance related? If so, I might be hesitant if they skimped on maintenance. Next could be a new transmission, radiator, etc. But then again, it is a newer motor going in to it. Is your dad going to look at them?

Either one would probably work OK for you, but is the 05 worth more? If it has good maintenance records, that price is decent for a private party sale and low for a dealer. And the 03 is probably close to an average trade in price, so that is not too bad of a deal. If it broke down, would you have help reparing it?

Good luck on it!

[trb]

Sent you a PM!

[Caretaker]

Muse, here are my musings:
I'll make the assumption that you need to keep the costs low and that a first generation Vibe is about all you can afford. I'll also make the assumption that you are looking for a wagon/hatchback to maximize on value/functionality.

1. miles do not kill the car, age does. Since the first generation Vibe is from 2003-2008, try to do your best to find something closer to the 2008 year.
2. buy from an owner, not from a dealer. Dealers know NOTHING about the cars they sell. Only and owner can look you straight in the eye and tell you about the maintenance/repair history of the vehicle you are thinking of buying. Dealers are nothing more than $3500 markup scheisters.
3. consider a first generation Matrix as well. Since it is the same car (with one glaring difference), you might as well double your chances of finding a good used one. The glaring difference of the Matrix is not the ugliness of the "woman's shoe" design, but the fact that Toyota was at least smart enough to recognize what a POS the GM factory radio was and in the 2005 model year I believe, swapped out the GM radio with a much better Toyota contracted radio.
4. consider adding the Mazda 3 hatchback and the Honda Fit to your search. Excellent reliability for both, with the Fit essentially being a bulletproof car in terms of maintenance/repair record.
5. keep trolling craigslist, car gurus, and cars.com until you find your car. I drove 3 hours to get my Honda Fit. It was well worth it.
6. be very careful with the first generation Vibe/matrix if safety features are important to you. Finding one with anti lock brakes and side impact airbags can be very difficult. I think, badge wise, the only way you can tell if the Matrix has these two features is if the back hatch is marked as an XR or XRS model. I believe those items were at least an option on the XR and XRS. From looking at pictures, if you can see a grey fabric tag on the outside edge of the two front seats, then you'll know the car has side airbags. Either way, make sure you ask the owner if these two features are on the car you are inquiring about.

Best of luck. Questions?

[Nasmfell]

Welcome and Hello:


My 2 cents, try to find a 2008. Much simpler in terms of standard and optional features (No GT and AWD) and should be under 100K miles and in good shape. Also, it should have any bugs worked out. Problem with the 2 you're looking at,the 2003 first year of the Vibe, 2005 first year of the Drive by Wire system, that may be problematic since it was the first year it was used on the Vibe and Matrix, Maybe the GM radio in the 2008 was better as well.

[Muse]

trb:
UT was on my shortlist back in the day -- an awesome school! Like your son, I'm back home to save up a bit and get some real-world, though not industry, experience. Texas (especially Austin) has some great film stuff going on -- some of my friends chose to go there instead of straight to LA. Your son has a great plan!

Re: the 2003, it was reported to me that, basically, the engine overheated and the piston bearings/crankshaft went out. I'm told that doesn't necessarily have to be maintenance-related, but it is a good red flag for taking a close look. My dad will absolutely be checking out any car before money changes hands, so this post is assuming that both are in solid condition. If he gets into the 03 and it's clearly a basket case, I won't be buying. He'll also be able to help me, at least for the next year or two, with any repairs. But the 05's lower mileage and apparent clean record is a little less stressful. If it's a good price and it seems more prepped to keep me going, it's looking appealing.

ETA: I can't reply to your PM yet, but thank you! Once I figure out how to go about that, I'll get in touch ASAP.

Caretaker:
Your assumptions are correct across the board.

1) This was my inclination with picking up an 05. I think an 05, *maybe* an 06, will be the closest I can get. At least in my area. Aside from age, is there going to be a ton of variation between these vehicles?
2) Both cars are private parties, no dealers. All of the dealers locally are overpriced or clueless, so far (not ruling them out, but I haven't had good experiences locally)
3) Way fewer Matrixes locally, for whatever reason. I have been sweeping for both, for sure, and there's a Matrix *very* similar to the 05 I listed nearby as well. I'd be happy with either -- Toyotas have treated our family well.
4) I love Honda Fits, but they're out of my price range for my area, at least. The Mazda 3 has popped up more than a couple times -- I'll keep a closer eye out! Thanks for the suggestions.
6) I have been a little lax in looking out for safety features. Thank you for giving me the markers for them!

Namsfell:
Thanks for the thoughts! 2008's in my area seem to be a tick out of my price range, but you make a great point about the options and bugs.

[vibrologist]

adding another 2 or 3 cents:

If the 03 is checking out o.k. mechanically, you have quite some negotiating power. The cosmetic issues may not be discounted enough.

I bought an '05 in April. It has the drive by wire throttle. I find the throttle response from standing still a bit to jumpy but I got used to it. I also received a postcard for a recall related to the PCM. Therefore: no matter which model you buy have a GM service check if all the recalls have been taken care of.

I love Mazda's and I am active on the Mazda forum. 2 things about the 3: they can develop rust, but if you live in TX that will be no issue. I also read that the air conditioning in the Mazda 3 sucks and if you live in TX that will be an issue. This is not to guide you away from this idea but for you to take in consideration when you take a test drive. I bet the Mazda will feel like a glove that fits. The Vibe does have some ergonomic issues where the distance to the steering wheel and the pedals make it very difficult to find a comfortable adjustment of the seat.

All the best for your career and for your search of a set of wheels!

[justinodnnll]

Well look.

This is my first interaction on GenVibe after lurking for a long while, but I must weigh in.

I have a 2003 Vibe GT- It's my first car. I bought it a year ago for $3,000 with 120k miles.

I love, love, love this car. It's needed new calipers and such, but it hasn't given me a single real problem and I just hit 150k. I do a lot of driving.

I got my car because my dad got an '04 Vibe, brand new, and got 240k out of it before trading it in (and getting $2k because of how mechanically perfect it was.) That car never needed a thing.

Just my thoughts- the '03 is not a bad choice at all.

[vibrologist]

Welcome to the forum, lurker!

[09vGT]

Welcome to the forum fellow Missourian and grad student! I'm not a film student, but I feel your pain. Education = $$$.

[Caretaker]

Muse: During my searches for an old lady in need of car buying help, I found a 2009 Matrix (second generation) for $8800 on a quick sale. People will post some good prices from time to time as they get transferred out of the country or are moving elsewhere or retiring. The current problem is that individual sellers are still pricing their cars based on what they see on cars.com and other sites where dealers are artificially adding $3500 on to every used car they acquire. Individuals see these prices and think that the numbers are what they should be charging. So the entire used car market has been overpriced for the past 5+ years as dealers now make their money on used cars vice new cars. Only when an individual seller actually takes their car to a dealer or CarMax to sell it, do they find out the reality of what their car will bring in. The second problem is that even when an individual seller prices the car correctly, you need to have light speed to buy the car before the vulture dealers swoop in and grab it. This is what happened to me down in Richmond. They guy had two vultures coming an hour after I called the owner. Using personal charm and developing a personal bond with the owner over the phone, I was able to convince the owner that he would rather sell his car to a nice family and not to a money grubbing dealer who was going to make $4000 off of his car in one week. I bought my Fit sight unseen over the phone and beat the dealers to it. It takes a lot of work to get a good value once a car has been posted on the internet. Since dealers only make profit on used cars and performing unnecessary maintenance, they have a fleet of zombies trolling the web every minute of the day to get to these "for sale by owner" vehicles before you do. It takes a lot of time and patience to beat them at their game. Here's hoping you do so.
As for the cars you are looking at, if you are doing mostly city driving, the first generation Fit (2007/8) would easily fit into your budget. I have the first generation Fit that I bought for $6500 for a college bound. I helped my elder female friend get a second generation Fit (sport) for $8800. Although I am a bit too tall for the Fit and drive my Vibe each day, both generations of the Fit, while different in design, are bulletproof vehicles. It is very hard to break them. If you are going to be doing a lot of highway driving, then I would suggest looking elsewhere. The Fit is not as comfortable as the Vibe for long haul driving. However, if the Fit is on your radar screen, keep in mind that there will be a huge increase in used ones available as Fit owners trade their current model in for the 2015. Anyone who is in the market for a Fit should be able to find one for sale by owner after the owner gets turned off by the lowball offer at the dealer's trade in desk.

[Nasmfell]

trb:
UT was on my shortlist back in the day -- an awesome school! Like your son, I'm back home to save up a bit and get some real-world, though not industry, experience. Texas (especially Austin) has some great film stuff going on -- some of my friends chose to go there instead of straight to LA. Your son has a great plan!

Re: the 2003, it was reported to me that, basically, the engine overheated and the piston bearings/crankshaft went out. I'm told that doesn't necessarily have to be maintenance-related, but it is a good red flag for taking a close look. My dad will absolutely be checking out any car before money changes hands, so this post is assuming that both are in solid condition. If he gets into the 03 and it's clearly a basket case, I won't be buying. He'll also be able to help me, at least for the next year or two, with any repairs. But the 05's lower mileage and apparent clean record is a little less stressful. If it's a good price and it seems more prepped to keep me going, it's looking appealing.

ETA: I can't reply to your PM yet, but thank you! Once I figure out how to go about that, I'll get in touch ASAP.

Caretaker:
Your assumptions are correct across the board.

1) This was my inclination with picking up an 05. I think an 05, *maybe* an 06, will be the closest I can get. At least in my area. Aside from age, is there going to be a ton of variation between these vehicles?
2) Both cars are private parties, no dealers. All of the dealers locally are overpriced or clueless, so far (not ruling them out, but I haven't had good experiences locally)
3) Way fewer Matrixes locally, for whatever reason. I have been sweeping for both, for sure, and there's a Matrix *very* similar to the 05 I listed nearby as well. I'd be happy with either -- Toyotas have treated our family well.
4) I love Honda Fits, but they're out of my price range for my area, at least. The Mazda 3 has popped up more than a couple times -- I'll keep a closer eye out! Thanks for the suggestions.
6) I have been a little lax in looking out for safety features. Thank you for giving me the markers for them!

Namsfell:
Thanks for the thoughts! 2008's in my area seem to be a tick out of my price range, but you make a great point about the options and bugs.

You're welcome. Good luck in your search

[Nasmfell]

adding another 2 or 3 cents:

If the 03 is checking out o.k. mechanically, you have quite some negotiating power. The cosmetic issues may not be discounted enough.

I bought an '05 in April. It has the drive by wire throttle. I find the throttle response from standing still a bit to jumpy but I got used to it. I also received a postcard for a recall related to the PCM. Therefore: no matter which model you buy have a GM service check if all the recalls have been taken care of.

I love Mazda's and I am active on the Mazda forum. 2 things about the 3: they can develop rust, but if you live in TX that will be no issue. I also read that the air conditioning in the Mazda 3 sucks and if you live in TX that will be an issue. This is not to guide you away from this idea but for you to take in consideration when you take a test drive. I bet the Mazda will feel like a glove that fits. The Vibe does have some ergonomic issues where the distance to the steering wheel and the pedals make it very difficult to find a comfortable adjustment of the seat.

All the best for your career and for your search of a set of wheels!

..You think the Mazda3 will be better in this case for the OP?

[vibrologist]

..You think the Mazda3 will be better in this case for the OP?

I don't know the OP well enough to say that. The Mazdas I drove were real driver's cars on a budget: '86 232 hatch, '98 Protege (I owned both, my son drives the Protege now) and a Mazda6i that I took for a short test ride. All of them had manual transmissions. You give up a little bit (not much!) in reliability and utility for that joy of driving.

The OP gives the impression that the Vibe is for him. He did some research. I don't know if this included test drives. I think test drives are needed in the selection process.
I did not test drive the Vibe long enough. I dislike the driver's position in the Vibe so much that I admit of having made a mistake. I bought it for the practicality and knowing most rides will be short. The ride is harsh too to my old bones. I can live with it and I really like the Vibe in every other regard. I would have loved finding a Mazda 6 station wagon. But they are very hard to come by. If I do find one the vibe will stay with the family and another vehicle will go.

You need to buy the Vibe for the right reasons: utility, versatility, economy, reliability, ease of parking and good looks. Forget about comfort and be happy with good (not excellent) driving dynamics.

[trb]

The OP gives the impression that the Vibe is for him. He did some research.

I found out Muse is a young lady. I'm running Carfax reports for her. Sounds like she has done a good bit of research.

On the 03, since the motor replacement is due to overheating, that might be better than if it blew from an oil issue due to a lack of maintenance. Water leaks / overheating is more like a quick unexpected problem, so maybe it was maintained better. But seeing as it is on it's 4th owner, and it looks like they had it in for service a lot, driving 18K miles in 9 months. So I doubt they will know much if anything about the history prior to that.

[Nasmfell]

..You think the Mazda3 will be better in this case for the OP?

I don't know the OP well enough to say that. The Mazdas I drove were real driver's cars on a budget: '86 232 hatch, '98 Protege (I owned both, my son drives the Protege now) and a Mazda6i that I took for a short test ride. All of them had manual transmissions. You give up a little bit (not much!) in reliability and utility for that joy of driving.

The OP gives the impression that the Vibe is for him. He did some research. I don't know if this included test drives. I think test drives are needed in the selection process.
I did not test drive the Vibe long enough. I dislike the driver's position in the Vibe so much that I admit of having made a mistake. I bought it for the practicality and knowing most rides will be short. The ride is harsh too to my old bones. I can live with it and I really like the Vibe in every other regard. I would have loved finding a Mazda 6 station wagon. But they are very hard to come by. If I do find one the vibe will stay with the family and another vehicle will go.

You need to buy the Vibe for the right reasons: utility, versatility, economy, reliability, ease of parking and good looks. Forget about comfort and be happy with good (not excellent) driving dynamics.

I see, but comfort is very important as well. You never know being out and about, an accident that ties up traffic for hours would mean that you're in the car longer than usual. This may have been somewhat remedied in the 2008 model year,hence why the suggestion, Muse see if she can find and afford one of those.

[vibrologist]

Muse:

I found out Muse is a young lady.

I am having a red face.

[Muse]

The OP gives the impression that the Vibe is for him. He did some research. I don't know if this included test drives. I think test drives are needed in the selection process.
I did not test drive the Vibe long enough. I dislike the driver's position in the Vibe so much that I admit of having made a mistake. I bought it for the practicality and knowing most rides will be short. The ride is harsh too to my old bones. I can live with it and I really like the Vibe in every other regard. I would have loved finding a Mazda 6 station wagon. But they are very hard to come by. If I do find one the vibe will stay with the family and another vehicle will go.

You need to buy the Vibe for the right reasons: utility, versatility, economy, reliability, ease of parking and good looks. Forget about comfort and be happy with good (not excellent) driving dynamics.

I actually took an '03 Vibe out for a short test drive last weekend for this exact reason. The vehicle itself reeked of cat and was hail damaged but mechanically fine -- I enjoyed the way it handled and the general layout. I made the mistake of leaving the lot practically on top of the pedals, but once I adjusted I was much happier. However, you're right that finding the right position is huge, and it's the one thing I wasn't digging 100%. However, most of my driving experience has been in one car, my mom's well-cared for 2007 V6 Rav4, so I'm used to gobs of space and fairly sharp handling. I will absolutely be test driving anything I buy, and using that as a "second pass" on the Vibe's ergonomics when I start from the right position.

The reason I cut my Mazda hunt short earlier was because of rust complaints, since I'm in Missouri and the lord hath no fury like humidity and snow. In retrospect, this is probably a minor quibble since I'll be moving away in the next year or two, so I have poked around for some of these. Nothing has come around yet, but I'd probably be up for trying out some other cars, even if my heart goes 'pitter pat' when I see a Vibe (which happened three times in a ten minute span yesterday -- a sign, surely! )

And no problem re: my status as a lady. I'm quite covert under my fancy gender-neutral username!

TRB has been *AWESOME* about helping with these Carfax reports. The 03 looks like it was a less-dire overheating problem, and it was decent-to-sporadically maintained through most of its life. This 4th owner did seem to take pretty good care of the vehicle, but I'm going to be pretty eagle-eyed about the car, because it has gone through quite a bit of activity!

Gonna go check out the 2005 and maybe get a peek at the 2003 this weekend. I will report back! Thank you everyone for your help. =)

[vibenvy]

Welcome to GenVibe! It's always nice to see another female member join ! I look forward to seeing what Vibe you end up with. Good luck with the search and be sure to keep us updated !

[tpollauf]

Welcome to GenVibe Muse If your sign in name is any indication of your musical taste then you're one awesome young lady . As I've noted a few times here over the years "the daughter I never had" Anyways my 20 year old son loves his 2009 Vibe GT and like you, needed something versatile & reliable. I'm sure you'll find the perfect "starter" Vibe to get you around. Keep us posted!